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Kevin Pietersen vs VVS Laxman

Who was the better test batsman?

  • Total voters
    42
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
Also you are shifting goal posts here. You said KP had an extra gear and VVS didn't play counter attacking knocks against great attacks. This was proven false so you have decided to rank KP higher for having a better SR in general.
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I give credit to KP for being more attacking / destructive. I have always been consistent that in statistically close comparisons like this one, I choose the more aggressive and better rated player.
 
trundler

trundler

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subshakerz said:
KP is simply more proven against ATG Australia
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lol no.


subshakerz said:
You conceded that KP has more classic quality knocks.
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I said the exact opposite because it's true. Learn to read. Or don't lie. Whichever applies.
subshakerz said:
You want to claim long career yet exclude his opening year.
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He has a 4+ year longer career excluding the opener phase. Including it, his career is twice as long.
subshakerz said:
KP played 4 tests against Bangladesh. Wow.
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To VVS's 3. And he filled his boots against an awful WI side. VVS didn't. VVS averaged more against Australia. His average is less cushioned by cashing in against weaker sides. You are making KP into someone who only showed up against the best which is false. And VVS was better against the best team of his time anyway.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
Being England's best bat is dependent as much on the rest of the team. VVS's best against McWarne > KP's best against McWarne. VVS against Australia > KP against Australia. VVS's best > KP's best. VVS's career > KP's career.
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That isn't true. KP is better against McWarne.
 
trundler

trundler

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subshakerz said:
I give credit to KP for being more attacking / destructive. I have always been consistent that in statistically close comparisons like this one, I choose the more aggressive and better rated player.
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It isn't close though. And it's quite a different claim from "VVS couldn't play counter attacking knocks". You should at the very least admit this was a false claim.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
To VVS's 3. And he filled his boots against an awful WI side. VVS didn't. VVS averaged more against Australia. His average is less cushioned by cashing in against weaker sides. You are making KP into someone who only showed up against the best which is false. And VVS was better against the best team of his time anyway.
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No. You brought in ATG Australia.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
And VVS was better. You rate KP for doing well against Australia and playing marquee knocks but VVS does better on both as well as conventional consistency metrics.
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Those weren't my original reasons at all. I am just rebutting the points you made in Laxman's favor. Saying Laxman outperformed KP against the best Aussie team or played more marquee knocks is just false.

My points, to reiterate:

KP is more attacking / destructive

KP generally batted up the order more, Laxman had a cushion with a strong batting lineup and down the order


Record-wise, there isn't a huge difference but otherwise I do think KP is notably ahead on these points.
 
BazBall21

BazBall21

International Captain
In fairness, Laxman averages highly against post-Ambrose/Walsh WI too. WI 2006 away was a miss for him. He didn't pad against Bangladesh and Zimbabwe but he dealt with WI, especially at home.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
Superficial. VVS had plenty of attacking knocks.
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We are talking about average play. It's not a once in a while thing but his normal style hence his 61 SR whereas Laxman is sub 50. This is why KP was feared, he could shift momentum in a game quickly.

If you think that is superficial, ok we can disagree. I think that this playing style is important.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
subshakerz said:
Those weren't my original reasons at all. I am just rebutting the points you made in Laxman's favor. Saying Laxman outperformed KP against the best Aussie team or played more marquee knocks is just false.

My points, to reiterate:

KP is more attacking / destructive

KP generally batted up the order more, Laxman had a cushion with a strong batting lineup and down the order


Record-wise, there isn't a huge difference but otherwise I do think KP is notably ahead on these points.
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Times KP batted 1-3: 3
Times Laxman batted 1-3: 62
 
trundler

trundler

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subshakerz said:
We are talking about average play. It's not a once in a while thing but his normal style hence his 61 SR. This is why KP was feared, he could shift momentum in a game quickly.

If you think that is superficial, ok we can disagree. I think that this playing style is important.
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You backed the claim that VVS didn't have a 5th gear. This is where the discussion streamed from. This is false. No two ways about this.
 
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