*OFFICIAL* England in Pakistan 2024

[Pothas]

I mean it is completely disingenuous to suggest that winning the toss wasn't a big advantage.

Doesn't mean there are not loads of things England could have done better.

 

[Spark]

Praising a board's tactics is not a spin unless you are desperate for an argument.

The point is that it's not right to claim that England's team is obviously superior just because they're better on roads. Pitches are allowed to do things, and frankly they should.

 

[BazBall21]

The point is that it's not right to claim that England's team is obviously superior just because they're better on roads. Pitches are allowed to do things, and frankly they should.

England are a better overall side

 

[kevinw]

I don't think there was a single wicket in the 20 where England were got out. Wrong shot selections galore.

220/2 to 291 all out is where we lost the game. Even if Pakistan gambled everything on the test.

Agree, parity should have been the minimum there. The middle order just failed.

 

[Spark]

England are a better overall side

Well if Pakistan roll out another slow turner and England play the same way as this week then they pretty obviously won't be in these conditions.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Englands team is better on paper which is a moral victory I guess

 

[BazBall21]

Well if Pakistan roll out another slow turner and England play the same way as this week then they pretty obviously won't be in these conditions.

Hard to say after one game where the toss was big. A spin v spin contest is the most likely area for Pakistan to be better though and the sheer unpredictably of a used wicket was also a good plan.

 

[Spark]

Like I was worried that this pitch was going to do all sorts of weird **** and that batsman would be getting bowled by balls that rolled along the ground but we didn't see anything like that at all. This was just a slow turner, the sort that we used to see all the time, and England's approach with the bat was just completely wrong for the conditions. That's really on them and really calls into question the idea that they just got unlucky and that everything will be right in 'Pindi.

 

[Spark]

Hard to say after one game where the toss was big. A spin v spin contest is the most likely area for Pakistan to be better though and the sheer unpredictably of a used wicket was also a good plan.

I think Pakistan would have won this game anyway even if England had batted first because they actually played the conditions properly and England did not.

 

[BazBall21]

I think Pakistan would have won this game anyway even if England had batted first because they actually played the conditions properly and England did not.

Pakistan batsmen struggled too once it started turning. It was more England's fielding that let them down imo. Can't blame inability to catch on the pitch or the toss.

 

[Molehill]

Dire. Better ways to take an L out there.

Sure, although not sure that playing on the same pitch twice is one of them.

 

[Spark]

Pakistan batsmen struggled too once it started turning. It was more England's fielding that let them down imo. Can't blame inability to catch on the pitch or the toss.

Yeah, they probably would have dropped catches too had they batted first.

 

[mackembhoy]

Like I was worried that this pitch was going to do all sorts of weird **** and that batsman would be getting bowled by balls that rolled along the ground but we didn't see anything like that at all. This was just a slow turner, the sort that we used to see all the time, and England's approach with the bat was just completely wrong for the conditions. That's really on them and really calls into question the idea that they just got unlucky and that everything will be right in 'Pindi.

Our approach will see us win more than we will lose.

But it's clear to see when it becomes difficult to bat/up against high quality bowlers we've not got a clue.

 

[Molehill]

I think Pakistan would have won this game anyway even if England had batted first because they actually played the conditions properly and England did not.

I don't see that. There was one good day for batting, after that only two players passed 40, one of whom was dropped twice in single figures.

No doubt England's fielding let them down badly, but I think Pakistan probably had enough on the board anyway at that point.

I hope we get another slow turner at Rawalpindi, but hopefully as an unused pitch it will stay fair to both teams for longer.

 

[honestbharani]

Great win for Pakistan and the uncles. They took a lot of gambly calls before and during the match and almost everything paid off.

As for England, as I said in the other thread, catches win matches and you lost this one because of the catches you put down. Just like we are doing right now in Bangalore. Bad bowling and batting performances happen but when you are that bad in the field, it has a way of biting you.

 

[BazBall21]

Yeah, they probably would have dropped catches too had they batted first.

I don't think dropped catches would have been so terminal if they batted first. Ultimately that can't be proven or disproven but day 1 was a pretty good deck and it changed after that.

But it's over now. England's fielding and batting were both sub optimal and I don't think anyone is saying they aren't a flawed Test side and blaming the match 100% on the toss would be weak. Ollie Pope would never have had such a long rope for Australia and India, hence England aren't in the same bracket as them.

 

[trundler]

I don't see that. There was one good day for batting, after that only two players passed 40, one of whom was dropped twice in single figures.

No doubt England's fielding let them down badly, but I think Pakistan probably had enough on the board anyway at that point.

I hope we get another slow turner at Rawalpindi, but hopefully as an unused pitch it will stay fair to both teams for longer.

It played like a normal slow turner throughout the game so it being a used pitch is a cop out

 

[Spark]

I don't see that. There was one good day for batting, after that only two players passed 40, one of whom was dropped twice in single figures.

No doubt England's fielding let them down badly, but I think Pakistan probably had enough on the board anyway at that point.

I hope we get another slow turner at Rawalpindi, but hopefully as an unused pitch it will stay fair to both teams for longer.

The main reason I think Pakistan would have won anyway is because I don't think England would have put up 360 with the way they approached this game with the bat. Slow turners are absolutely tailor made to neutralise the way England like to bat.

Like, wasn't everyone complaining on Day 1 about how lucky Pakistan were getting and how easily they could have been shot out for a much lower score?

 

[Molehill]

It played like a normal slow turner throughout the game so it being a used pitch is a cop out

I can only assume you weren't watching on Day 1. There was more in it for the seamers that day, which was why we were questioning the Pakistani bowling set up. But it changed on Day 2 and suddenly started offering more assistance to the spinners.

 

[trundler]

I can only assume you weren't watching on Day 1. There was more in it for the seamers that day, which was why we were questioning the Pakistani bowling set up. But it changed on Day 2 and suddenly started offering more assistance to the spinners.

That's because England's spinners were crap in the first innings.