Test dream team from each nation. 1970-2020

[trundler]

Broad the enforcer was just such a grim sight.

 

[grecian]

You're right, he did play one of the greatest innings of all time against the Windies - winning a match by carrying his bat on a tricky pitch against arguably the greatest fast bowling attack of all time - but even if you stripped that out I'd have said exactly the same thing. I don't think we should strip it out though, because it actually happened, it's as much part of his legacy as struggling for a series against Alderman. Just about all players had a poor series here and there. Anyone who might compete with him for a position in this notional team certainly did. But ultimately the records show that for a period of some years, he was the finest batsman in the world, playing in a rubbish team, and opening the batting against the finest collection of opening bowlers ever to have graced the game.

Never stripped it out, just remembered it along with the other iffy performances, I mean are you seriously saying that was the only one. He basically had a weakness against medium pace bowlers bowling in-swing because of a high backlift and wishing to leave too many balls, it was almost certainly because he grew up in an era that you couldn't be LBW if the ball pitched outside off, so he just learned to thrust his pad at any ball like that.

That Indian attack he feasted on to have record-breaking performances one will be most gratified to be the best opening bowlers to grace the game, don't really remember Gooch being the best bat of his time, but maybe in the rankings.

 

[grecian]

Think Fred was occasionally guilty of bowling too pretty a length.

Beat the bat all the time, but because he was often short of a good length didn't find the edge as much as he maybe should've.

Broad has been so much more effective since he seems to have made a conscious effort to pitch it up and risk the drive.

Oh undoubtedly, hence why he'd be a nasty, short-pitched, yorker type enforcer in my team, still love Fred me, I even started watching Top gear coz of him, and i hate car wankery, so I maybe biased.

 

[trundler]

Gooch and Boycott both seem to be rather polarising. Boycott was flawless on paper, except for the fact that he was an utter prat and his name is basically a synonym for selfish at this point. Gooch had extended periods of being awful and was pretty meh away but dat early 90s peak.

 

[trundler]

i hate car ****ery

Not a fan of dogging, I presume

 

[zaremba]

Never stripped it out, just remembered it along with the other iffy performances, I mean are you seriously saying that was the only one. He basically had a weakness against medium pace bowlers bowling in-swing because of a high backlift and wishing to leave too many balls, it was almost certainly because he grew up in an era that you couldn't be LBW if the ball pitched outside off, so he just learned to thrust his pad at any ball like that.

That Indian attack he feasted on to have record-breaking performances one will be most gratified to be the best opening bowlers to grace the game, don't really remember Gooch being the best bat of his time, but maybe in the rankings.

I hear all you say g. And let's face it, it was 30 years ago now. When I was young. My memory of then is ropey, fragile, deeply subjective, and influenced by all sorts of biases, prejudices and things I've read and heard since. I couldn't pretend to have an objective view.

What I do know is that he was a quality player, a solid, uncomplicated, but aggressive opener with a good (and for some years truly great) record against good (and in many cases all-time great) bowlers. Who was respected by the best bowlers around the world, I think way ahead the rest of our batsmen.

I do think that was an era of particularly fine opening bowlers. I don't need to list them, you know who they were. And even that 1990 Indian attack had some pretty reasonable bowlers in it - Kapil, Kumble, Hirwani - and he absolutely slaughtered them. I mean tore them apart in a way that few English batsmen have ever done to opposing bowling attacks.

 

[grecian]

Not a fan of dogging, I presume

On principle I am not against it, but they all seem a bit dog-rough, which maybe an alternate meaning of the phrase.

I'm not really against Gooch per se, as I said in my first post, just think cook and Boyks seem a more balanced if boring pair.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I have to admit to a total bias towards the early part of the half century.

1. Boycott
2. Gooch
3. Gower
4. Root
5. Pietersen
6. Greig
7. Botham
8. Knott
9. Snow
10. Underwood
11. Willis

 

[zaremba]

Maybe I'm unfair on Boycott because he was slightly before my time. I was a big Atherton fan, and since then a big Cook fan, so I do appreciate a bit of graft and grind.

My anti-Boycott prejudice is also driven by him being one of the very worst type of people that cricket allows to thrive.

 

[grecian]

I hear all you say g. And let's face it, it was 30 years ago now. When I was young. My memory of then is ropey, fragile, deeply subjective, and influenced by all sorts of biases, prejudices and things I've read and heard since. I couldn't pretend to have an objective view.

What I do know is that he was a quality player, a solid, uncomplicated, but aggressive opener with a good (and for some years truly great) record against good (and in many cases all-time great) bowlers. Who was respected by the best bowlers around the world, I think way ahead the rest of our batsmen.

I do think that was an era of particularly fine opening bowlers. I don't need to list them, you know who they were. And even that 1990 Indian attack had some pretty reasonable bowlers in it - Kapil, Kumble, Hirwani - and he absolutely slaughtered them. I mean tore them apart in a way that few English batsmen have ever done to opposing bowling attacks.

Yes as I say, I said he was unlucky to miss out, and I admired him hugely for his dedication to fitness later in his career, which drove on those great times, whilst Gatting who was similarly gifted had a dedication for Lords Lunches which probably reflects their records.

I went for two boring bats as opener with stroke-players behind, if I'd gone for Gooch, I'd have probably put in Thorpe for KP.

 

[grecian]

I have to admit to a total bias towards the early part of the half century.

1. Boycott
2. Gooch
3. Gower
4. Root
5. Pietersen
6. Greig
7. Botham
8. Knott
9. Snow
10. Underwood
11. Willis

Don't share your general nostalgic hue, but Greig is interesting could bowl off-spin well so allows you to play Underwood, didn't see Snow play, but isn't that 2 fast bowlers surely you could go Broad or Anderson fr one of them?

 

[Red]

I'll reply without looking at the other replies and just off the top of my head, without statsguru

Australia
Langer
Boon
Ponting
GChappell
Smith
Hussey
Gilchrist +
Warne
Gillespie
Lillee
McGrath

England
Gooch
Boycott
Gower
Root
Pietersen
Botham
Knott +
Swann
Snow
Willis
Anderson

WI
Greenidge
Haynes
Richards
Lara
Sobers
Lloyd
Dujon +
Marshall
Garner
Ambrose
Gibbs

Ind
Sehwag
Gavaskar
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
Laxman
Engineer +
Kapil
Kumble
Srinath
Bumrah

SA
Smith
Richards
Amla
Kallis
Pollock
DeVilliers
Boucher +
Pollock
Procter
Steyn
Donald

 

[zaremba]

For me, I see Gooch as combining solidity with aggression, that's part of his magic for me.

If someone wanted to argue for Thorpe being in this team, I wouldn't argue against you. A truly outstanding player - again, he gets plus marks for being a solid presence, in a weak team, facing great attacks.

 

[zaremba]

Though let's be honest if we're creating a World XI from that era we're probably looking at something along the following lines:

1. Kepler Wessels
2. Ed Joyce
3. Javed Miandad
4. Alan Wells
5. Tony Greig
6. Imran Khan (c)
7. Matt Prior (w)
8. Garth le Roux
9. Jofra Archer
10. John Snow
11. Mushtaq Ahmed

12. PWG Parker

Say what you like about the batting, it's almost irrelevant, they'll be chasing 80.

 

[Pothas]

For me, I see Gooch as combining solidity with aggression, that's part of his magic for me.

If someone wanted to argue for Thorpe being in this team, I wouldn't argue against you. A truly outstanding player - again, he gets plus marks for being a solid presence, in a weak team, facing great attacks.

Yeah Thorpe easily gets in the side for players I can actually remember:

Cook
Trescothick
Root
Thorpe
Pietersen
Stokes
Prior
Swann
Broad
Gough
Anderson

Root at 3 obviously not ideal, kind of want Trott in there, comfortably the best 3 for England in my time watching cricket. Would want Flintoff as well really but can't really justify it.

 

[grecian]

Decent shout for Sobers there, actually gets in on most metrics, does it make the windies the winning team here?

So Windies here

Greenidge
Haynes
Lara
Richards
Sobers
Lloyd (c)
Dujon
Marshall
Garner
Holding
Ambrose

Sobers to spin if you need, but likelihood they won't.

 

[Nintendo]

Yeah sobers averaged 52 In the 70's, he makes the WI team easily.

Aus
1.Langer
2.Hayden
3.Ponting
4.Smith
5.Greg Chappell
6.Border C
7.Gilly+
8.Warne
9.Cummins
10.Mcgrath 1
11.Lillee 2

WI
1.Haynes
2.Greenidge
3.VIV
4.Lara
5.Sobers
6.Chanderpaul
7.Jeff Dujon? WK
8. Malcom Marshall
9. Michael Holding
10. Joel Garner
11. Curtly Ambrose

Hard too say which team is better, Aus have the better batting lineup between Gilchrist and smith vs a nerfed sobers and have an actual spinner, but that WI pace attack is horrifying, especially with no Bradman.

 

[grecian]

I really really like Chanderpaul, but I really really can't see how you pick him over Lloyd, as let's face it the Big C should be captain.

Probably West Indies for me,.

 

[Nintendo]

I really really like Chanderpaul, but I really really can't see how you pick him over Lloyd, as let's face it the Big C should be captain.

Probably West Indies for me,.

I love clive Lloyd as much as the next guy but chiv has 4400 more runs than him, an average 5 higher than his, 11 more 100's then Lloyd, all while playing for a much worse WI team.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Australia:

Hayden
Langer
Ponting
Smith
Chappell
Border
Gilchrist
Warne
Cummins
Lillee
McGrath

England:

Boycott
Cook
Gower
Root
Pietersen
Botham
Knott
Flintoff
Willis
Underwood
Anderson

West Indies:

Greenidge
Haynes
Lara
Richards
Lloyd
Chanderpaul
Dujon
Marshall
Roberts
Garner
Ambrose

SA:

Smith
Kirsten
Amla
Kallis
De Villiers
Gibbs
De Kock
Pollock
Rabada
Steyn
Adams

Pakistan

Anwar
Azhar
Younis
Javed
Inzi
Yousuf
Imran
Latif+
Wasim
Shoaib
Saqlain

India

Gavaskar
Sehwag
Dravid
Tendulkar
Kohli
Dhoni
Dev
Jadeja
Ashwin
Shami
Bumrah

NZ

Latham
Turner
Williamson
Crowe
Taylor
Watling
Cairns
Hadlee
Vettori
Bond
Wagner
Boult

SL

Jayasuria
Attapatu
Sangakkara
Jayawardena
Aravinda
Matthews
Jayawardena+
Vaas
Lakmal
Herath
Murali

Even though I'd have Richardson for Latham, NZ clearly has the strongest side named here.