Jacques Kallis vs AB de Villiers

[reyrey]

De Villiers was a better bat when he had bats like Kallis doing the hard work ahead of him

Think people forget sometimes that AB was meant to be an opener, but failed in that position so got sent back down to 5.

 

[Coronis]

Think people forget sometimes that AB was meant to be an opener, but failed in that position so got sent back down to 5.

Now we know which AB was really hiding down the order

 

[Bolo.]

Think people forget sometimes that AB was meant to be an opener, but failed in that position so got sent back down to 5.

He wasn't meant to be an opener. He debutted out of position as one, cos that was there was a gap in viable bats. They likely would have left him there if he had been crazy successful, but it wasn't the.intention.

 

[Johan]

AB's wicket keeping vs Kallis's bowling would be closer.

 

[shortpitched713]

AB's wicket keeping vs Kallis's bowling would be closer.

Nah, AB was a wicket keeper in about 1/5 of the Test matches he played in, 24 out of 114. I sometimes put a bit of a flag against people who select him as a WK in something like a draft, because although capable, he really didn't play there much throughout his career, and opened in about as many matches as he kept (and few really consider him much of a Test opener at all).

In contrast, Kallis bowled in the vast majority of matches, even a solid majority of the innings of Tests he played in. Workload wasn't huge, but he was pretty consistent.

 

[reyrey]

He wasn't meant to be an opener. He debutted out of position as one, cos that was there was a gap in viable bats. They likely would have left him there if he had been crazy successful, but it wasn't the.intention.

No, you're wrong. He was an opener. He debuted in domestic first class and one day cricket as an opener, played most his games in those formats as an opener and then debuted for SA Test and ODI teams as an opener.

He kept wicket domestically in T20s and batted down the order. Batting down the order and/or keeping wicket in Tests and ODIs were for a young AB him playing "out of position"

 

[StephenZA]

No, you're wrong. He was an opener. He debuted in domestic first class and one day cricket as an opener, played most his games in those formats as an opener and then debuted for SA Test and ODI teams as an opener.

He kept wicket domestically in T20s and batted down the order. Batting down the order and/or keeping wicket in Tests and ODIs were for a young AB him playing "out of position"

ABdV was never truly considered an opener. If you knew SA cricket you would know that at that period in time SA team struggled for genuine quality in the opening position and talented young batsmen where often put in as an opener in domestic cricket both to ensure maximum exposure but also give them the best chance to get into the SA team. Why do you think Gibbs was used as an opener?

Similar was done with Markram more recently when he first started in domestic cricket. But his hard hands was never really considered suitable for opening position. But he has got stuck there now. You can also look at Breetzke, Rickelton. More middle order players that have been opening often because of these sorts of dynamics with in SA cricket.

 

[Bolo.]

ABdV was never truly considered an opener. If you knew SA cricket you would know that at that period in time SA team struggled for genuine quality in the opening position and talented young batsmen where often put in as an opener in domestic cricket both to ensure maximum exposure but also give them the best chance to get into the SA team. Why do you think Gibbs was used as an opener?

Similar was done with Markram more recently when he first started in domestic cricket. But his hard hands was never really considered suitable for opening position. But he has got stuck there now. You can also look at Breetzke, Rickelton. More middle order players that have been opening often because of these sorts of dynamics with in SA cricket.

I remember CSA saying they wanted AB opening in FC with an eye on the national team. That he opened as early as his FC debut is news to me though.

Markram opening is still a mistake. Would have been a terror around 5, but seriously unsuited to opening, and it's not just the hard hands.

 

[reyrey]

ABdV was never truly considered an opener. If you knew SA cricket you would know that at that period in time SA team struggled for genuine quality in the opening position and talented young batsmen where often put in as an opener in domestic cricket both to ensure maximum exposure but also give them the best chance to get into the SA team. Why do you think Gibbs was used as an opener?

Similar was done with Markram more recently when he first started in domestic cricket. But his hard hands was never really considered suitable for opening position. But he has got stuck there now. You can also look at Breetzke, Rickelton. More middle order players that have been opening often because of these sorts of dynamics with in SA cricket.

Yeah, that's why I said "he was meant to be an opener" as that's the role SA cricket groomed him for, failed and "got sent back down to 5"

Doesn't really matter either way. The point to take out of it is that he failed.