Jack Hobbs vs Sachin Tendulkar

[kyear2]

To be clear, all 4 are worthy of being best after Bradman, and as far as I'm concerned practically equal, I just use the bowling faced as somewhat as a differentiator.

Literally the best bar The Don

 

[subshakerz]

To be clear, all 4 are worthy of being best after Bradman, and as far as I'm concerned practically equal, I just use the bowling faced as somewhat as a differentiator.

Literally the best bar The Don

Then they are not practically equal.

What is better to say is each have different but legitimate claims to being best after Bradman, and it is hard to determine which claim has most merit.

 

[subshakerz]

Claims for each:

Tendulkar: Worldclass longevity, all-round stat perfection, perfect technique

Hobbs: Most condition and time tested, no real weaknesses

Sobers: Genius bat, 10 years of absolute dominance

Viv: Greatest batting peak, revolutionary batting style and fear factor, dominated the greatest pacers

 

[ankitj]

Then they are not practically equal.

What is better to say is each have different but legitimate claims to being best after Bradman, and it is hard to determine which claim has most merit.

Thanks for splitting the hair right down the middle.

 

[HouHsiaoHsien]

Changing my vote to Sachin. Recently it’s dawned on me even more as to how unique he was. I mean he has a more complete record across a great number of countries than any bat in history and longevity(for both years and number of matches), but this was a guy who was averaging around 54 before turning 25, and as a teen had scored centuries across a range of conditions. He was mightily impressive as a teen, then dominated the 90s, and then had a second peak, where in the twilight of his career he scored centuries against a peak Dale Steyn who was bowling at levels never seen for any bowler in history.

 

[subshakerz]

Changing my vote to Sachin. Recently it’s dawned on me even more as to how unique he was. I mean he has a more complete record across a great number of countries than any bat in history and longevity(for both years and number of matches), but this was a guy who was averaging around 54 before turning 25, and as a teen had scored centuries across a range of conditions. He was mightily impressive as a teen, then dominated the 90s, and then had a second peak, where in the twilight of his career he scored centuries against a peak Dale Steyn who was bowling at levels never seen for any bowler in history.

Yup.

He has a 18 year period from 93 to 2011 of 157 tests where he averages near 60 and over 45 in every country. Amazing.

The ultimate bat manifested.

 

[Thala_0710]

Changing my vote to Sachin. Recently it’s dawned on me even more as to how unique he was. I mean he has a more complete record across a great number of countries than any bat in history and longevity(for both years and number of matches), but this was a guy who was averaging around 54 before turning 25, and as a teen had scored centuries across a range of conditions. He was mightily impressive as a teen, then dominated the 90s, and then had a second peak, where in the twilight of his career he scored centuries against a peak Dale Steyn who was bowling at levels never seen for any bowler in history.

Even if you break his career down statistically in multiple ways, it just enhances the uniqueness and greatness of the man.
Consider it an 18 year stretch from 1993-2011 where Tendulkar plays 157 tests, scores 13607 runs @ 59.41 whilst averaging 45+ in each country (64.11 in AUS, 62.17 in ENG, 55.76 in NZ, 51.6 in SA and 67.94 in SL) whilst scoring 18 hundreds in only these 5 nations. An incredible feak of longevity+greatness with a completeness matched by none in history.
Or you just break his career into 2 halves, first from 1993-2004 (100 tests), where he scores 8794 @61.94, and just this would be good enough to get him into the tier 1 of batsman (probably enough for top 3). If you take the second non peak part, the half with his teenage years, the dip after the tennis elbow and his late career decline he still produces an output of 7127 @46.58 which is still more than good enough for a top 35-40 bat. Statistically, a career twice of many ATVG bats.
And these are only pure stats. For his greatness, there are multiple other points, not going to list them in this already very long post

 

[DrWolverine]

After seeing Kohli’s struggles in test cricket, my respect for Sachin has increased tremendously.

I felt he prolonged his career just to get the record of 200 Tests. At the time of his World Cup win in 2011, his record was extraordinary and unparalleled.

177 Tests. 290 innings.
14692 runs. Average of 56.95
51 centuries.
No holes in his record
A complete batsman

 

[subshakerz]

After seeing Kohli’s struggles in test cricket, my respect for Sachin has increased tremendously.

I felt he prolonged his career just to get the record of 200 Tests. At the time of his World Cup win in 2011, his record was extraordinary and unparalleled.

177 Tests. 290 innings.
14692 runs. Average of 56.95
51 centuries.
No holes in his record
A complete batsman

Perfect technique. Complete dedication to his craft. Great mix of defense and aggression. Any issue he faced, he adapted. No apparent weaknesses.

 

[DrWolverine]

Consider it an 18 year stretch from 1993-2011 where Tendulkar plays 157 tests, scores 13607 runs @ 59.41 whilst averaging 45+ in each country (64.11 in AUS, 62.17 in ENG, 55.76 in NZ, 51.6 in SA and 67.94 in SL) whilst scoring 18 hundreds in only these 5 nations.

Or you just break his career into 2 halves, first from 1993-2004 (100 tests), where he scores 8794 @61.94, and just this would be good enough to get him into the tier 1 of batsman (probably enough for top 3).

If you take the second non peak part, the half with his teenage years, the dip after the tennis elbow and his late career decline he still produces an output of 7127 @46.58 which is still more than good enough for a top 35-40 bat.

First 50 Tests : 49.82
Second 50 Tests: 57.60
Third 50 Tests : 52.73
Fourth 50 Tests : 53.86
Overall : 53.79

Consistency + Longevity

 

[Thala_0710]

As a teenager
From non SENA nations, 4 players have scored a hundred in SENA:
1. Mushtaq Mohammad - 1
2. Umar Akmal - 1
3. AB Barath - 1
4. SR Tendulkar - 4

If we include SENA nations (including home tests) the list grows to:
1. Mushtaq Mohammad - 1
2. Umar Akmal - 1
3. AB Barath - 1
4. KD Walters - 1
5. HG Vivian - 1
6. A Jackson - 1
7. RN Harvey - 2
8. RG Pollock - 2
9. SR Tendulkar - 4

So only 9 people have ever scored a hundred as a teenager in any SENA nation in the history of test cricket, 5 of those were from SENA itself. We have 2 guys from Pak and 1 from WI too who scored a hundred. Tendulkar alone scored 4!

 

[capt_Luffy]

SRT was truly special, very special. But so was Sir John Berry as well. He never faced bowlers as good as Sachin, but he did faced conditions more challenging. On the grand scheme of things, I rate these 2 equal. And with totally due respect to Hutton, Gavaskar, Viv, Smith, Lara and especially Sobers; I think these two stands clear of that crowd as well. All of them are close to these 2, definitely very close. But for me, they stand just taller.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

 

[Johan]

the above seems exhibitory

 

[kyear2]

SRT was truly special, very special. But so was Sir John Berry as well. He never faced bowlers as good as Sachin, but he did faced conditions more challenging. On the grand scheme of things, I rate these 2 equal. And with totally due respect to Hutton, Gavaskar, Viv, Smith, Lara and especially Sobers; I think these two stands clear of that crowd as well. All of them are close to these 2, definitely very close. But for me, they stand just taller.

Well I rate 4 batsmen the best after Bradman

Sachin, Sobers, Viv and Hobbs.

They all have their own arguments and I don't think that any is greater than the other.

I think then there's the slightest of drops to the next group of guys, Smith, Lara and Hutton.

Sachin had his consistency and rock solid technique

But Vivian could do things no other batsman could. He took on the generation of the greatest bowlers and dominated them. He was also very arguable the greatest ever player of fast bowling.

Not trying for a second to make the argument he was better than Sachin, but also not allowing for the argument that anyone bar Bradman stood clear of him either.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Well I rate 4 batsmen the best after Bradman

Sachin, Sobers, Viv and Hobbs.

They all have their own arguments and I don't think that any is greater than the other.

I think then there's the slightest of drops to the next group of guys, Smith, Lara and Hutton.

Sachin had his consistency and rock solid technique

But Vivian could do things no other batsman could. He took on the generation of the greatest bowlers and dominated them. He was also very arguable the greatest ever player of fast bowling.

Not trying for a second to make the argument he was better than Sachin, but also not allowing for the argument that anyone bar Bradman stood clear of him either.

Let's agree to disagree then. As I said, these 2 are clear of the next group of 6 for me. They are close, but there is a gap. There were things Viv can do much better than Sachin, but for the best bar Bradman title, I only have these 2 as real competitors.

 

[DrWolverine]

From 1976 to March 1981, Viv Richards had a glorious peak. Perhaps the greatest peak any batsman had barring Don Bradman.

33 Tests. 50 innings.
3483 runs. Avg of 72.5
12 centuries. 15 fifties. 1 duck.


From Apr 1981 to retirement
78 Tests. 115 innings.
4586 runs. Avg of 42.85
11 centuries. 29 fifties. 7 ducks.

From 1976 to 1988
92 Tests. 135 innings.
7091 runs. Avg of 55.
22 centuries. 34 fifties.

 

[DrWolverine]

I

Let's agree to disagree then. As I said, these 2 are clear of the next group of 6 for me. They are close, but there is a gap. There were things Viv can do much better than Sachin, but for the best bar Bradman title, I only have these 2 as real competitors.

I am not sure about Jack Hobbs.

In Tests, I honestly don’t see any argument for Viv over Sachin. Maybe Viv had a better peak. Sachin’s insane consistency and longevity wins it for me.

 

[Coronis]

From 1976 to March 1981, Viv Richards had a glorious peak. Perhaps the greatest peak any batsman had barring Don Bradman.

33 Tests. 50 innings.
3483 runs. Avg of 72.5
12 centuries. 15 fifties. 1 duck.


From Apr 1981 to retirement
78 Tests. 115 innings.
4586 runs. Avg of 42.85
11 centuries. 29 fifties. 7 ducks.

From 1976 to 1988
92 Tests. 135 innings.
7091 runs. Avg of 55.
22 centuries. 34 fifties.

ok

I


I am not sure about Jack Hobbs.

In Tests, Sachin is ahead of Viv quite easily. Maybe Viv had a slightly better peak but Sachin trumps him over consistency and longevity.

For Hobbs his argument is largely the same as Tendulkar’s.

He dominated in the pre war era, scoring almost 1000 runs more than anyone else since his debut and succeeding in all 3 countries, whilst also having clearly the highest average. He was 31 when he played his last pre-war test and 38 before he played tests once more, continuing excellent form succeeding as one of the leading batsman of the 1920’s until the ripe old age of 47. Finally he retired at the age of 48 after a modest final Ashes, with an enviable record. 54+ against all opposition and 52+ in each country.

He still holds the records for most runs and tons after 40 (2440 @ 58.09 8 tons) and oldest player to score a ton (46) and he’s second for runs and tons in the Ashes (likely to be surpassed in both by Smith next year) and the second fastest batsman to 5000 runs.

 

[HouHsiaoHsien]

Tendulkar and Hobbs’ are the best candidates. It is very tough to argue for Viv over either, tho he is the best after them.