Top 10 Greatest Fast Bowlers of All Time in Tests?

[Gob]

I think it has more to do with the fact that the subcontinent hasn't produced much fast bowling talent outside Imran and the two Ws. This means that Indian and Sri Lankan fans are a lot more objective about fast bowlers and that SENA fans are judging more on a level playing field.

The problem with batting agreement is that ideal batting conditions are far more origin-dependent than anything else. Sangakkara was a beast in Sri Lanka and merely very good in Australia. Ponting was a monster in Australia but couldn't buy a run in India. So people tend to over rate the players that suit their home countries and under rate those who don't perform as well in those conditions.

A great example is Hayden. He's a player who averaged over 50, scored more hundreds after the age of 30 than any other batsman, scored more hundreds in his first 50 tests than virtually any other batsman and yet many people rate him more like Gordon Greenidge than Sunil Gavaskar as an opener. Or for that matter, take Allan Border and compare him to Viv Richards. The vast majority rate Viv way more highly despite averaging less than Border and having played against relatively easier attacks and having a stronger team around him.

For that matter, it's interesting to see on here the different ratings of Viv and Greenidge compared to Hayden and Ponting. Both pairs of players have a lot in common - both played for the strongest sides of the era, Greenidge and Hayden were both openers who truly flourished with their favourite opening partner, all were aggressive batsmen who favoured pace bowling and yet there seems to be more legend built up around Viv and Greenidge than Hayden and Ponting.

Pakistani batsmen also seem to be criminally underrated by many. Younis Khan in particular gets virtually completely ignored even though he is statistically up there with the likes of Dravid.

The truth is that batsmen require consistency to be seen as good while bowlers, particularly pace bowlers, can leave a lasting impression with a few magical spells that run through your side.

kewl

 

[Lillian Thomson]

i'm undecided on wether i need to approach this the traditional way so i ask, there are five lists put together on this page alone and every single one has lillee on them so why did you specifically picked mine for this response?

My guess would be because yours just happened to be first. But I wouldn’t feel too much urgency to address the views of someone posting on a cricket forum laughing at the idea of Dennis Lillee being a great fast bowler.

 

[Gob]

My guess would be because yours just happened to be first. But I wouldn’t feel too much urgency to address the views of someone posting on a cricket forum laughing at the idea of Dennis Lillee being a great fast bowler.

Yeah i was initially going to ask how it is so laughable to hold a bowler, who has 350 wickets under 24 with one of the best wpm ratios, universally acclaimed by almost all the great batsmen of that era as the best they have faced, inspired a generation of fast bowlers that followed, bowled many many memorable and match defining spells and basically remodeled his bowling style in his mid twenties, in such a high esteem but of course 3 tests in Pakistan going to be the angle so **** it.

 

[Migara]

i'm undecided on wether i need to approach this the traditional way so i ask, there are five lists put together on this page alone and every single one has lillee on them so why did you specifically picked mine for this response?

May be because yours was the first to appear?

 

[Migara]

Lillee is a good to great fast bowler. All Time Great? Not at all. In that case Rajesh Chauhan or Venkathapathy Raju Should be the best spinner of the 90s, and Jadeja and Ashwin should be ATG spinners too.

ATG pacemen should have success everywhere, not only on green tracks.

 

[Migara]

When I see the term fast bowlers my mind immediately goes to Shoaib Akthar, Brett Lee, Shane Bond, Waqar Younis, Allan Donald

Rather express bowlers

 

[Migara]

Marshall
McGrath
Hadlee
Steyn
Imran
Ambrose
Garner
Wasim
Waqar
Trueman

If any one thinks Lillee is better than any of the above ten, can give reasons (other than subjective drivel of course)!

 

[Gob]

Lillee is a good to great fast bowler. All Time Great? Not at all. In that case Rajesh Chauhan or Venkathapathy Raju Should be the best spinner of the 90s, and Jadeja and Ashwin should be ATG spinners too.

ATG pacemen should have success everywhere, not only on green tracks.

I assume this is related to Lillee's record in Pakistan so question

Dont you think Lillee's record against Pakistan was a one off thing and he could have excelled in Pakistan and the sub continent in general if he had more opportunities? You could argue Lillee had all the tools say Hadlee had and we know how successful Hadlee was and 3 tests after all is very sample sized. Or you down right believe that Lillee could have continued to struggle in Pakistan and his skill set was not enough to over come the challenge posed by those conditions?

No need of descriptive answers a simple one would suffice.

 

[Flem274*]

mcgrath
marshall
hadlee
steyn
ambrose
imran
garner
lindwall
lillee
donald
trueman

confident on the top 4-5. rest are pretty interchangeable. garner might be high to some, but he's the goat 3rd seamer. it's easy to look good with a new rock. try the old one.

best during my watching time

mcgrath
steyn
harris
cummins
shoiab
bond
pollock
philander
bumrah
wagner

people are going to hate how high i have the short careers of harris, shoiab, bond and bumrah or the presence of two mostly 3rd seamers in cummins and wagner and idc. real life selection shows you pick ryan harris over peter siddle and shane bond over chris martin every single time and world class third seamers are a lot rarer than someone who can move a new kookaburra.

edit - i did forget broad and anderson tbh. they can slot in for bumrash and wags. philander probably slides to #10.

 

[Engle]

Fast bowlers known for their monikers : (in no particular order)

Whispering Death
The Menace
Typhoon
The Sultans of Swing
Haryana Hurricane
Burewala Bombshell
The Demon bowler
Fiery
Big Bird
Thommo

I'm sure there are others....

 

[Jack1]

Starting with Sydney Barnes made it difficult as I had to consider all eras. Considering his wickets per game and average he is arguably the greatest seamer in the history of the game. You also have seamers like Ferris, Turner, Spofforth, Higgs and Whitty to consider in a top 10 if you go down that rabbit hole. I made it "modern era" as a result or I would have to go into too much detail to form a comparison and justification for each pick.

Wasn't sure on the order yet but this is the top 10 I ended up with.

Hadlee
Cummins
Marshall
Trueman
Garner
McGrath
Donald
Imran Khan
Ambrose
Steyn

 

[Magrat Garlick]

edit - i did forget broad and anderson tbh. they can slot in for bumrash and wags. philander probably slides to #10.

un edite subtile, but given no one ever even tries to argue for the man, why not

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Lillee is a good to great fast bowler. All Time Great? Not at all. In that case Rajesh Chauhan or Venkathapathy Raju Should be the best spinner of the 90s, and Jadeja and Ashwin should be ATG spinners too.

ATG pacemen should have success everywhere, not only on green tracks.

Yet you rank Anderson as ATG. His away avg is 31.

 

[stephen]

Marshall
McGrath
Hadlee
Steyn
Imran
Ambrose
Garner
Wasim
Waqar
Trueman

If any one thinks Lillee is better than any of the above ten, can give reasons (other than subjective drivel of course)!

You're the one with the opinion that needs justification. Everyone else recognises Lillee was a genius, so you have to justify why he wasn't, given that's your position.

 

[Flem274*]

un edite subtile, but given no one ever even tries to argue for the man, why not

i dont get it

 

[Line and Length]

"Lillee is a good to great fast bowler. All Time Great? Not at all."

I respect most opinions expressed in CW but respecting this opinion is a bridge to far.

 

[Migara]

Yet you rank Anderson as ATG. His away avg is 31.

Anderson vs Lillee in the subcontinent is a bad joke of a comparison.

 

[Migara]

I assume this is related to Lillee's record in Pakistan so question

Dont you think Lillee's record against Pakistan was a one off thing and he could have excelled in Pakistan and the sub continent in general if he had more opportunities? You could argue Lillee had all the tools say Hadlee had and we know how successful Hadlee was and 3 tests after all is very sample sized. Or you down right believe that Lillee could have continued to struggle in Pakistan and his skill set was not enough to over come the challenge posed by those conditions?

No need of descriptive answers a simple one would suffice.

Could very well be. Then his record in West Indies and against minnow Sri Lanka, and conveniently not touring India stacks heavily against what to suggest.

 

[Migara]

You're the one with the opinion that needs justification. Everyone else recognises Lillee was a genius, so you have to justify why he wasn't, given that's your position.

Very simple. He excelled only on helpful tracks. Awful performances in WI, PAK and SL.

 

[Line and Length]

Very simple. He excelled only on helpful tracks. Awful performances in WI, PAK and SL.

Less than 6% of Lillee's Test bowling was in WI, PAK and SL. In fact, he only bowled 30 overs in SL and 32 in WI. How can you judge a bowler on less than 6% of his Test career. Are you saying that 94% of his career was played exclusively on "helpful tracks"?