Ben Stokes vs Kevin Pietersen

[BazBall21]

Clarke had a monster 2012, but I'd take KP over him just if it's overall careers.

Tendulkar, Sanga, Amla, De Villiers, Kallis etc were better than KP in that time frame and better overall. So yeah, not top 3. Frequently a marvellous player but not a frequent enough run machine to be ranked that highly.

 

[BazBall21]

Stokes better in Test and ODI. KP better in T20.

 

[Majestic]

Stokes just keeps failing outside England and South Africa. Very hard to understand why would everyone rate him higher than KP.

He should atleast perform and average well in Australia atleast. He has the skill set to do that but what matters is whether he has done it or not and the answer is he hasn't done it.

 

[BazBall21]

Stokes just keeps failing outside England and South Africa. Very hard to understand why would everyone rate him higher than KP.

He should atleast perform and average well in Australia atleast. He has the skill set to do that but what matters is whether he has done it or not and the answer is he hasn't done it.

He has a better record with the ball than the bat outside England so can't just reduce analysis of his away performances to batting only. I agree that it's closer than the poll result has generally suggested though.

 

[Majestic]

He has a better record with the ball than the bat outside England so can't just reduce analysis of his away performances to batting only. I agree that it's closer than the poll result has generally suggested though.

What has he done with ball outside England?He averages 33.5 outside England with bowl and 32 with bat outside England. Except South Africa and the minnowish WI and BD, he has failed everywhere.

 

[Arachnodouche]

Stokes just keeps failing outside England and South Africa. Very hard to understand why would everyone rate him higher than KP.

He should atleast perform and average well in Australia atleast. He has the skill set to do that but what matters is whether he has done it or not and the answer is he hasn't done it.

Love Stokes, his highs are akin to mainlining adrenaline like no cricketer since Flintoff, but his career as a whole doesn't feel like a steady/consistent enough body of work for it to be rated against someone like KP.

 

[Johan]

Captaincy is another point for Stokes over Pietersen, it's not close, Stokes > Hayden > Kevin

 

[BazBall21]

What has he done with ball outside England?He averages 33.5 outside England with bowl and 32 with bat outside England. Except South Africa and the minnowish WI and BD, he has failed everywhere.

His record with the ball in Asia before he stopped bowling was good. Bangaldesh in 2016 were not minnowish at home. The pitches on the 2022 WI tour were proper roads. He did well with the ball there too considering that. Did well in SL with the ball. Then there's his record with the ball in SAF. Only really Aus/NZ with the ball he's never really done it and his record on the first Aus tour with the ball is decent.

 

[Majestic]

His record with the ball in Asia before he stopped bowling was good. Bangaldesh in 2016 were not minnowish at home. The pitches on the 2022 WI tour were proper roads. He did well with the ball there too considering that. Did well in SL with the ball. Then there's his record with the ball in SAF. Only really Aus/NZ with the ball he's never really done it and his record on the first Aus tour with the ball is decent.

His record is good only in South Africa, Bangladesh and Windies. If we are weighing his bowling performance vs borderline minnows like Bangladesh and Windies( even here the record is just okayish with bat avg of 34 and bowl avg of 33.5) and struggle to mention his performance vs Australia, India, New Zealand, Pakistan/UAE, Sri Lanka then that is hardly a good away performance. Even Pujara has done well in Australia, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh.

He is not any better than Pujara or Warner in Tests as a cricketer and that is a level below Pietersen as a test cricketer. Picking 2 WPM is not a definition of a genuine all rounder. Stokes has only done well as a player in South Africa and yet to perform to a level worthy of mentioning in India, Pakistan/UAE, Australia, Sri Lanka and New Zealand. All these 5 countries that are overall ranked higher than Bangladesh or Windies and he has played a decent sample there.

 

[Majestic]

Love Stokes, his highs are akin to mainlining adrenaline like no cricketer since Flintoff, but his career as a whole doesn't feel like a steady/consistent enough body of work for it to be rated against someone like KP.

Yes, I would rate him a level below KP. KP stood up against the very best, Australian team which had McGrath Warne were invincible almost and he contributed heavily in that Ashes 2005 win).

 

[BazBall21]

His record is good only in South Africa, Bangladesh and Windies. If we are weighing his bowling performance vs borderline minnows like Bangladesh and Windies( even here the record is just okayish with bat avg of 34 and bowl avg of 33.5) and struggle to mention his performance vs Australia, India, New Zealand, Pakistan/UAE, Sri Lanka then that is hardly a good away performance. Even Pujara has done well in Australia, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh.

He is not any better than Pujara or Warner in Tests as a cricketer and that is a level below Pietersen as a test cricketer. Picking 2 WPM is not a definition of a genuine all rounder. Stokes has only done well as a player in South Africa and yet to perform to a level worthy of mentioning in India, Pakistan/UAE, Australia, Sri Lanka and New Zealand. All these 5 countries that are overall ranked higher than Bangladesh or Windies and he has played a decent sample there.

Bangladesh in 2016 had decent batsmen. WI 2022 not so much but those pitches were incredibly flat. Did well in SL too. And outstanding in SAF. KP himself wasn't that consistent overseas and Stokes had a better peak.

 

[Chin Music]

Surely Stokes's debut series was worth a mention when he averaged mid 30s with the bat and low 30s with the ball when everyone else was appalling? 34.8 with the bat, just under 33 with the ball.