Reserve days

[Molehill]

Rubbish tactics in the first test , fourth innings when the game was in our favour and the braindead cricket from 188-1 in the first innings second test should also be part of the discussion for me.

Yep, all of that too. The failure to take the new ball as soon as it was available when Lyon came to the crease another bug bear for me. The extra over of Root got Cummins going.

 

[Ashes81]

No need for reserve days in tests.

Simply award the test to whichever country historically had the biggest empire.

 

[Burgey]

Yep, all of that too. The failure to take the new ball as soon as it was available when Lyon came to the crease another bug bear for me. The extra over of Root got Cummins going.

Presumably Aus pissing away decent batting conditions in Leeds and Manchester was just down to English brilliance though, because every other side plays its absolute best against them every time.

It’s just englands tireless resolve and wholeheartedness, despite only ever playing at 60-70% of their undoubted world beating potential which causes them to ever lose a game. It can’t ever be they were outplayed, or the other team is better. It’s the sort of thinking that leads to this “moral victory” bullshit which just glosses over their mediocrity. They’ve won four tosses and had the better of the conditions by miles, but they’re going home empty handed. Suck it up.

Not singling your post out in particular here btw, there’s just been too much of this one sided junk analysis all series from England fans. “If only we had been more circumspect” or “had we only made more runs than we actually did and it was all down to our own errors” is just terrible.

If you slog for living you’ll mostly **** up and make mistakes - that’s the price you buy it at. It’s as one dimensional as grinding out 180 in a day, and as easily exploited by better teams when you play them.

Sitting there and saying “we’re dominating, we score so fast, we’re saving test cricket - oh ****. Hang on, if only we’d been more careful we would have won” isn’t analysis, it’s just revisionism and wishful thinking that your team was better, because really, really good teams can adapt to the game and the situation as needed. England are not capable of that. They’ve slogged away and made one big total. Rest of the time their limitations have been exposed.

I’m not saying Aus in this series = a world beating side either btw, both sides have their issues and At various times have played both some really good and really average cricket

 

[Burgey]

Ok

 

[shortpitched713]

Draw in this case isn't down to England tactics, IMHO. No one can perfectly accurately predict the weather.

 

[Victor Ian]

Presumably Aus pissing away decent batting conditions in Leeds and Manchester was just down to English brilliance though, because every other side plays its absolute best against them every time.

It’s just englands tireless resolve and wholeheartedness, despite only ever playing at 60-70% of their undoubted world beating potential which causes them to ever lose a game. It can’t ever be they were outplayed, or the other team is better. It’s the sort of thinking that leads to this “moral victory” bull**** which just glosses over their mediocrity. They’ve won four tosses and had the better of the conditions by miles, but they’re going home empty handed. Suck it up.

Not singling your post out in particular here btw, there’s just been too much of this one sided junk analysis all series from England fans. “If only we had been more circumspect” or “had we only made more runs than we actually did and it was all down to our own errors” is just terrible.

If you slog for living you’ll mostly **** up and make mistakes - that’s the price you buy it at. It’s as one dimensional as grinding out 180 in a day, and as easily exploited by better teams when you play them.

Sitting there and saying “we’re dominating, we score so fast, we’re saving test cricket - oh ****. Hang on, if only we’d been more careful we would have won” isn’t analysis, it’s just revisionism and wishful thinking that your team was better, because really, really good teams can adapt to the game and the situation as needed. England are not capable of that. They’ve slogged away and made one big total. Rest of the time their limitations have been exposed.

I’m not saying Aus in this series = a world beating side either btw, both sides have their issues and At various times have played both some really good and really average cricket

Not going home empty handed...
Waking up at home empty handed.

 

[Molehill]

Presumably Aus pissing away decent batting conditions in Leeds and Manchester was just down to English brilliance though, because every other side plays its absolute best against them every time.

It’s just englands tireless resolve and wholeheartedness, despite only ever playing at 60-70% of their undoubted world beating potential which causes them to ever lose a game. It can’t ever be they were outplayed, or the other team is better. It’s the sort of thinking that leads to this “moral victory” bull**** which just glosses over their mediocrity. They’ve won four tosses and had the better of the conditions by miles, but they’re going home empty handed. Suck it up.

Not singling your post out in particular here btw, there’s just been too much of this one sided junk analysis all series from England fans. “If only we had been more circumspect” or “had we only made more runs than we actually did and it was all down to our own errors” is just terrible.

If you slog for living you’ll mostly **** up and make mistakes - that’s the price you buy it at. It’s as one dimensional as grinding out 180 in a day, and as easily exploited by better teams when you play them.

Sitting there and saying “we’re dominating, we score so fast, we’re saving test cricket - oh ****. Hang on, if only we’d been more careful we would have won” isn’t analysis, it’s just revisionism and wishful thinking that your team was better, because really, really good teams can adapt to the game and the situation as needed. England are not capable of that. They’ve slogged away and made one big total. Rest of the time their limitations have been exposed.

I’m not saying Aus in this series = a world beating side either btw, both sides have their issues and At various times have played both some really good and really average cricket

Things going well on that Cruise Ship I see.....

 

[Victor Ian]

One of things that is great about test cricket is that it's a bitch. It's hard to win with the things you can control, and even harder for the things you can't.

It's great that two teams can play a series and finish on equal terms. It's great that you can declare. Which other sport does that?

If we eliminate weather as an unfair factor, we will still be stuck with coin tosses, and unpredictable pitches.

In short...hahaha little bitches complaining. How's that perfect position looking now?

 

[Burgey]

Things going well on that Cruise Ship I see.....

Going great. Just sitting by the pool after a day trip at Napflio and logged in to see a zillion “we’re better but we just ****ed up” posts, so while I enjoyed another ****tail I thought I would add my two cents’ worth. I hope you don’t mind.

Next time you hit up Turkey you should buy some data. Turns out they do have the internet in the eastern Med.

Anyway, I’m off to talk with the art director about a Chagal.

 

[Molehill]

Going great. Just sitting by the pool after a day trip at Napflio and logged in to see a zillion “we’re better but we just ****ed up” posts, so while I enjoyed another ****tail I thought I would add my two cents’ worth. I hope you don’t mind.

Next time you hit up Turkey you should buy some data. Turns out they do have the internet in the eastern Med.

Anyway, I’m off to talk with the art director about a Chagal.

I have free roaming thanks...but you know, it's a holiday.

Anyway, back to your point. I'm fully aware of when England get outplayed, it happens pretty much every time we tour Australia (or India). But when there's clearly not much between the teams, as in this case, you tend to look at key moments where things might have worked out differently. I wasn't on here in 2019, but I bet you were bitching hard after the Headingly Test, and rightly so really.

I haven't once complained about the rain, I'm just looking at areas where England could've been better, and some pretty obvious moments stand out. That's not to say Australia couldn't have done some things differently too. I agree that whilst it's been entertaining, the actual quality of cricket at times has been wanting. Both sets of batsmen have found some proper daft ways to get out, and that's why it's not a patch on 2005 where the quality was so much higher on both sides.

Enjoy your ****tail......had quite a few in Turkey, although they were ****ing expensive compared to everything else there.

 

[chris.hinton]

I agree with @Burgey

England have a tendency of moaning when things don't go their way. Stokes didn't declare because he wanted his golf buddy to get into form and score runs. If we would have declared around lunch about 100 ahead. We could have got Australia 7-8 down for 130/140 and a better chance.

Problem is the media and silly types who run the Barmy Army social media simp for Ben Stokes and he can do anything and they will fall over themselves to defend him or justify what he does. All because we are playing attacking cricket. It's mental. The only one who opinion in England Cricket i value is Mark Butcher has he has his own opinions and doesn't beat the drum for Stokes, Equally he will praise him as well.

We do think we are the dogs bollocks now. And it doesn't sit well with me (Despite me being a parody on here) Joe Root mentioned "Lets play longer" well 2 years ago we struggled to bat a day anyway.

Australia have been average in this test series. Aside from Lords i've not really rated their batting (Saturday was really dogged and if they showed that in the previous test they would have won it ) . Cummins is the only bowler (since Lyon's injury) I've thought was world class. Starc has been to inconsistent

I think we will win the 5th test the momentum is with us still and I think the Aussies are more tired playing 6 tests in 8 weeks is just mental and people haven't realised it as its against two of the best sides as well. Don't get me started on the ECB and how they have reduced this event to a sideshow for the "Cash Cow"

 

[loterry1994]

Pretty funny how we got 3 test matches in windies, England and Sri Lanka and hardly a ball bowled the last 3 days

 

[honestbharani]

I think Australia have been less bad for longer than England have been AND have had the tests they were less bad in have a result. It has been a close series and it is pretty silly to think of it as anything else.

Australia played better in the two tests they won but unfortunately for England, the two tests they were better at, one of them got rained off. It happens. Just gotta take it on the chin and move on.

 

[Coronis]

I agree with @Burgey

 

[GIMH]

@Molehill is there a rule against posting when on holiday? I feel bad now about the amount of useless posts I made from the Dominican Reoublic

 

[honestbharani]

@Molehill is there a rule against posting when on holiday?

No, but there should be one against @Burgey posting, which I am sure you would agree.

 

[Burgey]

Both sets of batsmen have found some proper daft ways to get out, and that's why it's not a patch on 2005 where the quality was so much higher on both sides.

This is very good point imo. This series I’ve felt has been even or as an Aus supporter we’ve been slightly in front as often as not. 2005 was many times better, quality wise and I always felt we were chasing it once it was 1-1. Just felt that England team was less likely to surrender a good position than either of the current sides

I realise my response was to your post but it wasn’t intended to single you or it out. Often the initial position of everyone is to only see through the pra of their team’s errors. I do it as much as anyone. I just think there’s a narrative developing in the wide cricket community that it’s been all about England missing moments, when as always it’s been a lot more than just that .

 

[Qlder]

If we would have declared around lunch about 100 ahead. We could have got Australia 7-8 down for 130/140 and a better chance.

Proof English fans are living in fantasy land.

England were 189 runs ahead at lunch (nearly twice the 100 wanted) and if they declared Aus would have only got 14 more overs as Eng only batted 12 overs after lunch for 86 runs (would have saved 2 overs changeover)

As Aus made 4-113 as it was, how would they have been "7-8 down for 130/140" with 14 more overs? And of course they ended up 4-159 after 14 more overs which would have made them only 30 runs behind instead of the 162 behind they actually ended up being end of 4th day

Eng declaring any sooner than lunch would mean Aus heading into 5th day with a lead

 

[Adders]

This is very good point imo. This series I’ve felt has been even or as an Aus supporter we’ve been slightly in front as often as not. 2005 was many times better, quality wise and I always felt we were chasing it once it was 1-1. Just felt that England team was less likely to surrender a good position than either of the current sides

I realise my response was to your post but it wasn’t intended to single you or it out. Often the initial position of everyone is to only see through the pra of their team’s errors. I do it as much as anyone. I just think there’s a narrative developing in the wide cricket community that it’s been all about England missing moments, when as always it’s been a lot more than just that .

Good from you!

The great thing about this series is its been a true arm wrestle all the way (bar the last test)......the cricket hasn't been the greatest quality but it's been enthralling and take all the BS banter out of it there has been very little between the sides over 4 tests.

Eng haven't been robbed by the rain....but I really feel the series has. 2-2 and a 5th test decider is what such a close fought contest totally warranted imo.

 

[Line and Length]

No need for 'Reserve Days'. The weather/light has always been a factor in games/series. It comes down to a degree of luck. England may complain about their bad luck with the weather... Australia about their bad luck with the toss.
As for criticism of Stokes re declarations and non-declarations, the majority of these are in hindsight.
It's been a good series played in a good spirit (apart from a minor glitch) and hopefully the 5th Test will be a fitting finale.