Best Attack

[srbhkshk]

The idea of there being some massive difference between the top 8 or so pace bowlers that would cause you to lose matches is non-sense. They might vary a bit here and there in terms of exactly which conditions they will give their best in, but you are getting pretty much the same output overall.

Attacks with Imran and Hadlee are always going to be better for the team overall, the batting differential actually exists, the bowling differential is a molehill masquerading as a mountain..

 

[kyear2]

I'm pointing out what the number you quoted add up to. I gave no opinion on whether they were right. I'm asking what you think the right numbers are. This is a very long post to not answer the question.

To which scenario are you referencing? The drop IVA one?

 

[kyear2]

The idea of there being some massive difference between the top 8 or so pace bowlers that would cause you to lose matches is non-sense. They might vary a bit here and there in terms of exactly which conditions they will give their best in, but you are getting pretty much the same output overall.

Attacks with Imran and Hadlee are always going to be better for the team overall, the batting differential actually exists, the bowling differential is a molehill masquerading as a mountain..

And on this we can agree to disagree.

I think McGrath was the better bowler, think we can manage to squeeze one in at 11.

Seriously, can we squeeze in the second best bowler of all time in at 11? The guy that spear headed one of the two greatest teams ever?

Come on...

 

[Bolo.]

To which scenario are you referencing? The drop IVA one?

How much do you think Imran and Hadlee are actually adding with the bat?

 

[subshakerz]

How much do you think Imran and Hadlee are actually adding with the bat?

He downplays Imran and Hadlee's batting and then hypes up Marshall and Warne as 'resistance' fighters whereas with his logic then shouldn't be averaging double digits with the bat.

 

[subshakerz]

Seriously, can we squeeze in the second best bowler of all time in at 11? The guy that spear headed one of the two greatest teams ever?

Come on...

Because the third best averages nearly 20 runs more with the bat.

 

[subshakerz]

The idea of there being some massive difference between the top 8 or so pace bowlers that would cause you to lose matches is non-sense. They might vary a bit here and there in terms of exactly which conditions they will give their best in, but you are getting pretty much the same output overall.

Attacks with Imran and Hadlee are always going to be better for the team overall, the batting differential actually exists, the bowling differential is a molehill masquerading as a mountain..

Yes, 100 times, yes.

Posters like @kyear2 are so obsessed with this idea of hallowed rankings they they assume it becomes some massive differential between bowlers. It really is just slight, slight differences that won't matter as much as having a good 20-30 runs an innings in a tight ATG game.

Except he will say, 'my ranking system puts McGrath as number 2 with automatically boosts him 40 points in overall analysis'.

 

[smash84]

This is a very long post to not answer the question.

You just pointed out kyear2's greatest skill

 

[Coronis]

I don’t have Imran in my side cos I think he’s a ****. And Bradman and Warne are already ***** so I have enough ***** in my side.

 

[subshakerz]

Don't know why this is difficult to grasp tbh.

Because it's wrong.

Once you are recognized as an allrounder, you are selected based on batting skill too.

There is never going to be a real world captain who would select McGrath over Hadlee. That is just your thing.

 

[subshakerz]

I don’t have Imran in my side cos I think he’s a ****. And Bradman and Warne are already ****s so I have enough ****s in my side.

Fair point. Too many egos.

 

[subshakerz]

I pretty much look at Marshall, Hadlee, McGrath, Steyn, Imran, Ambrose and Lillee as all ATGs with roughly the same level of skill. Many of the differences in their records are due to circumstantial factors than ability but given an ATG setting I don't see them producing very different levels of output.

 

[OverratedSanity]

If having a better tail adds an extra 50 runs to the team's total, then that is an absolutely massive improvement to the team's strength, particularly in ATG XI games that people have argued will be low scoring.

 

[kyear2]

How much do you think Imran and Hadlee are actually adding with the bat?

Not really sure, probably an extra 20 or so? That's assuming they aren't following each other back into the hut.

The part that is being missed is that lower order batting isn't something that can be consistently relied on, you might get a 30* then consecutive single figures.

There's no team in history where the selectors sat down and said let's just chose these guys based on batting. And for a team with this batting line up, yeah, just pick the best bowlers.

 

[kyear2]

Because the third best averages nearly 20 runs more with the bat.

So why do I consider McGrath better, which you do as well btw.

Was the sole pacer of his time that excelled during the flat pitch era. He didn't rely as heavily on faster pitches and with even a hint of bounce would be a handful in most conditions.
He had unmatched accuracy and control and formed a successful partnership with the spinner for this imaginary team.
He was the difference, the spearhead for one of the two greatest teams ever.
He compliments Marshall better than any other bowler under consideration.

So what you're basically telling me is that if you have someone that has the skill and attributes to form the best possible opening partnership, you're going to overlook him because he would bat at 11? Good thing none of you were selectors for Australia.

I respectfully don't care who averaged more with the bat, he's opening for me.

 

[kyear2]

Yes, 100 times, yes.

Posters like @kyear2 are so obsessed with this idea of hallowed rankings they they assume it becomes some massive differential between bowlers. It really is just slight, slight differences that won't matter as much as having a good 20-30 runs an innings in a tight ATG game.

Except he will say, 'my ranking system puts McGrath as number 2 with automatically boosts him 40 points in overall analysis'.

You just pointed out kyear2's greatest skill

I see the gang's back together. Just one missing

 

[kyear2]

Because it's wrong.

Once you are recognized as an allrounder, you are selected based on batting skill too.

There is never going to be a real world captain who would select McGrath over Hadlee. That is just your thing.

As far back as I can find, everytime we've selected an AT XI, McGrath has made the team, and easily.

I wish you would stop with these fantastical and inaccurate statements.

Even you in this very thread stated that you would select McGrath over Hadlee.

Coronis said earlier that batting isn't a prerequisite for selecting these teams.

In this very poll, the option where Hadlee replaces McGrath literally has the least amount of votes.

So no, it's not a me thing.

 

[kyear2]

If having a better tail adds an extra 50 runs to the team's total, then that is an absolutely massive improvement to the team's strength, particularly in ATG XI games that people have argued will be low scoring.

...

 

[OverratedSanity]

There's no team in history where the selectors sat down and said let's just chose these guys based on batting.

Well no this is disingenuous. It's also based on bowling because the gap in bowling quality is minuscule. Bowling quality has already been factored in.

 

[Coronis]

As far back as I can find, everytime we've selected an AT XI, McGrath has made the team, and easily.

I wish you would stop with these fantastical and inaccurate statements.

Even you in this very thread stated that you would select McGrath over Hadlee.

Coronis said earlier that batting isn't a prerequisite for selecting these teams.

In this very poll, the option where Hadlee replaces McGrath literally has the least amount of votes.

So no, it's not a me thing.

Hey hey don’t drag me down with you.

But yeah you’re right. Or wrong.

I don’t really care enough about the topic tbh. They’re all great attacks and there probably shouldn’t be this much argument regarding them - you guys have different philosophies. Can you accept that’s ok? Different question entirely.