The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[stephen]

At the very least Gilchrist has a proven record keeping to spin bowling which should nudge him ahead of Flower from that point of view.

 

[honestbharani]

Not that I disagree, Stephen, coz I don't, but Paul Strang was a thing for a while in the mid 90s.

 

[kyear2]

I'm aware that Sangakkara's batting was quite as amazing while he had the gloves, but from what I recall his keeping to Murali was good, not Knott, but good.

And if one would choose Murali as the spinner for the 1st team, wouldn't Sanka be a decent choice as keeper?

 

[stephen]

I'm aware that Sangakkara's batting was quite as amazing while he had the gloves, but from what I recall his keeping to Murali was good, not Knott, but good.

And if one would choose Murali as the spinner for the 1st team, wouldn't Sanka be a decent choice as keeper?

He would. I'd suggest that Gilchrist would be a better package though even if Murali kept.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Yeah Sanga was a superb keeper. I think keeping against leg spin is a bit more difficult though, especially the lines Warne bowled to the right handers at times. Loved bowling round the wicket and ripping it across the batsmen. Those are the toughest kinds of deliveries to keep to as a keeper with the batsman blocking your vision.And gilchrist handled it really well.

 

[stephen]

Not that I disagree, Stephen, coz I don't, but Paul Strang was a thing for a while in the mid 90s.

Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Not as well as Healy though

 

[vcs]

Haha that first ball

That guy was just so good to watch in the '90s.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Love the way healy casually flicks the bails off, didnt even notice that at first

 

[Daemon]

Not as well as Healy though

Wtf that's ridiculous keeping

Wonder what it's like keeping when Smith is batting. Must be ****ing annoying because he waves his bat around and walks across so far.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Not that I disagree, Stephen, coz I don't, but Paul Strang was a thing for a while in the mid 90s.

Not sure that Paul Strang was quite the same as keeping to Warne or Murali

From players I've seen it has to be either Gilchrist or Sangakkara as keeper in an ATG team. But if you wanted to go more the way of a specialist keeper I'm sure there are other options, eg. Knott. Absolutely, never, ever, in a million years, should Andy Flower's name be brought up in that context though.

 

[Logan]

Highest Average as WK(Minimum 2000 runs)

1. ABD : 57

2. Flower : 53

3. Gilchrist : 47

4. Ames : 43

5. de Kock : 41

6. Watling : 41

7. Prior : 40

8. Sanga : 39

9. Dhoni : 38

10. Baristow : 38

11. Mushfiqur : 37

12. Sarfaraz : 36




If we are picking WK batsman, Flower or Gilchrist or maybe ABD is the option.


As a pure wicket keeper, the best from what I heard about was Bob Taylor.

 

[stephen]

Well Oldfield is probably quite underrated behind the stumps given his stumping record. Seriously, how does he still have the most stumpings when Gilchrist played almost twice the tests and nearly all of them keeping to Warne? Ditto Sri Lankan keepers and Murali.

 

[Spark]

Tbf how often did batsmen try to charge Warne?

 

[honestbharani]

Tbf how often did batsmen try to charge Warne?

Only the very best players of spin did, really. And Sidhu.

 

[Coronis]

From Oldfield’s obituary:

In the fourth Test match Oldfield provided unforgettable evidence of the astonishing speed of his reflex actions, when he stumped Hobbs, Woolley, Chapman and Whysall in England's first and only innings. Hobbs was stumped off Jack Ryder, Woolley and Chapman off Mailey, and Whysall off Kelleway. Oldfield's piece de resistance was evidently the dismissal of Hobbs, when Ryder sent down an unexpectedly fast delivery that rose cap high: Hobbs, in avoiding the ball, moved momentarily out of his crease; Oldfield, meanwhile, in an amazing movement, had taken the ball and flicked a bail off.

“Tiger" Smith, in his ninety-first year, the oldest surviving cricketer of England-Australia Test matches, who first kept wicket for England in 1911, considers Bert Oldfield and Dick Lilley the two greatest wicketkeepers that have ever played. In particular he refers to "an enthusiasm even more important than dedication". Strudwick himself placed Evans, Oldfield, Cameron and Lilley equal top; Gilligan placed Oldfield first and without an equal.

Seems like he was a pretty decent chap too, apparently became great friends with Larwood when he moved downunder.

(Kelleway is listed as fast-medium and Ryder as medium pace)

 

[kyear2]

Jock Cameron is a player who never seems to get any love. He was by all accounts superb with the gloves and more than capable with the bat.

Someone who deserves more mention in these kids of discussions..

 

[bagapath]

I'm surprised you're still arguing it after last time, I'd have thought we came to the pretty solid conclusion that he was not a very good keeper. IIRC PEWS came in with anecdotes about a Zimbabwe cricket forum that he frequents/used to frequent talking all the time about how ordinary he was.

We didn't come to conclusion. We moved on. The same topic has come up again, so I am putting forward my point again. I don't need a conclusion, we are not going to change each other's opinion.

 

[Red]

From Oldfield’s obituary:

In the fourth Test match Oldfield provided unforgettable evidence of the astonishing speed of his reflex actions, when he stumped Hobbs, Woolley, Chapman and Whysall in England's first and only innings. Hobbs was stumped off Jack Ryder, Woolley and Chapman off Mailey, and Whysall off Kelleway. Oldfield's piece de resistance was evidently the dismissal of Hobbs, when Ryder sent down an unexpectedly fast delivery that rose cap high: Hobbs, in avoiding the ball, moved momentarily out of his crease; Oldfield, meanwhile, in an amazing movement, had taken the ball and flicked a bail off.

“Tiger" Smith, in his ninety-first year, the oldest surviving cricketer of England-Australia Test matches, who first kept wicket for England in 1911, considers Bert Oldfield and Dick Lilley the two greatest wicketkeepers that have ever played. In particular he refers to "an enthusiasm even more important than dedication". Strudwick himself placed Evans, Oldfield, Cameron and Lilley equal top; Gilligan placed Oldfield first and without an equal.

Seems like he was a pretty decent chap too, apparently became great friends with Larwood when he moved downunder.

(Kelleway is listed as fast-medium and Ryder as medium pace)

In addition to this, his career also conincided with Clarrie Grimmett's, and a large part of Bill OReilly's. So he kept to elite spinners. It was also far more common in his time to play two spinners in an XI.

He was also obviously very very good.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

I love it when Sanga used to keep up to the stumps with Chaminda Vaas bowling.