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Asia Xi vs ROW Xi

Who wins

  • Asia Xi

  • ROW Xi


Results are only viewable after voting.

capt_Luffy

International Captain
And how good is Ashwin outside of Asia, plus most of the ATG SC teams I saw in the other forum had Jadeja instead of Ashwin as is the case for India in most cases.

Barry is considerable better than Dravid, and comparable to Sunny, but not going to get into that argument.

And why wouldn't Sobers count? He played in the 70's, played vs Sunny and his most iconic innings was in the 70's.

But if you want to break down

Richards and Smith / Greenidge is at least on par with Gavaskar and Sehwag / Anwar

Richards
Lara
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist

Isn't better than...

Dravid
Tendulkar
Miandad / Younis
Sangakkara
Imran

Seriously?

Why would we ignore catching? Clear advantage for the ROW for catching and fielding.

With regards to bowling, the ROW has the 3 greatest and best bolwers ever, with at least the guy tied as the best spinner ever. And didn't know depth, made up for quality.

I'm not saying it's a 5-0 series, but one team is better than the other.
Richards and Greenidge is worse than Gavaskar and Sehwag pretty clearly to me and the Middle orders also looks pretty even. I didn't want to get in that catching debate, won't still. And I am not saying Asia will win SENA but really can't see them losing in Asia.
 

kyear2

International Coach
Richards and Greenidge is worse than Gavaskar and Sehwag pretty clearly to me and the Middle orders also looks pretty even. I didn't want to get in that catching debate, won't still. And I am not saying Asia will win SENA but really can't see them losing in Asia.

Barry is at least as good as Sunny. Greenidge was better than Sehwag.

Richards tiers above Dravid
Tendulkar a hair between him and Lara, but ahead of him in the same tier.
Smith is levels above Miandad or Younis
Sobers at least a tier above Sangakarra
Gilchrist isn't in the same area code of Imran

How is this pretty much even? Please let's go through them position by position for me...

If Younis plays then catching is comparable, otherwise no.

ROW is ahead in fast bowling and spin is only an advantage for SC in India.


So??
 

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Barry is at least as good as Sunny. Greenidge was better than Sehwag.

Richards tiers above Dravid
Tendulkar a hair between him and Lara, but ahead of him in the same tier.
Smith is levels above Miandad or Younis
Sobers at least a tier above Sangakarra
Gilchrist isn't in the same area code of Imran

How is this pretty much even? Please let's go through them position by position for me...

If Younis plays then catching is comparable, otherwise no.

ROW is ahead in fast bowling and spin is only an advantage for SC in India.


So??
Barry is not as good as Sunny, not close for me. Haven't done nearly enough. You found yourself a strange hill to die on in your quest for a Great opener with a high SR, but please don't twist logic in such ways. Greenidge is better than Sehwag, clear on that. I believe 70s means debut post 1970, so see ya Sobers.

Now, RoW is definitely much stronger SENAW but in Asia the reverse is true. Gavaskar, Sehwag, Sachin, Younis, Sanga, Dravid are clearly ahead of Barry, Greenidge, Viv, Smith, Lara and Kallis in Asia. Only Smith among them and Lara in SL have claims to be comparable to the first 5. Then, on bowling, Murali in SL, Ashwin in India and Imran in Pakistan are better at home than any bowler to ever tour there. Murali and Ashwin with Wasim, Imran and Waqar as support will be enough for India and SL, while those Pakistan bowlers can handle in Pakistan. So yeah, In Asia I don't see ROW winning, as I don't see Asia winning in SENAW.
 

kyear2

International Coach
Barry is not as good as Sunny, not close for me. Haven't done nearly enough. You found yourself a strange hill to die on in your quest for a Great opener with a high SR, but please don't twist logic in such ways. Greenidge is better than Sehwag, clear on that. I believe 70s means debut post 1970, so see ya Sobers.

Now, RoW is definitely much stronger SENAW but in Asia the reverse is true. Gavaskar, Sehwag, Sachin, Younis, Sanga, Dravid are clearly ahead of Barry, Greenidge, Viv, Smith, Lara and Kallis in Asia. Only Smith among them and Lara in SL have claims to be comparable to the first 5. Then, on bowling, Murali in SL, Ashwin in India and Imran in Pakistan are better at home than any bowler to ever tour there. Murali and Ashwin with Wasim, Imran and Waqar as support will be enough for India and SL, while those Pakistan bowlers can handle in Pakistan. So yeah, In Asia I don't see ROW winning, as I don't see Asia winning in SENAW.
Yes, but that's just you. All peer review from the 70's had Barry ahead, they both made Cricinfo's 2nd team.
There's a thread here where bowlers and other from the era rated who they thought was the best they bowled to, even Lillee said the best 3 he bowled to were Sobers and the Richards.

And 70's doesn't mean debuted post 70's as much as you would want it to mean that. He played in the 70's.

Re being better in the SC, Lara, Smith, Richards, Sobers, Gilchrist all had success in the SC, so did all of the bolwers. And as for the pitches are we going raging turners and dust bowls or flat ass pitches?

And are you playing Sehwag for his spin prowesss in India who will then tank overseas?

The ROW team is built for success home and away, so in a 6 test series, there's a better chance of the ROW stealing a test in Asia that the SC in SENA, or SA, Australia and England.
 

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Yes, but that's just you. All peer review from the 70's had Barry ahead, they both made Cricinfo's 2nd team.
There's a thread here where bowlers and other from the era rated who they thought was the best they bowled to, even Lillee said the best 3 he bowled to were Sobers and the Richards.

And 70's doesn't mean debuted post 70's as much as you would want it to mean that. He played in the 70's.

Re being better in the SC, Lara, Smith, Richards, Sobers, Gilchrist all had success in the SC, so did all of the bolwers. And as for the pitches are we going raging turners and dust bowls or flat ass pitches?

And are you playing Sehwag for his spin prowesss in India who will then tank overseas?

The ROW team is built for success home and away, so in a 6 test series, there's a better chance of the ROW stealing a test in Asia that the SC in SENA, or SA, Australia and England.
No, that's literally not me. Run a poll if you want, but rating a player with 4 Tests and a County record equal to Glenn Turner over Gavaskar, I will argue, is just you. Lindsay Hassett said Trumper was better than Bradman. Infact, 12 ex-players were asked and all but Wilfred Rhodes picked Trumper. Make what you may of it.

All the other players debuted post 1970. That's what I am going with.

Sobers played against absolute horrible bowling in India and did moderately in Pakistan. Lara was alright in India, as was Richards all around who has a good record in India and Pakistan, but nothing spectacular. Smith is the only one to do good consistently. But this batting doesn't really hold up to the Asian lineup.

I don't think Anwar was a better bat than Sehwag. Never met anyone who does. If needed, Dravid can open in SENA, have the technique to do so. Sehwag to good in Asia to be left out.

Can the RoW team win a Test in Asia? Yes. Do I bet on them to? No. Asia team is made to dominate at all kinds of Turner's and Pakistani dust bowls.
 

Coronis

International Coach
No, that's literally not me. Run a poll if you want, but rating a player with 4 Tests and a County record equal to Glenn Turner over Gavaskar, I will argue, is just you. Lindsay Hassett said Trumper was better than Bradman. Infact, 12 ex-players were asked and all but Wilfred Rhodes picked Trumper. Make what you may of it.

All the other players debuted post 1970. That's what I am going with.

Sobers played against absolute horrible bowling in India and did moderately in Pakistan. Lara was alright in India, as was Richards all around who has a good record in India and Pakistan, but nothing spectacular. Smith is the only one to do good consistently. But this batting doesn't really hold up to the Asian lineup.

I don't think Anwar was a better bat than Sehwag. Never met anyone who does. If needed, Dravid can open in SENA, have the technique to do so. Sehwag to good in Asia to be left out.

Can the RoW team win a Test in Asia? Yes. Do I bet on them to? No. Asia team is made to dominate at all kinds of Turner's and Pakistani dust bowls.
It only counts for certain players, as I understand it.
 

Slifer

International Captain
Assuming the teams put forth by Kyear the best idea would be probably to play in neutral conditions ie somewhere like the UAE. In which case I'd back the ROW. The fact that the ROW has to be handicapped in the first place says a lot.

Sehwag
Sunil
Dravid
Sachin
Sanga+
Javed
Imran*
Ashwin
Wasim
Waqar
Murali

Vs

Richards
Smith
Viv*
Lara
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist+
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath
 

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Assuming the teams put forth by Kyear the best idea would be probably to play in neutral conditions ie somewhere like the UAE. In which case I'd back the ROW. The fact that the ROW has to be handicapped in the first place says a lot.

Sehwag
Sunil
Dravid
Sachin
Sanga+
Javed
Imran*
Ashwin
Wasim
Waqar
Murali

Vs

Richards
Smith
Viv*
Lara
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist+
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath
UAE isn't neutral but in Asia. No neutral venue is left. If Asia gets to make those pitches, yep I will bet on them. Also, Sobers makes no sense.
 

Victor Ian

International Coach
Why are we picking Sanga as the wicket keeper? Man - talk about losing a lot of runs to inferior keeping AND taking the batting penalty that goes with Sanga when keeping. Sanga couldn't keep to Imran and Wasim. Extras coming galore.
 

Slifer

International Captain
UAE isn't neutral but in Asia. No neutral venue is left. If Asia gets to make those pitches, yep I will bet on them. Also, Sobers makes no sense.
UAE is in Asia yes but it isnt the subcon and conditions there are not similar to India and SL as far as I've observed and it has in fact been used as a neutral venue in the recent past. And I was using Kyears team. My ROW XI would be:

Hobbs
Hutton
Don*
Viv
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath

Excluding pre 70:

G Smith*
Greenidge
Viv
Smith S
Lara
Kallis
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath
 

Coronis

International Coach
UAE is in Asia yes but it isnt the subcon and conditions there are not similar to India and SL as far as I've observed and it has in fact been used as a neutral venue in the recent past. And I was using Kyears team. My ROW XI would be:

Hobbs
Hutton
Don*
Viv
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath

Excluding pre 70:

G Smith*
Greenidge
Viv
Smith S
Lara
Kallis
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath
This bugs me far more than it should.
 

capt_Luffy

International Captain
UAE is in Asia yes but it isnt the subcon and conditions there are not similar to India and SL as far as I've observed and it has in fact been used as a neutral venue in the recent past. And I was using Kyears team. My ROW XI would be:

Hobbs
Hutton
Don*
Viv
Smith
Sobers
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath

Excluding pre 70:

G Smith*
Greenidge
Viv
Smith S
Lara
Kallis
Gilchrist +
Hadlee
Marshall
Warne
McGrath
Fair. But UAE is Pakistan's practically home ground and honestly, mostly will just see high scoring draws.
 

centurymaker

Cricketer Of The Year
Conditions in UAE aren't a lot different from Subcontinent. ROW XI can't play with one specialist spinner in Asia! Plus fast bowlers are going to be rendered 2nd class players. So imo ROW don't have the spinners to compete with Asia.

Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
Sangakkara+
Younis/Maindad
Imran
Ashwin
Wasim
Kumble/Jadeja
Murali


Hutton
Hobbs
Bradman
Viv
Lara
Sobers
Gilchrist
Marshall
Warne
O'Reilly
McGrath


Warne and O'Reilly will be overwhelmed by the asian batting line. And there will be zero assistance for pacers besides the odd reverse. So the advantage ROW XI have with the batting gets neutralised due to inferior bowling for Asian conditions.

Kumble/Jadeja, Ashwin and Murali will run riot. On a pitch with turn, they will go through any lineup. Can't say the same for Warne and co. Moreover DRS would ensure that the old timers would struggle big time vs spin in Asia. They can't just use bat and pad or get forward enough to escape LBW.
 

kyear2

International Coach
No, that's literally not me. Run a poll if you want, but rating a player with 4 Tests and a County record equal to Glenn Turner over Gavaskar, I will argue, is just you. Lindsay Hassett said Trumper was better than Bradman. Infact, 12 ex-players were asked and all but Wilfred Rhodes picked Trumper. Make what you may of it.

All the other players debuted post 1970. That's what I am going with.

Sobers played against absolute horrible bowling in India and did moderately in Pakistan. Lara was alright in India, as was Richards all around who has a good record in India and Pakistan, but nothing spectacular. Smith is the only one to do good consistently. But this batting doesn't really hold up to the Asian lineup.

I don't think Anwar was a better bat than Sehwag. Never met anyone who does. If needed, Dravid can open in SENA, have the technique to do so. Sehwag to good in Asia to be left out.

Can the RoW team win a Test in Asia? Yes. Do I bet on them to? No. Asia team is made to dominate at all kinds of Turner's and Pakistani dust bowls.
I don't need to run a poll, everyone who saw them both bat had him ahead. Mark Nicholas has them both in his all time team.

It wasn't just his 4 tests and FC career, it was also the ROW matches and WSC production, and his quality.

If they are both on the field, you think Barry wouldn't perform as well because he didn't play a 100 tests? Get real, the man was quality.

There are about 10 forum members who watches Barry bat and they all rate him among the top 5 batsmen they've seen, including the guy you claim is your favorite poster. He rates him literally with Viv and Sachin as the best batsmen he's ever watched, think it's Northerer who says the same, among others. Lillee named the best 3 batsmen he bowled to, they were Garry Sobers, Viv Richards and Barry Richards.

Sunny had a better and longer test career, but put them both on the field in a match at their best and that doesn't count for much if anything. Barry was a unicorn, who else brings what he does to the table?

Not about Anwar being better than Sehwag, I don't remotely trust him against this level of attack on anything outside of the SC.

If we're going like WTC, you can play at Lord's, no English players on the team anyways, and that's one way traffic.

If it's a 6 test series can play 3 in each territory. The SC team isn't winning in England, SA or Australia. More likely to get a draw or steal a game in the SC and win the series, all I'm saying.

If you want to go Sehwag, knock yourself out, just wouldn't be my choice. Younis would also bring more to the team than Javed and Bumrah (as like Barry) despite the smaller sample size, is a better bowler than Waqar.

And not even discussing the Sobers pick, it's kinda ridiculous that there's even caveats in the first place, of he said 70's I'm including players who played in the 70's. When you select your at Aus vs WI team you don't start from when the WI became good.

But again, and we're picking the same team for all 6 mat he's, so balance might be suggested.

Gavaskar / Sehwag / Dravid / Tendulkar / Sangakkara / Younis / Imran / Jadeja / Wasim / Muralitharan / Bumrah

Richards / Greenidge / Richards / Lara / Smith / Sobers / Gilchrist / Hadlee / Marshall / Warne / McGrath

The ROW's batting is stronger, bowling is stronger and more adaptable, catching and fielding a little better as well (bigger gap without Younis). They can steal or draw one in the SC, don't see the ROW matches being that competitive.

Remove the arbitrary restrictions and Hutton replaces Greenidge and Bradman either Smith or Lara.
 

kyear2

International Coach
Why are we picking Sanga as the wicket keeper? Man - talk about losing a lot of runs to inferior keeping AND taking the batting penalty that goes with Sanga when keeping. Sanga couldn't keep to Imran and Wasim. Extras coming galore.
Who would you select as the keeper, Engineer, Dhoni or Jayawardene?
 

capt_Luffy

International Captain
I don't need to run a poll, everyone who saw them both bat had him ahead. Mark Nicholas has them both in his all time team.

It wasn't just his 4 tests and FC career, it was also the ROW matches and WSC production, and his quality.


If they are both on the field, you think Barry wouldn't perform as well because he didn't play a 100 tests? Get real, the man was quality.

There are about 10 forum members who watches Barry bat and they all rate him among the top 5 batsmen they've seen, including the guy you claim is your favorite poster. He rates him literally with Viv and Sachin as the best batsmen he's ever watched, think it's Northerer who says the same, among others. Lillee named the best 3 batsmen he bowled to, they were Garry Sobers, Viv Richards and Barry Richards.

Sunny had a better and longer test career, but put them both on the field in a match at their best and that doesn't count for much if anything. Barry was a unicorn, who else brings what he does to the table?

Not about Anwar being better than Sehwag, I don't remotely trust him against this level of attack on anything outside of the SC.

If we're going like WTC, you can play at Lord's, no English players on the team anyways, and that's one way traffic.

If it's a 6 test series can play 3 in each territory. The SC team isn't winning in England, SA or Australia. More likely to get a draw or steal a game in the SC and win the series, all I'm saying.

If you want to go Sehwag, knock yourself out, just wouldn't be my choice. Younis would also bring more to the team than Javed and Bumrah (as like Barry) despite the smaller sample size, is a better bowler than Waqar.

And not even discussing the Sobers pick, it's kinda ridiculous that there's even caveats in the first place, of he said 70's I'm including players who played in the 70's. When you select your at Aus vs WI team you don't start from when the WI became good.

But again, and we're picking the same team for all 6 mat he's, so balance might be suggested.

Gavaskar / Sehwag / Dravid / Tendulkar / Sangakkara / Younis / Imran / Jadeja / Wasim / Muralitharan / Bumrah

Richards / Greenidge / Richards / Lara / Smith / Sobers / Gilchrist / Hadlee / Marshall / Warne / McGrath

The ROW's batting is stronger, bowling is stronger and more adaptable, catching and fielding a little better as well (bigger gap without Younis). They can steal or draw one in the SC, don't see the ROW matches being that competitive.

Remove the arbitrary restrictions and Hutton replaces Greenidge and Bradman either Smith or Lara.
Don't really have time to read all and answer; so about the bolded part, you are very wrong. Barry Richards have not proven himself enough, so it's not justifiable to rank him ahead of Dravid, let alone Gavaskar. Enough said. Most people who saw both Trumper and Don bat rated Victor higher.
 

smash84

The Tiger King
I don't need to run a poll, everyone who saw them both bat had him ahead. Mark Nicholas has them both in his all time team.

It wasn't just his 4 tests and FC career, it was also the ROW matches and WSC production, and his quality.

If they are both on the field, you think Barry wouldn't perform as well because he didn't play a 100 tests? Get real, the man was quality.
Do you have any idea how many players start off well, especially in the first 4 tests, and then decline with time?
 

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