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The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Coronis said:
Like I said, kinda shoehorned him in there out of laziness.

Also lol Macartney seriously? When you have Boycott as an option?
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If Sutcliffe and Boycott open together, it would be a very slow partnership. Have to think about the scoring rate as well.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
capt_Luffy said:
If Sutcliffe and Boycott open together, it would be a very slow partnership. Have to think about the scoring rate as well.
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And Macartney is seriously your next choice? Bloke averages 35 as an opener with half his runs in 1/9 innings, and 70% of his runs in the one match.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Coronis said:
And Macartney is seriously your next choice? Bloke averages 35 as an opener with half his runs in 1/9 innings, and 70% of his runs in the one match.
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I don't think Pre WWI opening and batting in the middle order was much different. As far as I have read, up until the 70s MaCartney was considered the 3rd best Aussie bat and his career trajectory, beginning as a bowling allrounder is probably quite similar to the likes of Smith and Jayasuriya.
 
Q

Qlder

International Debutant
capt_Luffy said:
... As far as I have read, up until the 70s MaCartney was considered the 3rd best Aussie bat and his career trajectory, beginning as a bowling allrounder is probably quite similar to the likes of Smith and Jayasuriya.
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No way was he ever considered 3rd best bat up to the 70's. Ponsford, Morris, Bradman, Hill, Trumper, Harvey all considered above him and even a young Dougie Walters was ahead of him by 1970
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
capt_Luffy said:
I don't think Pre WWI opening and batting in the middle order was much different. As far as I have read, up until the 70s MaCartney was considered the 3rd best Aussie bat and his career trajectory, beginning as a bowling allrounder is probably quite similar to the likes of Smith and Jayasuriya.
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Put Clem Hill in there then. Macartney literally averaged 26 with the bat pre war.
 
P

PlayerComparisons

International Vice-Captain
Qlder said:
Ah yeah, I don't put Smith ahead of Border, Waugh or Ponting. Smith's legacy will be a great #4 who was then dropped after failing as a below average opener
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Yea Ponting > Smith.

Ponting averaged like 60 after 110 tests while batting higher up at #3 and had tougher home pitches and scored quicker too.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Qlder said:
No way was he ever considered 3rd best bat up to the 70's. Ponsford, Morris, Bradman, Hill, Trumper, Harvey all considered above him
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Actually it was. Neville Cardus even included him in his 20th Century World XI ahead of the likes of Hammond and Headley. Not saying he is better than Harvey and Hill, but he was rated so.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
capt_Luffy said:
Yeah, but for majority of that period he was a bowling allrounder, almost picked for bowling exclusively in the first two series.
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So he wasn’t a good batsman for the majority of his career so you’ll also pick him in a position he wasn’t good in? Over actual established openers with far better records? Based purely on strike rate?

ffs
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Coronis said:
So he wasn’t a good batsman for the majority of his career so you’ll also pick him in a position he wasn’t good in? Over actual established openers with far better records? Based purely on strike rate?

ffs
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His career was interrupted by War at the worst time and his record post War was great.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

International Captain
Coronis said:
He opened twice post war and didn’t do ****. You’re better off choosing Afridi to open.
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That's a bit of a too big stretch and you know it. As I have read, he really liked to open but Australia preferred him not to due to his risk taking nature. He opened plenty in FC as well.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
capt_Luffy said:
ROW XI imo:

  1. Herbert Sutcliffe
  2. Charlie MaCartney
  3. Ricky Ponting
  4. Allan Border (c)
  5. Steve Waugh
  6. Ian Botham
  7. Alan Knott (wk)
  8. Alan Davidson
  9. Pat Cummins
  10. Michael Holding
  11. Bill O'Reilly
Also, if Worrell can open here, surely he opens in WI AT XI??
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Struggling to understand how Border doesn't make an Aussie AT XI
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
ataraxia said:
People who include Botham in their England side but don't include Miller in their Australia side are weird.
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England's middle order is weaker and lacks pace outside of Trueman. Australia has none of those weaknesses.

Bradman, Smith, Chappell, Border is more than good enough. Imo of course.
 
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