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The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

Prince EWS

Prince EWS

Global Moderator
Adorable Asshole said:
Because no one takes him seriously
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I've resisted the 'no u' of this response the last few times you've had potshots at me, but my posts like that always get a lot more interaction than yours. Even when you start brand new threads that are successful, people just ignore your actual teams/lists and post their own in reply.

Haters can suck it etc etc.
 
Adorable Asshole

Adorable Asshole

International Regular
Prince EWS said:
I've resisted the 'no u' of this response the last few times you've had potshots at me, but my posts like that always get a lot more interaction than yours. Even when you start brand new threads that are successful, people just ignore your actual teams/lists and post their own in reply.

Haters can suck it etc etc.
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Only because of mod privilege.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
Prince EWS said:
It's easier to make fun of me for my Lillee opinion.

Viv would probably be in my next team if I did one. Having Hoggard make an appearance before Lillee would raise an eyebrow or two.
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Viv is similar to Lillee from the perspective that it seems that his standing is based more on his aura and anecdotal evidence than cold statistics.
But his stats are they way they are (similar to Ponting) because of the precipitous decline at the end of his career.

But at the end of the day no batsman is perfect and they all have holes or "buts" in their resume. But he could turn a game on its head like no other.

But yeah
Viv - relatively short peak
Hammond - suspect vs genuine pace and some also claimed wrist spin.
Lara - inconsistent
Even Bradman could be argued - era / pitches / competition
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
So after year another trip through the thread, there are actually quite a few consensus selections.

Hobbs
Hutton / Gavaskar
Bradman
Tendulkar
Richards / Lara / Smith / Hammond
Sobers
Gilchrist
Imran / Hadlee / Wasim
Marshall
Warne / Muralitharan
McGrath

The seven bolded players are "close" to unanimous selections here with the other selected players generally getting a plurality of votes with those listed with them getting serious consideration for those spots. With Steyn / Ambrose / Simpson / Sutcliffe / O'Reilly getting the odd vote for first team selection.

There really isn't that large of a pool that people look at seriously for these exercises.
 
ataraxia

ataraxia

International Coach
I reckon if we poll CW, McGrath has got a 40% chance of not entering the 1st XI. I think he's the best fast bowler ever but he doesn't make my side – and I'm not the only one to place a premium on #batdeep and others don't particularly rate McGrath.
 
ataraxia

ataraxia

International Coach
Prince EWS said:
Hadlee should probably be above Davidson ahead on Tests alone but I do think Davo was a much better batsman than his Test output.

If I'm not going to include Grace I probably shouldn't bat Davo ahead of Hadlee though, good call..
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I think it's pretty clear that Davo was better than his test record, if to a smaller degree than Benaud and Miller, but I have always written off than average of 33 as Shield inflated. Is it, or does it include some impressive performances on county tours? Hard era for batting, I guess.

Biased over here, natch, but in addition to an FC average of 32, Hadlee did average 30 after he became such a good bowler in the 80s (i.e., was one of the best bats in the team). 10 years is Davidson's whole career.

Soundly reject the notion that FC performances don't matter, btw. I don't think these sides should be based on test performance, but rather on how they might perform in a hypothetical test. So of course test performances are very helpful, but I would play Barry in the 3rd XI and, if not for my sig caveat, play Grace in the 1st.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
ataraxia said:
I reckon if we poll CW, McGrath has got a 40% chance of not entering the 1st XI. I think he's the best fast bowler ever but he doesn't make my side – and I'm not the only one to place a premium on #batdeep and others don't particularly rate McGrath.
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Two points.

1. 40% against still leaves 60% for

2. When I made this point a few pages back, quite a few mentioned that they believed Pigeon also qualified and was a virtual lock, just going with the flow.
 
kyear2

kyear2

International Coach
ataraxia said:
I reckon if we poll CW, McGrath has got a 40% chance of not entering the 1st XI. I think he's the best fast bowler ever but he doesn't make my side – and I'm not the only one to place a premium on #batdeep and others don't particularly rate McGrath.
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Since it's a quiet Saturday afternoon .

Couple more points,
3. 2nd best

4. I agree with bat deep, but that's 8 and 9, at most 10. Should be at least able to pick two bowlers just for that discipline.

But yeah, my team is Hadlee, Marshall, Steyn and Murali, so 9 for me is deep enough I guess.
 
S

Silver Line

U19 Debutant
🇳🇱
Max O'Dowd
Steph Myburgh
Ryan Ten Doeschate
Tom Cooper
Bas De Leede
Scott Edwards (wk)
Logan Van Beek
Steven Lubbers
Roland Lefebvre
Paul Van Meekeren
Fred Klassen
 
H

HouHsiaoHsien

International Debutant
kyear2 said:
Viv is similar to Lillee from the perspective that it seems that his standing is based more on his aura and anecdotal evidence than cold statistics.
But his stats are they way they are (similar to Ponting) because of the precipitous decline at the end of his career.

But at the end of the day no batsman is perfect and they all have holes or "buts" in their resume. But he could turn a game on its head like no other.

But yeah
Viv - relatively short peak
Hammond - suspect vs genuine pace and some also claimed wrist spin.
Lara - inconsistent
Even Bradman could be argued - era / pitches / competition
Click to expand...
Viv’s stats are more superior to Lillee’s. He’s got the best home away record after Tendulkar, balanced across all 4 innings, strikes@70+. Viv had a fall in his last 3 years, but even after 1976-80(the best short term peak ever bar Bradman), from 1984-88, he was the best batsmen in the world. His second peak wasn’t as high as say Lara or Tendulkar, mostly because he didn’t have any minnows to bash or flat tracks to cash in. He also dominated more ATG and ATVG bowlers than anyone. Once you take in the intangibles that he brought along, he is clearly with Hobbs and Tendulkar as the best after Bradman(although would tanked Hobbs and Tendy slightly above him).
 
B

Bolo.

International Captain
ataraxia said:
I reckon if we poll CW, McGrath has got a 40% chance of not entering the 1st XI. I think he's the best fast bowler ever but he doesn't make my side – and I'm not the only one to place a premium on #batdeep and others don't particularly rate McGrath.
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Fails on account of variety for me too. Really don't want to play 2 RA channel bowlers, and I would sooner drop Sobers than Hadlee.
 
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