*Official* Australia tour of New Zealand Feb-Mar 2024

[RossTaylorsBox]

 

[Sunil1z]

Ta, thanks for the reminder. Him and Rahane batting together and absolutely smoking the ****s is my lasting memory of Kohli in Aus. That was such a fun partnership.

Trade offer still stands. I think India needs a nice medium pacer to complement Thakur.

Kohli is our KW . You may not rate him for valid reasons . But only trade off I can do is KW for Virat . He was also our top scorer in SA 2 month ago .So we definitely need him

 

[Flem274*]

Kohli is our KW . You may not rate him for valid reasons . But only trade off I can do is KW for Virat . He was also our top scorer in SA . So we definitely need him View attachment 39468

Bro Kohli is a generational player. I'm scamming you with the trade offer.

 

[Skyliner]

The phrase ‘Big 3’ came about to describe the countries with the most economic and political clout in the game, it was coined relatively recently. The Windies were dominating test cricket in the 70’s and 80’s, England were pretty rubbish in the 90’s, Pakistan with Wasim and Waqar were seriously good in the 90’s. So again, ‘the Big 3’ came to be ‘a thing’ with the BCCI becoming a behemoth in the economics of cricket, along with England and Australia - who started test cricket between them and play the iconic ‘Ashes’ series. England plays more tests than any other nation and certain players reap the benefits statistically.
In this modern era, NZ had won the inaugural WTC, and then Australia won it.
In terms of which nations have the best players, play the best at home, and who the best players should be benchmarked against, it doesn’t automatically follow that ‘the Big 3’ line up perfectly with these metrics. Australia is a notoriously tough nut to crack at home, so is India, but Pakistan can certainly be as well, and South Africa. A nation can be viewed as a lesser light simply because they play less and their series’ don’t get the sort if billing that ‘The Ashes’ or ‘The Border Gavaskar Trophy’ do. But whether their players are less gritty or less talented is another matter.

 

[Sunil1z]

I think KW can be Dravid tier ATG . Flaws in record but also a solid Technique and lots of impressive knocks

 

[trundler]

Unlikely, given I scroll past a lot of your posts without comment.

m8 I don't even respond to most of your drive by potshots. You making me into a KW hater is an entirely imagined agenda on your part though I do routinely expose kiwi myopia on this forum and the sensitivity around Williamson is a subset of that.

 

[Silver Silva]

He's been fortunate to get such a long run in the Australian test team with not any real competition for his spot from other Aussie spinners.

Greg Matthews was quite a good off spinner too and a far better batsman than Lyon but his career was cut short when Shane Warne arrived.

Highest Aussie wicket takers vs New Zealand (TOP 3)

1.Shane Warne
103 test wickets in 20 Tests @24.37

2.Nathan Lyon
60 test wickets in 11 Tests @18.90

3.Glenn McGrath
57 test wickets in 14 Tests @25.33

Not bad for a fortune bloke!

 

[PlayerComparisons]

I think KW can be Dravid tier ATG . Flaws in record but also a solid Technique and lots of impressive knocks

Yes Williamson is in the second tier of ATGs with Sangakkara, Kallis, Ponting, Dravid, Kohli, Waugh

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

I do routinely expose kiwi myopia on this forum and the sensitivity around Williamson is a subset of that.

Is anyone asking you to do that? I mean, you’ve seen the NZ Doom and Gloom thread? What’s the point? Why do you want to punch down anyway? Odd tstl.

 

[Sunil1z]

Kiwi fans are definitely sensitive regarding KW just like Indian fans were regarding Sachin .

 

[thundaboult]

southee is the ultimate villain

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Kiwi fans are definitely sensitive regarding KW just like Indian fans were regarding Sachin .

I’m hardly one to be able to analyse batting technique as mine’s atrocious, but really to be NZ’s greatest batsman - at least in the last 50 years - it’s between Williamson and Crowe. No matter how much ‘myopia’ someone courageously seeks to correct, it isn’t going to change that. He could get out for a duck in his next 20 innings and have a rubbish end to his career and it would still be true. The cupboard is pretty bare and it seems unlikely we’ll see anyone like him soon. Perhaps other countries with a greater player base can expect quality batsmen to be churned out with greater regularity, but clearly that isn’t the case here.

 

[GotSpin]

Can't underestimate the good work Smith and Khawaja did in the first innings , that is where the match was won.
Batted for 24 overs when the ball was doing a lot, gave the middle order every chance to get stuck in and Cam Green made it count

Agreed

 

[trundler]

Is anyone asking you to do that? I mean, you’ve seen the NZ Doom and Gloom thread? What’s the point? Why do you want to punch down anyway? Odd tstl.

Who's punching down? I think misery vampirism is the absolute pits and I don't come to tour thread to gloat. Despite all the wrist slitting, New Zealanders tend to be least objective when it comes to their own players giving us such sizzling takes as Williamson being better than Dravid and Vettori being a better ODI bowler than Warne. Definitely a trend there. Even Indians are less sensitive about Tendulkar on here.

 

[Sunil1z]

I’m hardly one to be able to analyse batting technique as mine’s atrocious, but really to be NZ’s greatest batsman - at least in the last 50 years - it’s between Williamson and Crowe. No matter how much ‘myopia’ someone courageously seeks to correct, it isn’t going to change that. He could get out for a duck in his next 20 innings and have a rubbish end to his career and it would still be true. The cupboard is pretty bare and it seems unlikely we’ll see anyone like him soon. Perhaps other countries with a greater player base can expect quality batsmen to be churned out with greater regularity, but clearly that isn’t the case here.

And that was the exact case with Sachin. He was our only World Class player in 90s till Dravid , Laxman, Sehwag came . So many Indian fans would get annoyed on Sachin’s criticism

 

[Bahnz]

Who's punching down? I think misery vampirism is the absolute pits and I don't come to tour thread to gloat. Despite all the wrist slitting, New Zealanders tend to be least objective when it comes to their own players giving us such sizzling takes as Williamson being better than Dravid and Vettori being a better ODI bowler than Warne. Definitely a trend there. Even Indians are less sensitive about Tendulkar on here.

Where has anyone said either of these things?

 

[Silver Silva]

This bothers me. I dug out the two other times Williamson has been dismissed similarly against Lyon.





It's been a clear plan to Williamson for 13 years. It's not just generic good bowling to a right hander, Williamson especially has always been very uncomfortable with Lyon's overspin and leg theory - most balls are (deliberately) going 20cm over the bails and/or down leg - even when he isn't getting out to it. So do something different? I expect someone with an open stance like Smith would leave or swat those with minimal moving parts, and Lyon would respond by going fuller and straighter which is probably what you want. Take that with a grain of salt, I don't have 8000 test runs, but surely the approach is not to play Lyon exactly the same way you did unsuccessfully in 2011 and hope it works out better this time. Some semblance of a plan pls.

Great spot , maybe this should be shared with people connected to the NZ team.. Lyon definitely has a clear plan against KW , expertly bowled but it's something you can plan against..

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Who's punching down? I think misery vampirism is the absolute pits and I don't come to tour thread to gloat. Despite all the wrist slitting, New Zealanders tend to be least objective when it comes to their own players giving us such sizzling takes as Williamson being better than Dravid and Vettori being a better ODI bowler than Warne. Definitely a trend there. Even Indians are less sensitive about Tendulkar on here.

That reads like a load of self-justifying bullshit. You appear to have precisely come in this thread to justify your existing views on Williamson because of his abject failure in this match without adding anything to the discussion that already existed other than smug self-satisfaction. Punching down. And I've not even seen any of your past pronouncements on him, which appear to exist.

I also have no idea what this Vettori/Warne thing's about. In my 15 odd years on this site, most of the Vettori discussion has focused on his inability to take wickets when it mattered - particularly in the 4th innings, but perhaps that's because I only really follow Test cricket.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Despite all the wrist slitting, New Zealanders tend to be least objective when it comes to their own players giving us such sizzling takes as Williamson being better than Dravid and Vettori being a better ODI bowler than Warne.

No, we don't.

 

[Nintendo]

Who's punching down? I think misery vampirism is the absolute pits and I don't come to tour thread to gloat. Despite all the wrist slitting, New Zealanders tend to be least objective when it comes to their own players giving us such sizzling takes as Williamson being better than Dravid and Vettori being a better ODI bowler than Warne. Definitely a trend there. Even Indians are less sensitive about Tendulkar on here.

Yeah like kane's away average is 10 less than his home average and he averages sub 40 against the 3 best bowling attacks of his era (AUS, IND, ENG). He's fantastic, but he's not dravid.