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Gordon Greenidge vs Rahul Dravid

Who is the better test batsman?

  • Total voters
    25
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
h_hurricane said:
Greenidge may have been underrated by a few but at the same time gets overrated by a few as well. Remember kyear2 once mentioning that there is not a lot to pick between him and Gavaskar which is clearly overrating him. Overall, he is fairly rated here. He is ATVG but not ATG.
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I said that during their respective peaks that there wasn't much between them, and there wasn't. Sunny deserves credit however for having a better end to his career.

Sunil started a bit before Sir Gordon and, GG ended a bit after Sunny, but if we look at the time they both played, '74 to '87 (admittedly possibly not the best way, but it's all we have) Gordon averaged 48.32 compared to Sunny's 50.44.

That included when Sir G was away @ WSC and Sunny was gorging, and also Sunny's 7 matches vs SL averaging 66.

Yes Sunil was the better batsman and had the better career, and yes Gordon had one of the worst collapses in test cricket after his eyes started to go, but to say Sunny outclassed Gordon to the extent that's being suggested isn't quite accurate either.
 
h_hurricane

h_hurricane

International Vice-Captain
kyear2 said:
I said that during their respective peaks that there wasn't much between them, and there wasn't. Sunny deserves credit however for having a better end to his career.

Sunil started a bit before Sir Gordon and, GG ended a bit after Sunny, but if we look at the time they both played, '74 to '87 (admittedly possibly not the best way, but it's all we have) Gordon averaged 48.32 compared to Sunny's 50.44.

That included when Sir G was away @ WSC and Sunny was gorging, and also Sunny's 7 matches vs SL averaging 66.

Yes Sunil was the better batsman and had the better career, and yes Gordon had one of the worst collapses in test cricket after his eyes started to go, but to say Sunny outclassed Gordon to the extent that's being suggested isn't quite accurate either.
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You are selectively picking '74 to '87 which is a period before Greenidge's decline but post Gavaskar's. Also picking WSC but not considering the fact that Greenidge had the luxury of not playing the best bowling attack of all time. Hardly surprises me though.

All factors considered, the 6 run gap between them is fairly reflective of the gap between them.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
h_hurricane said:
You are selectively picking '74 to '87 which is a period before Greenidge's decline but post Gavaskar's. Also picking WSC but not considering the fact that Greenidge had the luxury of not playing the best bowling attack of all time. Hardly surprises me though.

All factors considered, the 6 run gap between them is fairly reflective of the gap between them.
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I selected the period they both played, and Sunny's average doesn't change by that much. It doesn't cover his decline but it did his spotty start, it balances out. And again, it's the time they both played, so again, there wasn't much between them.

Greenidge didn't have to play the WI attack, but let's not pretend that there were any easy attacks at that time, and that difference is easily made up by the absolute swill that Sunny played against to start his career, easier home batting conditions, and having his fill vs SL and during WSC.

To be clear, Sunny was better, Greenidge had an epic decline at the end of his career, but to pretend that Sunny was in a different league while they both played is very incorrect.

I believe that someone did a collection of players teams during that period, and Gordon was chosen for more teams than Sunny, think even Barry was there.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
kyear2 said:
I selected the period they both played, and Sunny's average doesn't change by that much. It doesn't cover his decline but it did his spotty start, it balances out. And again, it's the time they both played, so again, there wasn't much between them.

Greenidge didn't have to play the WI attack, but let's not pretend that there were any easy attacks at that time, and that difference is easily made up by the absolute swill that Sunny played against to start his career, easier home batting conditions, and having his fill vs SL and during WSC.

To be clear, Sunny was better, Greenidge had an epic decline at the end of his career, but to pretend that Sunny was in a different league while they both played is very incorrect.

I believe that someone did a collection of players teams during that period, and Gordon was chosen for more teams than Sunny, think even Barry was there.
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Honest question: Do you think Viv was closer to Greenidge or Sunny?
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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kyear2 said:
I said that during their respective peaks that there wasn't much between them, and there wasn't. Sunny deserves credit however for having a better end to his career.

Sunil started a bit before Sir Gordon and, GG ended a bit after Sunny, but if we look at the time they both played, '74 to '87 (admittedly possibly not the best way, but it's all we have) Gordon averaged 48.32 compared to Sunny's 50.44.

That included when Sir G was away @ WSC and Sunny was gorging, and also Sunny's 7 matches vs SL averaging 66.

Yes Sunil was the better batsman and had the better career, and yes Gordon had one of the worst collapses in test cricket after his eyes started to go, but to say Sunny outclassed Gordon to the extent that's being suggested isn't quite accurate either.
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You do all that and still gavaskar is 2 points ahead on average despite this excluding some of sunny's most productive years.

Even in your filtered period, gavaskar has a virtually spotless all around record, a better away record and scored more than twice (!) the number of hundreds Greenidge did.

Gavaskar :

1000109463.jpg

Greenidge :

1000109466.jpg

This really wasn't a very persuasive case in Greenidge's favour whatsoever. Gavaskar and dravid are both ahead of Greenidge by a pretty sizeable margin. Greenidge is comparable to Martin Crowe, great players who are better than their stats but a clear step below Gavaskar/Dravid.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
capt_Luffy said:
Honest question: Do you think Viv was closer to Greenidge or Sunny?
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But to your question, there's no point.

At no point was I arguing that GG is better than Sunny, not to mention Sunny makes my 2nd AT XI while GG I think was in the 4th.

Sunny is also on my 2nd tier of batsman while Greenidge doesn't make the 3rd.

I'm.sahing that while they both played, don't pretend that it was irreverent to mention their names in the same sentence.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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Also I find it utterly absurd how people completely ignore how much better some Indian players numbers would be if they got to face Indian pace bowling attacks and didn't have to face some of the more powerful ones if they were born in a different country.

You can't on one hand sing the praises of how great the Windies pace battery was and then refuse to acknowledge how beneficial it is for West indies batsmen's records that they never had to face them. It really does my head in how something this obvious gets pushed under rug because it might raise some uncomfortable questions.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
The one thing I’ll always congratulate Greenidge on is having a good record in NZ, where most Windies batsmen struggle.
 
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