Ashwin - The ATG Spinner

[Flem274*]

Same number of countries as Pat Cummins Tbf.

Who cares about dumb expensive 5-150 style 5-fors anyway. He was a critical contributor to two series wins in Australia and made Steve Smith look like a n00b. Ashwin doesn’t do boring stats like a loser, he just Ash-wins.

This is a good point. People get obsessed with arbitrary landmarks when rating players (I get it, achievement endorphins go ping) but often fail to look at contextual good performances.

Ashwins tour of aus is probably the best he's ever bowled (especially in SENA) but I doubt it looks that way on raw numbers.

 

[TheJediBrah]

i dont think Indian fans here are making the doctoring thing argument as a huge slanderous factor that you believe it to be, its more of a matter of fact point thats being made

I'm just reacting to the fact that 90% of the discussion in this thread has been about that factor. I didn't initiate it or even really contribute to it much

and more specifically XiXi's attempt to call out opposition to it as "cope". I don't have a strong opinion either way just pointing out a clear error

 

[Xix2565]

Even then, I didn't do it to say Ashwin was schemed against beyond exaggerations in response to the dumb responses. All I did was look at the numbers smh.

 

[OverratedSanity]

This is a good point. People get obsessed with arbitrary landmarks when rating players (I get it, achievement endorphins go ping) but often fail to look at contextual good performances.

Ashwins tour of aus is probably the best he's ever bowled (especially in SENA) but I doubt it looks that way on raw numbers.

He was genuinely our best bowler in the first two games of that second tour and I'm kinda amazed that non Indian posters have tried to rewrite history there and frame his wickets as some kind of holding support role. He was bowling with the new ball knocking over their top order batsmen and making life hell for Smith. Then in the third game when his bowling slipped a bit with an injured back he plays a match saving innings. Genuinely heroic performance. But yeah because he didn't pick up 5-175 in a game, he wasn't that great lmao.

His numbers in the last four games in Australia (2019 and 2021 tours) are: 18 wickets in 4 matches @27. 2 series wins. 1 match saved with the bat. Doesn't really get much better for a spin bowler who can bat tbh.

 

[subshakerz]

If Murali era SL had jadeja and 4 pacers as good as the 4 India usually go over with, does Murali automatically play in eng/Aus/SA?.

Yes he does.

 

[Spark]

He was genuinely our best bowler in the first two games of that second tour and I'm kinda amazed that non Indian posters have tried to rewrite history there and frame his wickets as some kind of holding support role. He was bowling with the new ball knocking over their top order batsmen and making life hell for Smith. Then in the third game when his bowling slipped a bit with an injured back he plays a match saving innings. Genuinely heroic performance. But yeah because he didn't pick up 5-175 in a game, he wasn't that great lmao.

His numbers in the last four games in Australia (2019 and 2021 tours) are: 18 wickets in 4 matches @27. 2 series wins. 1 match saved with the bat. Doesn't really get much better for a spin bowler who can bat tbh.

I'm not saying you're wrong but I will point out that Lyon often gets held to a much higher standard than this, and has copped of a lot of criticism in his career - less so on here, more from casuals - for not running through sides even outside the subcontinent.

 

[subshakerz]

Ashwins tour of aus is probably the best he's ever bowled (especially in SENA) but I doubt it looks that way on raw numbers.

I've always said it is a good tour but the way it's been exaggerated to establish his ATG credentials is what I disagree with.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I'm not saying you're wrong but I will point out that Lyon often gets held to a much higher standard than this, and has copped of a lot of criticism in his career - less so on here, more from casuals - for not running through sides even outside the subcontinent.

Well boohoo for Lyon I guess. Not really sure what that has to do with anything that's being discussed.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Lyon would take even more wickets on Mars, where he is from

 

[Calm_profit]

Ashwin outbowling Lyon in Australia is a myth when you look head to head stats they are kinda similar except in Adelaide day/night test where he outbowled Lyon.

 

[Socerer 01]

I'm not saying you're wrong but I will point out that Lyon often gets held to a much higher standard than this, and has copped of a lot of criticism in his career - less so on here, more from casuals - for not running through sides even outside the subcontinent.

le casuals were also shitting on Cam Green for not being prime Miller ever since his 2nd test match so im not sure what’s the point here

 

[OverratedSanity]

Ashwin wouldn't have fumbled that throw. Because he'd have mankaded Leach.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Ashwin outbowling Lyon in Australia is a myth when you look head to head stats they are kinda similar except in Adelaide day/night test where he outbowled Lyon.

Lyon averaged literally double what Ashwin did that series the **** are you on about

 

[Xix2565]

Ashwin wouldn't have fumbled that throw. Because he'd have mankaded Leach.

Would've gotten Wilson's finger up instead. Because of reputation.

 

[Spark]

Well boohoo for Lyon I guess. Not really sure what that has to do with anything that's being discussed.

tbh i've forgotten what my actual point was as well

 

[Calm_profit]

Lyon averaged literally double what Ashwin did that series the **** are you on about

Im talking with facts

 

[OverratedSanity]

* Ashwin not an ATG for me btw, but it is a useless arbitrary word that people have different interpretations of so who cares.

 

[Socerer 01]

Ashwin outbowling Lyon in Australia is a myth when you look head to head stats they are kinda similar except in Adelaide day/night test where he outbowled Lyon.

so they are kinda similar as long as you take out the instances of him outbowling Lyon which means he did outbowl him

 

[Xix2565]

Im talking with facts

He's not taking earlier games into account lol.

 

[Socerer 01]

* Ashwin not an ATG for me btw, but it is a useless arbitrary word that people have different interpretations of so who cares.

based and atgpilled