• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Is Ashwin an ATG spinner / player?

Nikhil99.94

Nikhil99.94

School Boy/Girl Captain
I would say England’s all time xi would have the highest chance of beating ind in ind.
Gavasker
Sehwag
Dravid
Sachin
Kohli(c)
Dhoni(wk)
Dev
Jadeja
Ashwin
Shami/Kumble/Chandra/Gupte
Bumrah

Vs
Hobbs
Cook(wanted to have someone who has proved in ind so)
Hammond
Root(c) (has more experience as captain than anyone in the team except cook but has better win percentage than cook)
Barrington
Botham
Knott(wk)
Verity
Underwood
Laker/Willis
Barnes

Would be good to see 2 of the best of this generation leading their team.
Both teams batting and spin is solid.imo Barnes vs bumrah would decide the battle.
 
Last edited:
M

ma1978

International Debutant
aq
subshakerz said:
When has he won matches away the way he has done at home?
Click to expand...
No bowler in history has won matches the way he has done at home.

The fact of the matter is that no team has ever been as successful at home as Kohli's Indian team. And that is a historically relevant fact that drives ATG status. The great West Indians and Australians were never this dominant. And you can't just blame this on spinning pitches.
 
The Sean

The Sean

Cricketer Of The Year
ma1978 said:
The fact of the matter is that no team has ever been as successful at home as Kohli's Indian team. And that is a historically relevant fact that drives ATG status. The great West Indians and Australians were never this dominant. And you can't just blame this on spinning pitches.
Click to expand...
That's interesting - is that by match/series winning % or some other metric? I'm not doubting you, I'd just never seen that stated as a fact before.
 
srbhkshk

srbhkshk

International Captain
The Sean said:
That's interesting - is that by match/series winning % or some other metric? I'm not doubting you, I'd just never seen that stated as a fact before.
Click to expand...
Can find a period of very similar domination for Australia, but it was slightly shorter than India (although had more matches).

From the start of 2013 to now - India have played 40 matches at home, winning 32 and losing 2.

Between 5 Nov 1999 till the end of 2007 - Australia played 52 matches at home, winning 43 and losing 2.
 
The Sean

The Sean

Cricketer Of The Year
srbhkshk said:
Can find a period of very similar domination for Australia, but it was slightly shorter than India (although had more matches).

From the start of 2013 to now - India have played 40 matches at home, winning 32 and losing 2.

Between 5 Nov 1999 till the end of 2007 - Australia played 52 matches at home, winning 43 and losing 2.
Click to expand...
Thanks - that's an incredible win rate.
 
M

ma1978

International Debutant
Wow - I forgot how dominant that Aus team was. I always thought SA snuck several wins in that time.
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
As mentioned, there is a long history of subcontinent spinners having impressive figures and winning plenty of matches at home, from Prasanna, Bedi, Qadir, Kumble, Herath, Ajmal, Yasir Shah and Jadeja. Nobody cares. Why? Because they are expected to be HTBs. That is why they are picked. Ashwin is nothing new in this regard.

Saying that Ashwin is a better HTB than than other HTBs as his claim to greatness is honestly a silly argument to make to be an ATG. Nobody should take it seriously. A HTB by definition is not ATG material because it means there is a serious limitation in your abilities.

A spinner who is a worldclass threat at home as well as away is very rare, as are ATG spinners who can do this over a career.
 
Last edited:
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
ma1978 said:
aq


No bowler in history has won matches the way he has done at home.

The fact of the matter is that no team has ever been as successful at home as Kohli's Indian team. And that is a historically relevant fact that drives ATG status. The great West Indians and Australians were never this dominant. And you can't just blame this on spinning pitches.
Click to expand...
You act as if Ashwin takes wickets @15 with a strikerate in the 30s in India. His figures are impressive but not earthshattering. Just to compare, Philander's figures at home (average of 19 with 43 strikerate) are actually better than Ashwin, and he is no ATG.

And I dont care about dominant home records as long as it is met with success overseas. India in the 90s were the only team unbeaten at home but it meant nothing. And dont ignore that India's home dominance is not just about Ashwin, but Jadeja too.
 
Last edited:
Shri

Shri

Mr. Glass
Nikhil99.94 said:
Ashwins overseas stats include same SC as well overseas means out of ind for ash and outside of aus for Gary,stats of Lyon in ind is a average of 30.58 ,whereas his overall overseas stats is similar too it so it isn’t bowling in ind which make his overseas stats better,Lyon and ashwin have been pretty much equals outside their home.So,even excluding ind for Lyon (which doesn’t make any difference in his overseas stats ) their overseas stats are almost similar.
They both have been almost equals overseas ,as I was replying to the person who said no one is anywhere near ash and no one has anywhere near record.
And I amnot saying Lyon is better or anything I am just saying Lyon has been almost ashwins equal.
Click to expand...
Yeah and you have worms in your brain bc
 
Shri

Shri

Mr. Glass
subshakerz said:
If Ashwin wants to be called an ATG then his comparison is not with contemporary spinners but with the best who ever played the game. And dont give this declining pitch argument for why he has failed to win matches in SENA, something even lesser spinners like Yasir Shah, Lyon and Herath have managed to do.

Ashwin has had multiple opportunities where the match has been set up in his favor and he didnt seal the deal, such as Wanderers 2013, Centurion 2018 or Southhampton 2018.
Click to expand...
It was not an argument for anything you moron. It's just how pitches are these days as I have actually spoken to people who know **** about aus cricket pitches in Australia.

As for your other ****, it is not what I was talking about so it's not worth my time
 
S

subshakerz

Hall of Fame Member
Shri said:
It was not an argument for anything you moron. It's just how pitches are these days as I have actually spoken to people who know **** about aus cricket pitches in Australia.

As for your other ****, it is not what I was talking about so it's not worth my time
Click to expand...
So because of pitches these days he is unable to win a match in SENA?
 
anil1405

anil1405

International Captain
subshakerz said:
So because of pitches these days he is unable to win a match in SENA?
Click to expand...
What do you mean by a winning performance in SENA? You expect him to take 6 or 7 or 8 wickets in an innings?

Ash taking a 5 fer in SENA will be rare because of the potent pace unit that India has had over the past 3-4 years and most likely to have till Ash retires for sure.

For me, if he does the job that captain expects him to, like picked few wickets when needed is a good enough job in those conditions. Like how he had Smith's number in the recent tour.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Top