*Official* Ross Taylor's last series memorial thread

[Flem274*]

I don't get the Macewell pick tbh. The rest is pretty conservative and guessable.

George Worker should be there. Putting aside the dominant stats, he passes the eye test over Michael Bracewell too imo.

Also not keen on Sodhi in odis and would prefer KJ to get loads of red ball bowling in. I would have picked Walker/Lennox and another young quick (happy to let Sears return to red ball).

 

[Fuller Pilch]

They are obviously happy with the Guptill-Nicholls opening partnership, but Worker is very unlucky.

 

[nzfan]

Our one day squad looks like this

Guptill
Young
Nicholls
Taylor
Latham
Chapman
Bracewell
CDG
Henry
Sodhi
Tickener

Obviously they'll smash the dutch with that sort of experience but feel like we have absolutely no future planning. I'm in the same boat as @Flem274* with regards to Bracewell in one day squad but that said it'll be good for other firebirds bowlers. They'll get that extra 60 overs to bowl.

 

[nzfan]

They are obviously happy with the Guptill-Nicholls opening partnership, but Worker is very unlucky.

Yeah I'd think Worker would have been ahead of Michael Bracewell or even Chapman in that regards.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Would definitely prefer Shipley and/or N Smith

Hadn't seen that Doug Bracewell's in the squad too. I don't see any need for Kuggeleijn and Bracewell. Personally, I'd have neither. They're the past. I don't see either ever becoming a first-choice selection and think it's time to move on from them.

EDIT: It's been time to move on from Kuggeleijn for a long time, tbf.

 

[Flem274*]

Putting aside my caveats about Kuggs, I'm happy for he and Dougeh to have a second coming (Cdg, Elliott, O'Brien) but I'd want to see domestic dominance first. CdG has a case for domestic mvp.

 

[vandem]

... A lone spinner in the squad when we'll need like 2-3 over in India for the world cup. I think this will come back and bite us bad in future....

2 spinners. I don't think Michael Bracewell would be in the team if he didn't bowl spin (and spins it in a different direction to 1st choice Santner + Sodhi) and there wasn't a ODI world cup in India next year. He is a realistic option for ODI batting all-rounder / 6th bowler spot currently filled by de Grandhomme.

 

[Prince EWS]

Yeah I'd like more spin bowling options. It would be funny if Rippon takes lots of wickets in the series for the Dutch.

In a way you've got a bonus player on trial, against better opposition.

 

[vandem]

Yeah I'd like more spin bowling options. It would be funny if Rippon takes lots of wickets in the series for the Dutch.

I can't recall 3 spin options in a starting XI in NZ. Astle and Sodhi have been in the T20I squad alongside Santner, but only one of the leggies played.

They could have picked Ravindra (or McConchie) in a 14 player squad, but I assume they wanted to see M Bracewell over a complete series, and were happy to let Ravindra get more domestic opening batting experience.

 

[nzfan]

I can't recall 3 spin options in a starting XI in NZ. Astle and Sodhi have been in the T20I squad alongside Santner, but only one of the leggies played.

They could have picked Ravindra (or McConchie) in a 14 player squad, but I assume they wanted to see M Bracewell over a complete series, and were happy to let Ravindra get more domestic opening batting experience.

That's one positive definitely in my opinion. Picking Ravindra in one day squad and batting him at like no.7 with few overs would be detrimental. It doesn't make sense picking a top order batter and batting him at 7.

I can't recall a Michael Bracewell hundred for firebirds at all in one day cricket unless I'm mistaken but he does bat at like 5 so hard to score lots of 100s. I don't recall Bracewell scoring much for firebirds this year in one day cricket but has been in stellar form in t20s though. Definitely want him to do well though I think his bowling won't cut at top level. Besides he's only been bowling in the last couple of seasons and has had very little NZ A experience so only time will tell.

Whatever happened to Astle experiement? He played vs India when we last toured.

You read a lot about consistency in selections in Black Caps but I see that trend changing. Plenty of players coming and going of late. Not a bad thing as it gives a chance to figure teams out keeping world cups in mind but can't say selections have been consistent since about a year's time.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

In a way you've got a bonus player on trial, against better opposition.

Might be why they gave him the green light tbf

 

[Magrat Garlick]

also oh god the figures Jamieson might get against a batting order that has Pieter Seelaar at four

 

[nzfan]

also oh god the figures Jamieson might get against a batting order that has Pieter Seelaar at four

My pick for the most wickets in the one day series.

 

[Immenso]

Whatever happened to Astle experiement? He played vs India when we last toured.

I know he retired from domestic red ball, but perhaps he has also retired from 50-over stuff? He didn't play Ford Trophy.

I've been a big Astle fan, but once players retire from 4 day stuff, may as well shut door and say good night. Got to be a real pro like Guppy and play everything to stay fit, to be in form and to be ready. Or be a true franchise wanderer like Munro, (and be good enough to actually get contracts), not that this path is relevant for NZ selection anyway.

Astle has bowled 44 overs all season. Forget about it.

 

[vandem]

... Whatever happened to Astle experiement? He played vs India when we last toured.

You read a lot about consistency in selections in Black Caps but I see that trend changing. Plenty of players coming and going of late. Not a bad thing as it gives a chance to figure teams out keeping world cups in mind but can't say selections have been consistent since about a year's time.

I think it is only a handful of fringe players that have come into the squads. The players dropped / not selected make sense to me.

I checked 2020-21 T20I and ODI squads (but ignored the "2nd XI" tour to Bangaldesh), there are only 3 players who aren't going to IPL or in the squads announced today: Bennett, Duffy, Astle.

Tickner + Sears + Kuggs preferred over Bennett + Duffy, OK by me
Astle missing because they only picked 13 player squads (no room for a 3rd spinner) and they want to watch M Bracewell as a possible World Cup option (edit - or perhaps Astle's time has past, as per Immenso in the post above), OK by me

edit - removed Seifert comment, he is off to IPL,

 

[Immenso]

Might be why they gave him the green light tbf

Definitely.

 

[Immenso]

Our one day squad 11 looks like this

Guptill
Young
Nicholls
Taylor
Latham
Chapman
Bracewell D
CDG
Henry
Sodhi
Tickener

Man, it's an old team even with 12 players missing. All but 3 of them are over 30. And the 3 that aren't are 2 x 29 years olds and a 27 year old.

The 2 extras in the squad are a 30 year old and 27 year old.

And we are discussing that the unlucky player to miss out ... who is 33 years old.

Talent cliff ahoy!

 

[nzfan]

I think it is only a handful of fringe players that have come into the squads. The players dropped / not selected make sense to me.

I checked 2020-21 T20I and ODI squads (but ignored the "2nd XI" tour to Bangaldesh), there are only 3 players who aren't going to IPL or in the squads announced today: Bennett, Duffy, Astle.

Tickner + Sears + Kuggs preferred over Bennett + Duffy, OK by me
Astle missing because they only picked 13 player squads (no room for a 3rd spinner) and they want to watch M Bracewell as a possible World Cup option (edit - or perhaps Astle's time has past, as per Immenso in the post above), OK by me

edit - removed Seifert comment, he is off to IPL,

I'm not saying the replacements don't deserve to be there but there is a lot of shuffling around of late which is a bit unusual. Rutherford, Fletcher and Tickener made the red ball squad vs South Africa. They played Ravindra in few games, both t20s and red ball cricket, they had him in the squad vs Bangladesh/Pakistan but thought excess at home. Cole McConchie was in the squad to Pakistan and Bangladesh but no more sight of him. Duffy played couple of games admirably but then finds himself out of favor despite being in the squad to Bangladesh and Pakistan. Few more selections and omissions I'm sure over the last year. Ajaz was the leading wicket taker in Bangladesh t20s I think and was also part of the squad to Pakistan. Tom Blundell played vs Bangladesh in Bangladesh but now I guess confined to red ball cricket. Dane is now in and Fletcher out from white ball cricket. That's a lot of shuffling.

I feel like there is impatience and lack of confidence in up and coming players. We're now consistently going about selecting players that are over 30s is a clear indication of that or maybe they don't want to turn up younger side, lose games and lose confidence of the public. Safe bet is to pick bunch of older players for a bilateral series like this and beat them in every game.

Don't have a problem with the squad to be honest and in a way it's good few deserving candidates are getting a go.

 

[nzfan]

I guess the worse thing to come out of this is the players that are not selected feeling they are not even good enough to feature against an associate side. If one does well, no one cares because it's vs an associate side and if one doesn't go well they'll probably walk away thinking they are not even good enough vs an associate side. Suppose it's a no win position for a lot of players.

 

[Prince EWS]

I know he retired from domestic red ball, but perhaps he has also retired from 50-over stuff? He didn't play Ford Trophy.

I've been a big Astle fan, but once players retire from 4 day stuff, may as well shut door and say good night. Got to be a real pro like Guppy and play everything to stay fit, to be in form and to be ready. Or be a true franchise wanderer like Munro, (and be good enough to actually get contracts), not that this path is relevant for NZ selection anyway.

Astle has bowled 44 overs all season. Forget about it.

He's also gone wicketless at about 10rpo in his last four consecutive games.