Top allrounders to debut in the 21st century.

[Fuller Pilch]

Will come down to Shakib, Jadeja, Stokes, and Ashwin for the top 4 I imagine.

I'll go:

Shakib
Jadeja
Stokes
Ashwin
Philander
De Grandhomme
Oram
Watson
M. Hafeez
Holder
Axar
Bresnan
Cameron Green
Irfan Pathan
Woakes
DJ Bravo
Moeen
Mitch Marsh
Andrew Hall
Corey Anderson


Raza should be in there too

 

[capt_Luffy]

Let me try:

Jadeja
Shakib
Stokes
Ashwin
Holder
Watson
De Grandhomme
Woakes
Green
Oram
Philander
Axar
Hafeez
Raza
Ali
Pathan
Hall
Marsh
Chase
Symonds

 

[Johan]

is Philander really an all rounder? and if he is why aren't Johnson and Starc too? both faster bats, similar average and more fifties, even a hundred for Johnson.

all three are specialist bowlers who can bat a little tho imo.

 

[capt_Luffy]

is Philander really an all rounder? and if he is why aren't Johnson and Starc too? both faster bats, similar average and more fifties, even a hundred for Johnson.

all three are specialist bowlers who can bat a little tho imo.

My cutoff is generally atleast an average of 25 (though many many exceptions exists). Philander is very close to that, the other two aren't (especially Starc is a big stretch).

 

[Johan]

My cutoff is generally atleast an average of 25 (though many many exceptions exists). Philander is very close to that, the other two aren't (especially Starc is a big stretch).

Philander only averages 2 more than Johnson, their RPI is the exact same, Johnson had more gears, also more fifties, an actual tons, multiple of his scores are higher than Philander's career best of 74, Johnson has superior home record and Philander away record.

imo there is not enough to justify labeling one as a pacer and one as an all rounder.

Also I think Starcc was averaging 23 but looks like he fell off in last couple years completely, fair to DQ him

 

[capt_Luffy]

Philander only averages 2 more than Johnson, their RPI is the exact same, Johnson had more gears, also more fifties, an actual tons, multiple of his scores are higher than Philander's career best of 74, Johnson has superior home record and Philander away record.

imo there is not enough to justify labeling one as a pacer and one as an all rounder.

Also I think Starcc was averaging 23 but looks like he fell off in last couple years completely, fair to DQ him

Yeah, Johnson probably qualifies as borderline and really don't think there is much between the two's batting, though I will have Philander slightly ahead as he was more dependable.

 

[Kenneth Viljoen]

I think Kyle Mayers and Glen Phillips should get a mention

 

[Kenneth Viljoen]

A 21st century all rounder XI with a test keeper who took a test wicket ?

1.Shane Watson
2.Mohammad Hafeez
3.Ben Stokes (C)
4.Shakib Al Hasan
5.Cameron Green
6.AB De Villiers (WK)
7.Ravindra Jadeja
8.Jason Holder
9.Ravi Ashwin
10.Chris Woakes
11.Vernon Philander

 

[Thala_0710]

This would be mine:
1.Jadeja
2.Shakib
3.Stokes
4.Ashwin
5.Philander
6.Holder
7.De Grandhomme
8.Oram
9.Watson
10.Green
11.Axar
12.Mayers
13.Woakes
14.Pathan
15.Johnson
16.Bhuvneshwar
17.Bresnan
18.Ali
19.Bravo
20.Hall

Philander, Johnson, Bhuvneshwar and Bresnan were all borderline cases (on batting prowess) but I felt if I'm going to include one, I have to include all the others as well. Each one satisfied my personal 20+ avg and 25+ RPM criteria

 

[sayon basak]

1. Jadeja
2. Shakib
3. Stokes
4. Ashwin
rest don't matter
Not sure if I'm going to count WK bats as ARs.

 

[Johan]

why are Shakib and Stokes being rated ahead of Ashwin? pretty big bowling margin.

 

[Johan]

A 21st century all rounder XI with a test keeper who took a test wicket ?

1.Shane Watson
2.Mohammad Hafeez
3.Ben Stokes (C)
4.Shakib Al Hasan
5.Cameron Green
6.AB De Villiers (WK)
7.Ravindra Jadeja
8.Jason Holder
9.Ravi Ashwin
10.Chris Woakes
11.Vernon Philander

This team is so cooked outside home.

 

[Thala_0710]

why are Shakib and Stokes being rated ahead of Ashwin? pretty big bowling margin.

Pretty big batting diffrence as well. Ashwin avgs 50 against WI and 40 against BAN, remove that and his batting average would fall off a cliff. Even without removing them, both Shakib and Stokes have a higher net avg (Batting average-Bowling average) than Ashwin. Ashwin also gets dropped quite a lot from the team outside the SC, mainly due to the presence of Jadeja, but also due to his reduced effectiveness.

 

[sayon basak]

why are Shakib and Stokes being rated ahead of Ashwin? pretty big bowling margin.

While talking about All rounders, balance should be valued over having an ATG main discipline only. So shakib and stokes are rightly rated above ash. If considered only as cricketers, Ashwin is even above jadeja imo.

 

[Prince EWS]

is Philander really an all rounder? and if he is why aren't Johnson and Starc too? both faster bats, similar average and more fifties, even a hundred for Johnson.

all three are specialist bowlers who can bat a little tho imo.

Philander batted seven a lot more. He was effectively selected as an all rounder even if his batting output wasn't justifying it that much.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Jadeja stokes shakib and holder

 

[sayon basak]

Jadeja stokes shakib and holder

Holder over Ashwin?

 

[govinda indian fan]

Holder over Ashwin?

Yes think ashwin underachived with bat

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Jadeja stokes shakib and holder

Holder is a terrible bowler though

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Forgot about Mayers. Superb stats. Hopefully he can go back to tests and do well.

Jansen averages 30 with the bat in ODIs, so if his test batting improves and he plays enough tests he'll be a quality allrounder.

It will be interesting to see how Phillips and Ravindra go with bat and ball in the next 2-3 months. A lot of CWers are also interested to see how Nathan Smith goes if he gets a chance.