Why isn't Imran rated higher?

[Burgey]

Such a joke that Warne made the 5.

Was very well deserved. Changed cricket in Australia, and indeed the game itself, forever...

 

[steve132]

He is rated exactly where he should be . He makes almost everyone's 2nd XI and some people's first 11 because of competition with Sobers . This is elite level of ATG . Any player who is almost certain to make 2nd ATG XI is an elite cricketer.
He doesn't make first XI because as an allrounder he is inferior to Sobers ( Imran never clicked in both of discipline together ) and as a pace bowler inferior to Marshall, Steyn and Mcgrath.

Imran is not really competing with Sobers for a place in an all-time XI. In fact, I would include both of them in my team. Sobers was a batting all-rounder - an ATG batsman who could bowl well enough to be the fifth bowler in the team. Imran was a bowling all-rounder, probably the best there has ever been. He was an ATG with the ball who would be a valuable middle order batsman. I don't think that he was one of the three best quicks of all time (although he comes close), which is what you would need to be in order to be selected in an all time team purely as a bowler. IMO Imran's batting and captaincy are enough to justify his selection as the third seamer, but others obviously disagree.

 

[Migara]

Was very well deserved. Changed cricket in Australia, and indeed the game itself, forever...

Changing the game in an sparsely populated corner of the world is not changing the game in the world. Usual arrogance of Aussies.

 

[Migara]

Imran is an automatic choice for ATG XI, as well as Bradman and Sobers.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

PM worthy.

 

[Burgey]

Changing the game in an sparsely populated corner of the world is not changing the game in the world. Usual arrogance of Aussies.

Neither is changing it in a tear drop which looks like an afterthought at the tip of a subcontinent, but still. Warne certainly changed cricket itself forever. Sure Australians and the world loved cricket before, but it was only Warne who ended the stranglehold of pace bowling on the game, and made people sit up and take notice of his art like no one before or since. Yes sir, transformed the sport.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

I thought at one point Lance Gibbs was the world record holder for most wickets in tests...and he was an offie.

 

[Coronis]

I’m pretty sure Burgey’s just being Burgey and referring to the recent comments about Tendulkar changing cricket itself. Of course, its Burgey, so I could be wrong.

 

[Burgey]

Coronis gets it. Warne changed cricket itself forever, by being exceptionally good at something which a heap of people had done before him with varying degrees of success.

 

[Starfighter]

All we need is Papp Finn Keighl to chime in and say Kapil was better.

 

[kyear2]

Imran is not really competing with Sobers for a place in an all-time XI. In fact, I would include both of them in my team. Sobers was a batting all-rounder - an ATG batsman who could bowl well enough to be the fifth bowler in the team. Imran was a bowling all-rounder, probably the best there has ever been. He was an ATG with the ball who would be a valuable middle order batsman. I don't think that he was one of the three best quicks of all time (although he comes close), which is what you would need to be in order to be selected in an all time team purely as a bowler. IMO Imran's batting and captaincy are enough to justify his selection as the third seamer, but others obviously disagree.

Bradman would be the hypothetical captain for such a side though.
For my team, Hadlee is the better bowler of the two and a good enough batsman in his own right and their primary responsibility at the end of the game is the take 10 wickets as one of the 3 quicks selected.

 

[Migara]

The fact that people don't pick Imran in their ATXI despite him being much superior batsman to Marshall, McGrath or Steyn means that as an ATG bowler he was one level below all of Marshall, Steyn or McGrath. Similar to Lara/Sachin and Ponting as ATG batsman

Which tats fail to elaborate. He stats of Imran is top tier. Infact he had one of the most ridiculous peaks with the ball in early to mid 80s.

 

[Migara]

Basically Imran's stats are inflated due to various factors.

Secondly , he is one of the largest beneficiaries of ball tampering, if not the largest. Heck great players respect each other, however hard they play against each other on the field. One of his great rivals Ian Botham never rated Imran that much higher and that tells a lot w.r.t the integrity of this hyped up all rounder.

More like . . . .

 

[Migara]

Neither is changing it in a tear drop which looks like an afterthought at the tip of a subcontinent, but still. Warne certainly changed cricket itself forever. Sure Australians and the world loved cricket before, but it was only Warne who ended the stranglehold of pace bowling on the game, and made people sit up and take notice of his art like no one before or since. Yes sir, transformed the sport.

Wow, Erapali Prasanna, Chandrashekar, Qadir, Kumble, Murali, Mushtaq, Saqlain and Ashwin are useless. Pace never had the stranglehold in subcontinent, and it never required Warne for that. Even Warne was erased from the timeline, still above bowlers would have rode the tide beautifully.

On second thought yes, now players are not stupid enough to dope or dope and cover them selves and cry "Ma mamma gave it" sentiments.

 

[Migara]

I thought at one point Lance Gibbs was the world record holder for most wickets in tests...and he was an offie.

That sort of important facts gets lost in the face of arrogance.

 

[Daemon]

Changing the game in an sparsely populated corner of the world is not changing the game in the world. Usual arrogance of Aussies.

Wow, Erapali Prasanna, Chandrashekar, Qadir, Kumble, Murali, Mushtaq, Saqlain and Ashwin are useless. Pace never had the stranglehold in subcontinent, and it never required Warne for that. Even Warne was erased from the timeline, still above bowlers would have rode the tide beautifully.

On second thought yes, now players are not stupid enough to dope or dope and cover them selves and cry "Ma mamma gave it" sentiments.

Why are you making this about nationalities? At least make it funny if you're trying to go down that route.

 

[_00_deathscar]

Bradman would be the hypothetical captain for such a side though.

Why? Asking seriously because I'm not sure re: his captaincy - he had himself in the side but I don't recall him turning up in any highest percentage wins etc.

 

[_00_deathscar]

Must every thread descend into Australia vs subcntinent?

 

[Migara]

Why are you making this about nationalities? At least make it funny if you're trying to go down that route.

Is subcontinent a nationality?

I am responding to the ridiculous tone of some of the comments like "Warne revived spin bowling in the world" etc.

 

[Noumenon]

That home record of Imran during his halcyon years comes with an asterisk the size of the sun. No getting away from that.

He was before my time as a follower of the sport, but even so, there aren't very many accounts of the type of bowler he was - the way people associate yorkers and swing with his compatriots Wasim and Waqar, nagging line and bounce and seam with McGrath and Ambrose etc. What was his bowling shtick?