The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[Slifer]

Hayden
Harvey
Jones
Martyn
Smith
Border *
Healy +
Davidson
Benaud
Gillespie
Mallett

I mean an unadjusted atg country team. A typical Australian atg won't include Martyn, Benaud, Gillespie etc. It'll likely feature Warne, O'Reilly etc. In which case, my point still stands. If I'm the west indies and I'm going to India, I'd leave out Ambrose and include Walsh or Roberts but neither typically features in a wi atg team.

 

[sunilz]

Which team would win ?

SA 2010-13 vs Aus 2004-07 ( minus Warne ) ?

Warne would definitely make Aus favourites, so removed him to balance the scale ( Thanos ?)

 

[mr_mister]

Macgill is an adequate replacement

 

[TheJediBrah]

Which team would win ?

SA 2010-13 vs Aus 2004-07 ( minus Warne ) ?

Warne would definitely make Aus favourites, so removed him to balance the scale ( Thanos ?)

Thanos the Aus team properly (kill half) and it would be close

 

[stephen]

Amla was in absolute beast mode at that time but if still back McGrath to get him more often than not, if only because McGrath getting top order batsmen was as inevitable as the sun rising.

Thing is, Hayden and Ponting were in sublime form for much of that time period and man for man the rest of Australia's batting was miles ahead of South Africa's at the time, even if we say that Hayden=Smith and Amla=Ponting. The pace bowling is a bit closer and it depends on who is the Australian attack. If we say that McGrath=Steyn, Clark was probably fractionally better than Philander in unhelpful conditions. Both Lee and Morkel were rubbish. MacGill was leagues ahead of any South African spinner of the time.

 

[TheJediBrah]

A lot depends on who gets snapped though. If you snap away the best 5, probably Hayden, Ponting, Gilchrist, Warne, McGrath. Then SA would almost certainly be strong favourites.

 

[stephen]

Langer
Rogers/Jaques
Love
Martyn
Clarke
Hussey
Hartley+
Clark
Kasprowicz
Lee
MacGill

Would put up a fight but ultimately wouldn't have the bowling to consistently beat that SA side. Certainly it wouldn't be a whitewash though, it'd be like 65/35 in favour of RSA.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Haddin was the back up keeper for almost all of Gilchrist's career, but Hartley is ok too I guess

 

[GoodAreasShane]

Hadds isn't a Queenslander, not good enough


Seriously though Hartley was a quality player. Somewhat unfortunate to peak so late and then be prematurely dispensed with

 

[TheJediBrah]

Hartley's final season was ridiculous. I think he averaged nearly 100 with the bat for the Shield in his last year just as he decided to **** cricket off. Would have been a shoe-in to replace Haddin for a few years otherwise.

 

[sunilz]

Amla was in absolute beast mode at that time but if still back McGrath to get him more often than not, if only because McGrath getting top order batsmen was as inevitable as the sun rising.

Thing is, Hayden and Ponting were in sublime form for much of that time period and man for man the rest of Australia's batting was miles ahead of South Africa's at the time, even if we say that Hayden=Smith and Amla=Ponting. The pace bowling is a bit closer and it depends on who is the Australian attack. If we say that McGrath=Steyn, Clark was probably fractionally better than Philander in unhelpful conditions. Both Lee and Morkel were rubbish. MacGill was leagues ahead of any South African spinner of the time.

Are you forgetting Devilliers and Kallis or you don't actually rate them ?

 

[stephen]

Are you forgetting Devilliers and Kallis or you don't actually rate them ?

Not forgetting them. Both were great. But you must remember that the peak SA team still couldn't beat the Australian sides at home. Langer, Clarke, Martyn, Hussey and Gilchrist were all excellent batsmen who may not have been on a par with Kallis and de Villiers individually, but when looked at as a whole were superior. I mean Gilchrist was miles ahead of Boucher even when he was in his 40 average form slump.

 

[stephen]

Hadds isn't a Queenslander, not good enough


Seriously though Hartley was a quality player. Somewhat unfortunate to peak so late and then be prematurely dispensed with

Was Haddin around as far back as 05? I guess he was, in which case he'd have played ahead of Hartley. But Hartley was a test quality player and shouldn't be forgotten.

Also not mentioned from that era: Bevan, di Venuto, Klinger, Hodge, Law.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Not forgetting them. Both were great. But you must remember that the peak SA team still couldn't beat the Australian sides at home. Langer, Clarke, Martyn, Hussey and Gilchrist were all excellent batsmen who may not have been on a par with Kallis and de Villiers individually, but when looked at as a whole were superior. I mean Gilchrist was miles ahead of Boucher even when he was in his 40 average form slump.

Clarke and Hussey are close enough to a match for Kallis and ABdV (as batsman), especially when you consider Clarke was a god when playing against South Africa

Was Haddin around as far back as 05? I guess he was, in which case he'd have played ahead of Hartley. But Hartley was a test quality player and shouldn't be forgotten.

Also not mentioned from that era: Bevan, di Venuto, Klinger, Hodge, Law.

Haddin was knocking on the door as early as 1999, and was Gilchrist's back up as early as 2000-01. He played his first ODI in the 2000-01 Tri Series when Gilchrist was rested. His only real competition from 2000-2008 was briefly Ryan Campbell.

 

[CricAddict]

Clarke and Hussey are close enough to a match for Kallis and ABdV (as batsman), especially when you consider Clarke was a god when playing against South Africa

Haddin was knocking on the door as early as 1999, and was Gilchrist's back up as early as 2000-01. He played his first ODI in the 2000-01 Tri Series when Gilchrist was rested. His only real competition from 2000-2008 was briefly Ryan Campbell.

Clarke and Hussey are ATVG while Kallis and ABDV are ATG.

 

[trundler]

Clarke Vs ABDV is close on output. Kallis blows Hussey out of the water though. Langer > second SA opener too and McGill >>> any SA spinner.

 

[Red]

Clarke and Hussey are ATVG while Kallis and ABDV are ATG.

How do you differentiate between ATVG and ATG?

 

[Jayro]

Rohan kanhai, Rohit Sharma, Ricky Ponting, Rahul Dravid, Ross Taylor, Rishabh Pant, Ravindra Jadeja, R Ashwin, Richard Hadlee, Richie Benaud, Ray Lindwall...... I choose two sub's as Richie Richardson and R. Bob Willis..... This will be my alphabetical eleven starting with the initial "R" ..... Decent bowling attack with few loops in the top order batting covered by the depth in it right to the number eleven.... Any more suggestions are welcome.

 

[Gob]

Clarke and Hussey are ATVG while Kallis and ABDV are ATG.

Yeah no there is hardly anything between DeVilliers and Clarke

 

[TheJediBrah]

Clarke and Hussey are ATVG while Kallis and ABDV are ATG.

Nah, Kallis sure but ABdV isn't any better than Clarke and Hussey