The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[bagapath]

I had no clue...how many tests did NZ play at home in the 80s? And against which teams? How many tests did they actually win?

easy to find answers to such questions, actually

ESPNcricinfo.com Statsguru - New Zealand - Test matches - Team analysis

stats.espncricinfo.com

NZ were unbeaten at home in the 1980s. I wonder if the Saffas would have beaten them (remember NZ has never beaten SA in a test series).

Probably not... New Zealand beat everyone at home... the mighty West Indies couldn't better them... neither could Pakistan...
Paddles would probably have blown the Saffers away

26

902

103

31.10

1

119

7/116

21.12

10

13

0

9.97

 

[Coronis]

NZ were unbeaten at home in the 1980s. I wonder if the Saffas would have beaten them (remember NZ has never beaten SA in a test series).

Possibly, who knows. Dependant on weather and Hadlee’s performances, most likely the series would either end up a 0-0 draw or a 1-1 draw. (Assuming early 80’s) NZ would be more likely to snag a 1-0 victory in the late 80’s I think.

 

[bagapath]

Possibly, who knows. Dependant on weather and Hadlee’s performances, most likely the series would either end up a 0-0 draw or a 1-1 draw. (Assuming early 80’s) NZ would be more likely to snag a 1-0 victory in the late 80’s I think.

on the contrary... as stats reveal.... they are more likely to win the series up to mid 80s and steal a draw post that.

 

[bagapath]

Richard hadlee missed three home tests in the '80s; two against Eng in 87 and one against Pak in 88; and both the series ended in stalemates.

The two matches New Zealand lost to Australia in '82 and West Indies in '87 also featured superhuman efforts from Hadlee (7 wickets and 40 runs / 6 wickets) but Greg Chappell and Gordon Greenidge pulled off classic match winning knocks to level those two series.

The remaining six series that New Zealand played at home in the '80s ended in series victories for the hosts against six different opponents (West Indies, India, Sri Lanka, England, Pakistan, Australia). And in each of those encounters Hadlee played the decisive, match winning roles.

If his name is ever proposed as the greatest cricketer of all time, that should not surprise anyone.

 

[TheJediBrah]

also featured superhuman efforts from Hadlee (7 wickets and 40 runs / 6 wickets)

Bit of a tangent, but "superhuman efforts"? Those are above average games sure but people take 6-7 wickets a game all the time

 

[bagapath]

all the time? okay if you feel that way.

that 6-100 was a superhuman effort indeed as was the 176. one of them ended on the losing side. but both were gold, for sure.

 

[Coronis]

on the contrary... as stats reveal.... they are more likely to win the series up to mid 80s and steal a draw post that.

I’ll be honest I was only looking from the SA team pov and their relative strength throughout the decade.

 

[TheJediBrah]

all the time? okay if you feel that way.

that 6-100 was a superhuman effort indeed as was the 176. one of them ended on the losing side. but both were gold, for sure.

Taking 6 wickets in a match isn't rare, that's all I'm saying. Not really anyone's definition of "superhuman". Just being pedantic

 

[bagapath]

tendulkars 136 against pak was superhuman coz he was up against a great bowling attack

the six fer here was superhuman coz Hadlee was a lone hand. And was up against Chappell carving out a classic.

not all six fers and 130 s are superhuman. But sometimes even a four fer or a fifty can be.

if anyone defines any superlative only by numbers they’re not really getting the point.

 

[TheJediBrah]

if anyone defines any superlative only by numbers they’re not really getting the point.

It's also extremely subjective . . . personally I've never seen anything on a cricket field I would label as such

but yeah as I said didn't mean anything by it just being pedantic and I can see how that would be annoying. My bad

 

[CricAddict]

It's also extremely subjective . . . personally I've never seen anything on a cricket field I would label as such

but yeah as I said didn't mean anything by it just being pedantic and I can see how that would be annoying. My bad

One cannot use any superlative if one has to go by its exact meaning every time ? anyways, I see you have gone amicable on this. So, all good.

 

[TheJediBrah]

I see you have gone amicable on this

happens once a year

 

[ankitj]

Throughout the 80s, only team WI lost a series to is New Zealand. That's a staggering fact.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Pound-for-pound best sporting nation in the world, change my mind

 

[bagapath]

Throughout the 80s, only team WI lost a series to is New Zealand. That's a staggering fact.

West Indies finally won a series in New Zealand in feb 1995 (Walsh took 13 wkts in the match) and then their unbeaten streak ended after 15 years the very next month against Australia.

 

[_00_deathscar]

Pound-for-pound best sporting nation in the world, change my mind

Nah sheep weigh a lot

 

[jayjay]

easy to find answers to such questions, actually

ESPNcricinfo.com Statsguru - New Zealand - Test matches - Team analysis

stats.espncricinfo.com

Probably not... New Zealand beat everyone at home... the mighty West Indies couldn't better them... neither could Pakistan...
Paddles would probably have blown the Saffers away

26

902

103

31.10

1

119

7/116

21.12

10

13

0

9.97

Yeo, statsguru is great, but thought you'd offer more.

 

[bagapath]

Yeo, statsguru is great, but thought you'd offer more.

you asked "how many tests did NZ play at home in the 80s? And against which teams? How many tests did they actually win?"
that link shud cover them all.

if you had deeper queries like origin of life etc then this wouldn't be enough I agree.

 

[bagapath]

In my subsequent posts I had mentioned the following...

1. Hadlee played 26 of the 29 home tests in the 1980s.
2. NZ lost only two of the 26 games he played; with supreme batting performances from G Chappell and G Greenidge that blunted Hadlee's venom for a change.
3. Of the three tests he missed, two were against England and one was against Pak. Both series ended in draws.
4. Otherwise New Zealand beat every opponent at home between 1980 and 1986.
5. It is possible that NZ would have been SA at home in the first half of the 80s if Hadlee was firing on all cylinders.

 

[jayjay]

In my subsequent posts I had mentioned the following...

1. Hadlee played 26 of the 29 home tests in the 1980s.
2. NZ lost only two of the 26 games he played; with supreme batting performances from G Chappell and G Greenidge that blunted Hadlee's venom for a change.
3. Of the three tests he missed, two were against England and one was against Pak. Both series ended in draws.
4. Otherwise New Zealand beat every opponent at home between 1980 and 1986.
5. It is possible that NZ would have been SA at home in the first half of the 80s if Hadlee was firing on all cylinders.

That's more like it!

And yes, there are few players in the history of the game who carried the fortunes of their team like Hadlee and NZ in the 70s and 80s.