*Official* 2024 South Africa tour of New Zealand: 2 tests

[StephenZA]

There is no other time they can fit the SA20 in. We rushed a little 2 test series in Vs India.

New Zealand are playing Australia after this so even with the scheduling it might never have been worked around.

So without blaming anybody it's the way cricket is going outside the big financial 3.

We used to play 5 test series against England. We lucky if we getting 3 now.

My understanding though is that the 2 Test series is largely CSA choice not necessarily other boards... We are playing 3 Test series against Aus and Eng in 2025, I think.

I'm hoping this is an aberration while they get their finances restocked. The SA20 settles down and we go back to some decent tours. 3 Tests, 3 T20s and 3 ODIs.

 

[Naveed Qaisar]

So there is no scorecard for this warm up match?

Result: Match drawn

Day 2: Innings Break - New Zealand XI 294 (81.5 Overs), trail by 45 runs

Day 1: Innings Break- South Africa 1st innings 339 (81.2 0vers)

Teams:

South Africa (12 batting, 11 fielding): Neil Brand(c), Edward Moore, Raynard van Tonder, Zubayr Hamza, Keegan Petersen, David Bedingham, Khaya Zondo, Ruan de Swardt, Clyde Fortuin(w), Mihlali Mpongwana, Shaun von Berg, Dane Piedt, Duanne Olivier, Tshepo Moreki, Dane Paterson

New Zealand XI (12 batting, 11 fielding): Matthew Boyle, Jacob Cumming, Bharat Popli(c), Dean Foxcroft, Leo Carter, Luke Georgeson, Max Chu(w), Jake Gibson, Ben Lockrose, Jacob Duffy, Sean Davey, Michael Snedden, Kyle Jamieson

South Africa have won the toss and have opted to bat

 

[StephenZA]

The lack of experience and bowling is the problem with this SA lineup not the batting.

 

[SteveNZ]

Obviously tough to throw in so much inexperience at test level together in the batting but I wouldn't disrespect this batting unit of ours. There are guys capable in there.

Yeah, I don't mean to be disrespectful at all. It's just a big call to think a top 3 all on debut, and a top 7 with 20 Tests total (if my maths are right) are going to handle the step up initially. The bowling has been very decent, but it becomes a different ball game when one mistake is the end of it all.

 

[StephenZA]

Yeah, I don't mean to be disrespectful at all. It's just a big call to think a top 3 all on debut, and a top 7 with 20 Tests total (if my maths are right) are going to handle the step up initially. The bowling has been very decent, but it becomes a different ball game when one mistake is the end of it all.

Understandable... But also from our side two-thirds of that batting lineup should have already been in the first team or selected for it years ago. It is the selection problems of the last 10 years for SA cricket that gives a feeling this batting is weak, if you don't know the history of why these players are only just been selected.

For the SA international batting this tour could be a godsend that helps get batting selection sorted.

 

[StephenZA]

I would rather have played Mpongwana than Olivier in this team. If for no other reason than seeing what he could really do.

 

[Aidan11]

Ravindra

 

[Bahseph]

I would rather have played Mpongwana than Olivier in this team. If for no other reason than seeing what he could really do.

I commented on him in one of the SA domestic threads a few years ago. Reminds me so much of Jason Holder.

Edit: http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/threads/south-african-domestic-2022-23.88339/post-4889111

 

[Dendarii]

Understandable... But also from our side two-thirds of that batting lineup should have already been in the first team or selected for it years ago. It is the selection problems of the last 10 years for SA cricket that gives a feeling this batting is weak, if you don't know the history of why these players are only just been selected.

For the SA international batting this tour could be a godsend that helps get batting selection sorted.

Those selection problems have been compounded by us playing so few tests. It's not a good look to be appear to not be backing new players, so once you've picked someone you're kind of obligated to give them a run in the side. The result is that it takes a while for those guys to demonstrate why they shouldn't have been there, delaying the selection of those who should have been there in the first place.

 

[SeamUp]

Those selection problems have been compounded by us playing so few tests. It's not a good look to be appear to not be backing new players, so once you've picked someone you're kind of obligated to give them a run in the side. The result is that it takes a while for those guys to demonstrate why they shouldn't have been there, delaying the selection of those who should have been there in the first place.

Exactly. I know it's controversial but I like that Conrad makes gut feel calls. For years now they just pick the leading run scorer in domestic cricket. So much more goes into selection than that for me.

1)Does the person have the ability/temperament to step up.

2) Is their technique one to bully domestic but not survive internationally. Are they adaptable to score runs in different conditions. Off-side and leg-side scoring options.

3) Early identification of talent (SA U19/Academy which Conrad knows) and pecking orders. Knowing when to fast track and who does deserve a call-up for domestic runs.

 

[StephenZA]

Exactly. I know it's controversial but I like that Conrad makes gut feeling calls. For years now they just pick the leading run scorer in domestic cricket. So much more goes into selection than that for me.

1)Does the person have the ability/temperament to step up.

2) Is their technique one to bully domestic but not survive internationally. Are they adaptable to score runs in different conditions. Off-side and leg-side scoring options.

3) Early identification of talent (SA U19/Academy which Conrad knows) and pecking orders. Knowing when to fast track and who does deserve a call-up for domestic runs.

Selection has been an entirely tick box exercise for years now, when it comes to batting... Been horrendous. And it's almost entirely because of the quota system. Because if you are white or black and get selected you either got selected because of quota or else you jumped someone of colour who has done their dues and deserves a spot first. It creates bad blood. Simplest thing to do then is just take the experienced players that are scoring runs and select from those.

We don't do it with the bowling but that is because our best bowlers are both black and or white. Nobody doubts Rabada, nobody would doubt Mphaka selection. And that gives more freedom to bring in goes like Jansen and Coetzee.

It's terrible this is where we are at...

 

[SeamUp]

Selection has been an entirely tick box exercise for years now, when it comes to batting... Been horrendous. And it's almost entirely because of the quota system. Because if you are white or black and get selected you either got selected because of quota or else you jumped someone of colour who has done their dues and deserves a spot first. It creates bad blood. Simplest thing to do then is just take the experienced players that are scoring runs and select from those.

We don't do it with the bowling but that is because our best bowlers are both black and or white. Nobody doubts Rabada, nobody would doubt Mphaka selection. And that gives more freedom to bring in goes like Jansen and Coetzee.

It's terrible this is where we are at...

Yup. It's just not good for anyone's psyche on both sides of the debate.

Most coaches are of colour now anyway, there will never be any 'white' racism in that sense. I've long said we can't force the needs/wants of majority race in SA but you can invest in grassroots and find people to work their socks off to try help that there should never be the quota word used and spoken. And it goes for all sides really. We need strong young white, coloured, Asian, Black cricketers to make our cricket as strong as possible and help each other. Sometimes feels like there isn't unity.

 

[SeamUp]

I commented on him in one of the SA domestic threads a few years ago. Reminds me so much of Jason Holder.

Edit: http://www.cricketweb.net/forum/threads/south-african-domestic-2022-23.88339/post-4889111

I think that's what the WP lads call him. 'Holder'

 

[StephenZA]

Yup. It's just not good for anyone's psyche on both sides of the debate.

Most coaches are of colour now anyway, there will never be any 'white' racism in that sense. I've long said we can't force the needs/wants of majority race in SA but you can invest in grassroots and find people to work their socks off to try help that there should never be the quota word used and spoken. And it goes for both sides really. We need strong young white, coloured, Asian, Black cricketers to make our cricket as strong as possible and help each other. Sometimes feels like there isn't unity.

The single most important even that could happen for SA cricket is a truly high quality black South African batsmen. Someone of ABdV/ Kallis pedigree... practically it makes the whole quota debate just go away because nobody could deny the quality. But more importantly it could encourage an entire generation and solve long term issues.

 

[SeamUp]

The single most important even that could happen for SA cricket is a truly high quality black South African batsmen. Someone of ABdV/ Kallis pedigree... practically it makes the whole quota debate just go away because nobody could deny the quality. But more importantly it could encourage an entire generation and solve long term issues.

Agreed. Pity the Windies great Gen can't roll back the years and come play our domestic cricket again and become role models. When I was a youngster I used to love Dessie Haynes for example. It might be something small but it 100% could help with what you saying above. Timing and Windies fall from grace obviously make it not possible.

 

[Immenso]

Conway's failures this season have been immensely frustrating, but I think a little more faith should be shown in him. He had a decent break after the Bangladesh tests and if he needs a break then he's getting one in the winter anyway (if you class endless T20s as such).

Worth being cautious judging him after only 6 failures this year, and I'm not sure his dismissals have been too horrible. Time in the middle can be as effective as a break in turning around form.

We have probably our busiest winter ever probably in history.

T20 world cup, test series in SL, one-off test v Afghans, test series (3 tests in India).
Add the IPL as well for Conway.

He's not getting a rest.

 

[Flem274*]

Rest him for the second test and pack him off to a holiday home until the Aus series. Guy needs some annual leave.

 

[Moss]

That successful IPL last year with CSK was the worst thing to happen to Conway’s international career, at least in the short term. CSK usually goes all in on a player who shows the kind of consistency he did over 2 seasons so at least things are secured financially you’d think.

 

[ashley bach]

After 22.2 overs, Williamson is on 22*

@ashley bach

Run rate in this session: 2.22

@ashley bach

When I randomly looked at the score today it was 222/2

 

[ashley bach]

It wouldn't be summer without a KW century.

Also way to go Rachin