Kapil, Vaas, or Streak? (Best bowler)

[Fuller Pilch]

Hayden's 380 probably didn't help

 

[Gob]

Streak wasn't actually that consistent, at least not over the span of his entire career. He had a career of 2 halves. Early Streak was a genuine world class bowler, he averaged 22.9 after his first 30 tests. Now admittedly, he wasn't playing against South Africa or Australia much at all, but they're excellent figures all the same .

Then something happened, I'm not sure if it was injury, or whether the deterioration of the political situation took its tool on his training practices and mental health. But either way, he averaged 35 over his last 35 tests. Still not terrible, but very mediocre. He did play 6 of those 35 tests v SA and Aus, but that shouldn't be sufficient to bump his average up by 12 runs, especially when you consider that he also played 6 tests against a very weak Bangladesh side. Does anyone know why Streak's numbers dropped off so drastically?

Well his hot streak ended

 

[Gob]

Well his hot streak ended

Lol

 

[Bahnz]

Hayden's 380 probably didn't help

Yeah, his tours of SA and Aus in the early 00's were abysmal (4 wickets at about 105 apiece), but even if you subtract those, he's still averaging about 32 per wicket, and that's with all those tests against Bangladesh.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Fast bowlers can sometimes crash pretty hard when they age out, it was probably just that.

. . . still waiting for Jimmeh to hit the wall

 

[Arachnodouche]

Bring George Bailey back to slap him around later this year.

 

[Chubb]

Streak wasn't actually that consistent, at least not over the span of his entire career. He had a career of 2 halves. Early Streak was a genuine world class bowler, he averaged 22.9 after his first 30 tests. Now admittedly, he wasn't playing against South Africa or Australia much at all, but they're excellent figures all the same .

Then something happened, I'm not sure if it was injury, or whether the deterioration of the political situation took its tool on his training practices and mental health. But either way, he averaged 35 over his last 35 tests. Still not terrible, but very mediocre. He did play 6 of those 35 tests v SA and Aus, but that shouldn't be sufficient to bump his average up by 12 runs, especially when you consider that he also played 6 tests against a very weak Bangladesh side. Does anyone know why Streak's numbers dropped off so drastically?

It was partly injury, partly that teams realised they just had to play him out and target the other Zim bowlers - he would bowl economical spells but not take wickets.

Streak found it hard to balance being a workhorse bowler Zim could rely on to keep it tight and a wicket-taking threat. Having the captaincy, and feeling like he had to take responsibility to bowl a lot of overs, didn't help.

I was devastated by his conviction. I don't believe he is a crook but he isn't the sharpest tool in the shed, and being Zimbabwean is hard.

EDIT: One of the things that got me interested in Zimbabwe back in the early 2000s was the Zimbabwe cricinfo site, which was extremely comprehensive and regularly updated by John Ward. This biography of Streak (Ward did long biographical interviews for almost every player of that era) explains some of the issues behind his loss of effectiveness: https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/heath-streak-a-short-biography-94692

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah, you get the feeling from that that if he'd been born south of the border, he would've prospered a lot more whilst being partnered with Donald and Fannie/Pollock. Even carrying those injuries he was a fearsome sight to behold when I was living in Zim in the mid-90's, especially given that Brandes was rarely available and he was more often than not bowling with medium pacers like Bryan Strang and John Rennie.

Quality bat as well. My happiest memories of a NZ defeat was the game at Eden Park in 2001 when he smashed 70 to help chase down a big total with Zimbabwe 9 down at the finish. Hope he's doing OK.

 

[Bolo.]

Yeah, you get the feeling from that that if he'd been born south of the border, he would've prospered a lot more whilst being partnered with Donald and Fannie/Pollock. Even carrying those injuries he was a fearsome sight to behold when I was living in Zim in the mid-90's, especially given that Brandes was rarely available and he was more often than not bowling with medium pacers like Bryan Strang and John Rennie.

Quality bat as well. My happiest memories of a NZ defeat was the game at Eden Park in 2001 when he smashed 70 to help chase down a big total with Zimbabwe 9 down at the finish. Hope he's doing OK.

Not sure he would have gotten in/gotten a proper run in the RSA team, despite being much better than so many of the RSA players. He was just competing with so many bowlers with similar MOs who had better FC records than him, and not all of them got a decent run in the team despite performing well when they did get opportunities.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Not sure he would have gotten in/gotten a proper run in the RSA team, despite being much better than so many of the RSA players. He was just competing with so many bowlers with similar MOs who had better FC records than him, and not all of them got a decent run in the team despite performing well when they did get opportunities.

Quotas wouldn't have helped either

 

[Bahnz]

Were quotas a thing in the 90's?

 

[mr_mister]

Off the top of my head only Paul Adams and Ntini were the only non whites who played for them in the 90s so I doubt it

 

[Bahnz]

Not sure he would have gotten in/gotten a proper run in the RSA team, despite being much better than so many of the RSA players. He was just competing with so many bowlers with similar MOs who had better FC records than him, and not all of them got a decent run in the team despite performing well when they did get opportunities.

You might be right, though for him to have been the (then) 3rd highest U21 wicket taker in the history of test cricket (and that without test-class support at the other end) would suggest that he was definitely good enough. Throw in his handy lower-order batting and you'd have to say he would've rounded out the Donald-Fannie partnership very nicely in the mid-90's. Was also one of the finest ODI all-rounders of the 90's-early 00's (29 with the ball and 28 with the bat), though again South Africa weren't exactly short of players who could fill that role in the late 90's.

 

[Migara]

Even batting concerened Kapil > Vaas > Streak. People have very low regard for Vaas' batting despite having a better rating throughout the career than Streak. SL missed a trick by discarding him too soon. He was on the ascendancy with the bat when he was discarded.

Note how Streak being treated as an all rounder but not Vaas, despite having better career with the bat.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Off the top of my head only Paul Adams and Ntini were the only non whites who played for them in the 90s so I doubt it

Omar Henry too, but only in 92/93 (he was 40)

 

[Migara]

Bowling

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah, would rate Vaas a slighty better all round player than Streak (at least from 2000 onwards, Streak was the better bowler up to that point) though Vaas obviously had a lot more support from his team mates than Streak did.

Not really sure why Kapil is being included in this discussion, he's lightyears ahead of the other 2.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Were quotas a thing in the 90's?

I don't know about the 90s but there was a lot of chat about them in the early 00s and I feel like it was mostly fast bowlers that it affected. And some club cricketer Jason Ontong that randomly toured Aus in 2001.

Having said that there were still plenty of white bowlers that got games like Hayward, Nel, Pretorious, Elworthy, Terbrugge and probably more so maybe it wouldn't have affected him much

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Bowling

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I know it is a different format, but Streak averaged 28 with the bat in ODIs which is genuinely good. Vaas averaged less than 14.

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah, Streak definitely the better all round ODI player - though should be noted that on average he would've gotten the opportunity to come out to bat a lot earlier in the innings than Vaas did.