Establishing the best decade for cricket: Finding the ATG XI from 12 decades of test cricket - then having a KO tourney to decide the best

[The Sean]

Why are people picking Lloyd over Miandad for the 1970s team? Captaincy? There is literally 20 runs difference between them in Test match batting averages in the 1970s and Miandad made almost as many centuries in half as many matches as Lloyd.

I could have gone either way - I picked Lloyd for captaincy, fielding and big away performances, noting that Javed had a massively skewed home v away record in the 1970s (averaged 140 at home and 39 away), and I'm going to pick him for the 1980s team.

On that note, why did you vote for Kanhai over Walters to bat at five in the 1960s side? There is a 17 point difference in Test match batting averages, Walters made 70% as many centuries in just over 40% of the innings, and during the entire decade Rohan Kanhai batted a total of zero times at number five in Test cricket.

 

[Flametree]

#6 will be interesting too. Lloyd and Abbas would be the front running specialists imo while Mushtaq Mo and Botham deserve a place in the top 7 too. Could slot in Botham at 8 which would be fair enough considering he was picking up more wickets per match than Willis in the 70s. Then you could fit in one more all rounder. But then Holding, Snow, Willis and Thomson...

Zaheer's average at the end of 1979 was below 40 so if performances in the decade matter more than overall record, I think it's Lloyd (or Javed if Lloyd gets the 5 spot) or an allrounder...

 

[morgieb]

Yeah Javed’s 70’s record I don’t think is anywhere near as good as it looks. Pakistani wickets were massive roads back then and he also played a fair bit in the WSC era (where a lot of the top players were unavailable from international cricket) and didn’t play all that much in the 70’s. Lloyd’s record was much better rounded. Lloyd’s captaincy was a tick in his favour too.

 

[TheJediBrah]

I could have gone either way - I picked Lloyd for captaincy, fielding and big away performances, noting that Javed had a massively skewed home v away record in the 1970s (averaged 140 at home and 39 away), and I'm going to pick him for the 1980s team.

On that note, why did you vote for Kanhai over Walters to bat at five in the 1960s side? There is a 17 point difference in Test match batting averages, Walters made 70% as many centuries in just over 40% of the innings, and during the entire decade Rohan Kanhai batted a total of zero times at number five in Test cricket.

damn

 

[mr_mister]

Miandad sneaks in over LLoyd 6-5

Boycott
Gavaskar
Richards
G Chappell
Miandad
-
-
Underwood
Lillee
Roberts
-

Pick the number 6
Pick the wicketkeeper
Pick the 3rd pacemen

 

[mr_mister]

Botham
Knott
Thomson

 

[Line and Length]

Botham
Knott
Holding

 

[honestbharani]

Lloyd would have been good as a left hander in a line up otherwise full of right handers too.

 

[Slifer]

Sobers
Knott
Holding

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Mushtaq Mohammed
Knott
Botham

 

[ankitj]

Couldn't keep pace with this thread. Will be great to see all teams together at the end and will try to participate in the voting at that stage.

 

[Flametree]

Sobers (1200 @ 52 in the decade. Throw in 900+ at 56 for the RoW in England and Australia and he's hard to go past for the batting allrounder spot....)
Knott
Botham

 

[mr_mister]

Teams so far:

1870s/80s/90s:

WG Grace* 6
Bobby Abel
Arthur Shrewsbury
KS Ranji
Billy Murdoch
AG Steel 5
Jack Blackham +
Bobby Peel 4
George Lohmann 2
Charlie Turner 3
Fred Spofforth 1

1900s/1910s:

Jack Hobbs
Victor Trumper
Clem Hill
Aubrey Faulkner 5
Stanley Jackson *
Monty Noble 6
Frank Foster 2
Dick Lilley +
Tibby Cotter 3
Sydney Barnes 1
Colin Blythe 4

1920s:

Jack Hobbs
Herb Sutcliffe
Charlie Macartney 7
Wally Hammond 5
Herbie Taylor *
Frank Woolley 6
Jack Gregory 2
Maurice Tate 1
Bert Oldfield +
Clarrie Grimmett 4
Ted Mcdonald 3

1930s:

Len Hutton
Bruce Mitchell
Don Bradman *
George Headley
Wally Hammond 5
Stan McCabe 6
Les Ames +
Harold Larwood 1
Hedley Verity 4
Bill O'Reilly 3
Manny Martindale 2

1940s:

Len Hutton
Arthur Morris
Don Bradman *
Denis Compton 5
Dudley Nourse
Everton Weekes
Keith Miller 2
Don Tallon+
Ray Lindwall 1
Jack Cowie 3
Bill Johnston 4

1950s:

Len Hutton *
Hanif Mohammad
Neil Harvey
Everton Weekes
Clyde Walcott
Gary Sobers 5
John Waite +
Allan Davidson 3
Jim Laker 4
Alec Bedser 2
Fred Trueman 1

1960s:

Bob Simpson * 6
Bill Lawry
Ken Barrington
Graeme Pollock
Rohan Kanhai
Gary Sobers 5
Denis Lindsay +
Allan Davidson 2
Peter Pollock 3
Fred Trueman 1
Lance Gibbs 4

1970s:

Geoff Boycott
Sunil Gavaskar
Viv Richards
Greg Chappell
Javed Miandad
-
-
Derek Underwood
Dennis Lillee 1
Andy Roberts 2
-

 

[271 & 16/166]

Tony Greig, worth a vote, great bowling numbers to support his batting and throw in his captaincy
Allan Knott
Bob Willis, try again to get him in

This from an Aussie too!

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Hadn't really thought about all the all rounders in the 70s before. There was late career Sobers, Mushtaq Mo, Greig, young Botham and Kapil (Hadlee and Imran still learning their craft) and the likes of Procter, Barlow, and Rice not playing tests due to apartheid and bans. Quite a list.

 

[Engle]

Tony Greig
Alan Knott
Jeff Thomson

 

[The Sean]

With all respect to Rod Marsh, Knott is a lock as the 'keeper here. It's a coin flip for me between Mushtaq and Greig for the number six slot - I'm going with Mushtaq but I really don't mind either way.

The last bowler is tough - I really wanted to get Thommo into the side, but the way things have shaped up if I pick him now I reckon the tail (Lillee-Thommo-Underwood-Roberts) is just too long. So it has to be Beefy.

Mushtaq Mohammad
Alan Knott
Ian Botham

 

[mr_mister]

for some reason I thought Underwood was a decent bat so I pencilled him in at 8. But I was thinking of Illingworth

 

[The Sean]

for some reason I thought Underwood was a decent bat so I pencilled him in at 8. But I was thinking of Illingworth

Yeah, he's a genuine tailender. And that's the problem I found - if we pick Thommo (or Holding, or Willis) we'll have four blokes averaging sub-15 from 8-11. That's a long tail for any team, particularly the all-time level we're dealing with here.

EDIT - to be fair, Lillee actually averaged all of 16 with the bat in the 1970s. But Roberts averaged single figures!

 

[mr_mister]

Yeah, he's a genuine tailender. And that's the problem I found - if we pick Thommo (or Holding, or Willis) we'll have four blokes averaging sub-15 from 8-11. That's a long tail for any team, particularly the all-time level we're dealing with here.

EDIT - to be fair, Lillee actually averaged all of 16 with the bat in the 1970s. But Roberts averaged single figures!

for whats its worth(possibly not much) Bradman batted Lillee at 8 in his all time XI

1. Barry Richards – South Africa
2. Arthur Morris – Australia
3. Don Bradman – Australia
4. Sachin Tendulkar – India
5. Gary Sobers – West Indies
6. Don Tallon – Australia
7. Ray Lindwall – Australia
8. Dennis Lillee – Australia
9. Alec Bedser – England
10. Bill O’Reilly – Australia
11. Clarrie Grimmett – Australia
12. Wally Hammond – England