DoG's Top 100 Test Batsmen Countdown Thread

[OverratedSanity]

My favourite Ponting innings is the 70 odd at headingley in 09. It was some piss poor bowling, but the way he attacked and took the game away was him at his best.

 

[Malcolm]

As a Ponting fanboy, it was really depressing to see him slide downhill like that. I was devastated when I watched Ponting literally brought to his knees by Kallis in his last series. I mean by Kallis of all bowlers?

 

[trundler]

That IPL season where he played for Mumbai was like watching a rusty Testarossa get bested by a goddamn Civic.

 

[ma1978]

None of the decline takes away from the genius of prime Ponting. No other opposition batsman struck the same fear in me (Not Lara, not Sanga, not Kalis). The peak was incredible and I still rate him higher than Smith. Definitely my favourite non Indian bat.

 

[honestbharani]

...

Still feigning clairvoyance?

 

[honestbharani]

None of the decline takes away from the genius of prime Ponting. No other opposition batsman struck the same fear in me (Not Lara, not Sanga, not Kalis). The peak was incredible and I still rate him higher than Smith. Definitely my favourite non Indian bat.

It does not, for any batsman. No matter how much of a slide a batsman has, how good he was at his peak is something that will be remembered by anyone who was lucky enough to watch. But when comparing careers and while doing ranking exercises, they all matter.

 

[kyear2]

What a moronic post. I have not seen both Gary and Barrington play. Seeing that they played in the same time period and analysing their records, Barrington seems to have a better record than Sobers. Since none of us have actually seen both play, I questioned why Sobers is held in such high regard and why Barrington is often forgotten.

Aren't we a bit sensitive. But most if not every post you make has a Sunny / Sachin agenda. Most do it, just don't pretend you don't.

 

[sunilz]

Some posters on this forum are taking this exercise too seriously. This ranking is based on every batting parameters given certain weightage. If you change weightage, rankings will change. Stop fighting over trivial issues.

 

[kyear2]

Some posters on this forum are taking this exercise too seriously. This ranking is based on every batting parameters given certain weightage. If you change weightage, rankings will change. Stop fighting over trivial issues.

Agree.

It's just a fun exercise. Interesting to see the ratings based this model. Some surprises thus far.

 

[Logan]

Aren't we a bit sensitive. But most if not every post you make has a Sunny / Sachin agenda. Most do it, just don't pretend you don't.

Not really.

I have certain “unpopular opinions” like Rohit is an ATG ODI opener, Barrington has a better record than Sobers, Gavaskar is a GOAT Opener, Murali is better than Warne, Steyn is better than McGrath etc.

 

[Coronis]

Aren't we a bit sensitive. But most if not every post you make has a Sunny / Sachin agenda. Most do it, just don't pretend you don't.

Deliberately baiting him and then calling him out when he takes it isn’t that great a look.

 

[ataraxia]

FTR I rank Barrington higher than most. I think he is the 5th greatest English batsman, and that's only because of my obsession with WG. Peter May was in the same era as Barrington for the same county and had an FC average of 51. This whole thing reeks of samplesizelol. Anyway, we can talk about this again when Barrington comes up.

Next I think has to be Viv.

 

[Coronis]

FTR I rank Barrington higher than most. I think he is the 5th greatest English batsman, and that's only because of my obsession with WG. Peter May was in the same era as Barrington for the same county and had an FC average of 51. This whole thing reeks of samplesizelol. Anyway, we can talk about this again when Barrington comes up.

Next I think has to be Viv.

5th best? May I just ask which of Hobbs, Sutcliffe, Hammond and Hutton he’s above if you already have Grace up there

 

[ma1978]

@honestbharani

Its not the methodology of this exercise, but in my view so long as in the decline phase the player is above average / not blocking someone better, they are still adding value.

So this exercise would have ranked Ponting higher if he retired after 118 tests.

But in my view, even if Ponting wasn't playing at a great standard, 50 tests of above average standard in his decline phase, add to and certainly don't take away from his value.

Same with Tendulkar. Tendulkar in 2001 was Steve Smith effectively adjusted for era. A long period of after where he was above average, a godlike 2009 and 2010, and a bad two-year decline, in aggregate, add to his value. Not sure this model will reflect that.

 

[Slifer]

@honestbharani

Its not the methodology of this exercise, but in my view so long as in the decline phase the player is above average / not blocking someone better, they are still adding value.

So this exercise would have ranked Ponting higher if he retired after 118 tests.

But in my view, even if Ponting wasn't playing at a great standard, 50 tests of above average standard in his decline phase, add to and certainly don't take away from his value.

Same with Tendulkar. Tendulkar in 2001 was Steve Smith effectively adjusted for era. A long period of after where he was above average, a godlike 2009 and 2010, and a bad two-year decline, in aggregate, add to his value. Not sure this model will reflect that.

With all due respect, Sachin up til 2001 was not on the level Steve Smith is on now. Steve Smith is run making machine like nothing I've seen in my lifetime. Steve Smith scores hundreds at unprecedented rates, has put several atg attacks and atvg attacks to the sword. Look at what he just did in the ashes damn near 800 runs in 4 tests. He's gone well over 900 points in ranking quite a few times that in and of itself is amazing. Sachin was the man til '01 but what Smith is doing now is otherworldly. FWIW Kohli is doing very much the same in odis and is almost there in tests.

 

[honestbharani]

@honestbharani

Its not the methodology of this exercise, but in my view so long as in the decline phase the player is above average / not blocking someone better, they are still adding value.

So this exercise would have ranked Ponting higher if he retired after 118 tests.

But in my view, even if Ponting wasn't playing at a great standard, 50 tests of above average standard in his decline phase, add to and certainly don't take away from his value.

Same with Tendulkar. Tendulkar in 2001 was Steve Smith effectively adjusted for era. A long period of after where he was above average, a godlike 2009 and 2010, and a bad two-year decline, in aggregate, add to his value. Not sure this model will reflect that.

He has given weightage for longevity. And again, value is subjective. I am not sure of Aussie batting stocks when Ponting was in his decline but at least with India, I felt Sachin should have retired post 2011 as we had someone like Rahane and Rohit waiting in the wings.

 

[honestbharani]

With all due respect, Sachin up til 2001 was not on the level Steve Smith is on now. Steve Smith is run making machine like nothing I've seen in my lifetime. Steve Smith scores hundreds at unprecedented rates, has put several atg attacks and atvg attacks to the sword. Look at what he just did in the ashes damn near 800 runs in 4 tests. He's gone well over 900 points in ranking quite a few times that in and of itself is amazing. Sachin was the man til '01 but what Smith is doing now is otherworldly. FWIW Kohli is doing very much the same in odis and is almost there in tests.

TBF, AB averages 57 or 58 in the past decade, the same period where Smith averages 63 and AB has done it playing his home games on the RSA wickets which are easily much much harder to make scores on than the Aussie roads. So while he has been amazing and it is astounding that he is maintaining a test average of 60+ for a while now, there have been periods of similar consistency and achievements from other players. Smith was also a bit like Hussey in the sense that the period he spent figuring out his game as a batsman happened away from the international scene, something that did not happen with blokes like Sachin, Kohli, AB or KW.

 

[OverratedSanity]

He has given weightage for longevity. And again, value is subjective. I am not sure of Aussie batting stocks when Ponting was in his decline but at least with India, I felt Sachin should have retired post 2011 as we had someone like Rahane and Rohit waiting in the wings.

I felt like this at the time but thinking about it now, I dont know that Rahane and Rohit wouldve done well if theyd come into the team earlier.

 

[Slifer]

TBF, AB averages 57 or 58 in the past decade, the same period where Smith averages 63 and AB has done it playing his home games on the RSA wickets which are easily much much harder to make scores on than the Aussie roads. So while he has been amazing and it is astounding that he is maintaining a test average of 60+ for a while now, there have been periods of similar consistency and achievements from other players. Smith was also a bit like Hussey in the sense that the period he spent figuring out his game as a batsman happened away from the international scene, something that did not happen with blokes like Sachin, Kohli, AB or KW.

I agree we've seen similar periods of brilliance but essentially Smith's entire career has been brilliant. And he hasn't really played the weaker teams too often either: SL at home, WI, Bang. I've never seen a player so consistently dominant against challenging attacks: india in India, England in England, runs vs Steyn, Morkel and Philander in RSA etc.

 

[harsh.ag]

With all due respect, Sachin up til 2001 was not on the level Steve Smith is on now.

Not saying you are wrong, but the style of batting matters too. Sachin's technique was exceptional, his shot making exceptional. Smith is nowhere on Sachin's level on those counts.

Run machine wise, sure.