subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
'Yeah let's give home credit so we can immediately find a way to take it away'.
No, you don't already do it. You just bring up the away performances in critical assessment.
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Do SC Pacers Deserve More Credit For Home Performances?
- Thread starter subshakerz
- Start date
No, you don't already do it. You just bring up the away performances in critical assessment.
Slifer
International Captain
He couldn't adapt over 13 tests, but he'd do so playing more. That's all good and well , so long as we also then agree that great bowlers like Ambrose could probably adapt and do as well in Pakistan as Imran did.....
Subz: " well no because Ambrose sucked on flat wickets. "
Me: Subz, Ambrose averaged under 20 in the two flattest wickets in the Caribbean. Arguably the two flattest in the world.
Subz: well that's irrelevant to the thread, you're moving goal posts, Imran....
Me:
Coronis
International Coach
Not everyone.
How ironic that subs is posting this.
Anyway, SC pacers do get credit for their worse home conditions. I see people harping on about it in literally every single thread that compares a SC pacer vs a non SC pacer.
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
Well most do
Not any way close to the extent people do when defending SENA spinners against SC ones....
Coronis
International Coach
Run some polls on 27-28 bowlers vs Kapil then.
Coronis
International Coach
Ye not me. Lillee and Viv most overrated pacer and batsman imo. ****in 70’s romantics.
Sunil1z
International Regular
@PlayerComparisons please run a poll of Kapil, Starc and Alderman.
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
You know you might be onto something.....
Sunil1z
International Regular
Actually I was trolling
In no universe should Starc , Alderman be rated higher than Kapil .
So, apparently being suited to conditions doesn't matter, and we can't judge performances at home by using their away performances to assess if performances came from personal quality or conditions. Which leads me to the conclusion that Ntini is a home ATG. Must have had a tough ride. The overall bowling average in his home games was plenty high.
OverratedSanity
Request Your Custom Title Now!
But Ntini's home conditions were not flat. We know this. If Ntini had played all his career on flat home decks and done brilliantly, but still failed away from home, dont you think he'd deserve credit for how he bowled at home despite failing overseas?
Using away performances to assess home conditions make no sense to me.
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
No no, I was talking about the highlighted point....Actually I was trolling
In no universe should Starc , Alderman be rated higher than Kapil .
Coronis
International Coach
Yeah thinking on it again, Alderman isn’t. I’ll stand by Starc though. Good to see you ignored Johnson and Broad.Actually I was trolling
In no universe should Starc , Alderman be rated higher than Kapil .
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Stop dragging Ambrose in this and deflecting the main point. Knocking him down a peg on this thread serves no purpose.He couldn't adapt over 13 tests, but he'd do so playing more. That's all good and well , so long as we also then agree that great bowlers like Ambrose could probably adapt and do as well in Pakistan as Imran did.....
Subz: " well no because Ambrose sucked on flat wickets. "
Me: Subz, Ambrose averaged under 20 in the two flattest wickets in the Caribbean. Arguably the two flattest in the world.
Subz: well that's irrelevant to the thread, you're moving goal posts, Imran....
Me:
Coronis
International Coach
@subshakerz You said you started this thread in response to Botham vs Kapil debate. So please, address this post.Why couldn’t he adapt when he played then? He played county cricket too so its not like he didn’t have experience and its not like he was facing super strong English lineups.
Botham was able to adapt and average 25 in India against a stronger batting lineup. But Kapil is more adaptable and better
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Is Ntini at home really a challenge? Talk about missing the point of the thread entirely...
Sunil1z
International Regular
Actually Johnson is a 50-50 case .He averages 40 in Asia . But still has ridiculous peak . So I Won’t object if you rate him higher . Broad I don’t have problem. (600 wkts )
capt_Luffy
Cricketer Of The Year
If he wants he could rate Stuart Clarke higher than Kapil; as long as he doesn't complains when I do so with Agarkar and Davidson.
OverratedSanity
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Starc's a massively overrated bowler imo. Easily 30+ average bowler on quality. He's bowled maybe 500 balls that should've been wides but got counted as byes because umpires are way too lenient.
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
I think my point is that over a career, I don't see Kapil averaging that bad in England. However, it is a legitimate fail in his away record. But this is irrelevant to the main point of this thread.