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*Official* New Zealand in Australia 2019/20

vandem

State Captain
Interesting decision to give Starc MOM. I wonder what put him ahead of Labuschagne. Left arm fast bowling too ***y to ignore? Day 1 innings not as valuable as pitch wasn't as spicy?

After Labuschagne was out at 5-301, Aussie was in a dominant position. After Labu was out, match scores were 5-115 and 9-217 vs 166 + 171, so Auusie had a smaller edge over NZ across the back end of the game. So you could argue that Labu won the game, and Starc was only applying the finishing touches.
 

Burgey

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Stepping up and taking cheap wickets when you lose a bowler is vital though. May have been a factor as well.
 

wrongun

Banned
Any news on the MCG pitch? The last 2 tests vs ENG and IND have been tough to watch on this surface. And then all of a sudden the FC game last week gets called off due to a dangerous surface. Really hope they get it right.
 

Grasshopper

State Vice-Captain
Why not just open with Williamson? If they persist with Raval, Kane's already coming in within the first few overs anyway. It's just like when they refused to drop the hopelessly out of form Munro prior to the CWC: pig-headed hubris. Very disappointing indeed.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Nah, leave KW where he is. He's NZ's best ever no. 3 bat. Don't want to mess with that.

Minor thing, but did anyone else find Starc's comments to Raval yesterday really ****? It's not like you need to engage in that kind of sledging to dislodge him.
 

Athlai

Not Terrible
Nah, leave KW where he is. He's NZ's best ever no. 3 bat. Don't want to mess with that.

Minor thing, but did anyone else find Starc's comments to Raval yesterday really ****? It's not like you need to engage in that kind of sledging to dislodge him.
Yeah I'm a big Starc fan and think very little of Raval but it was an extremely **** thing to say.
 

Jezroy

State Captain
Why not just open with Williamson? If they persist with Raval, Kane's already coming in within the first few overs anyway. It's just like when they refused to drop the hopelessly out of form Munro prior to the CWC: pig-headed hubris. Very disappointing indeed.
I think Kane needs to be left where he is.

Yeah, the Raval thing is starting to feel like the Munro thing. But who’s your other options? Rutherford? Seifert? Philips? Get Young back in already?

I also thought that Munro’s lack of form was also putting undue pressure on Guptill as well, and affecting his form. Would hate to think that Raval’s issues would be affecting Latham in a similar way.
 

Athlai

Not Terrible
I think Kane needs to be left where he is.

Yeah, the Raval thing is starting to feel like the Munro thing. But who’s your other options? Rutherford? Seifert? Philips? Get Young back in already?

I also thought that Munro’s lack of form was also putting undue pressure on Guptill as well, and affecting his form. Would hate to think that Raval’s issues would be affecting Latham in a similar way.
I recall Guptill getting bashed for this all the time when he was failing in Tests
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Well played Australia. Thoroughly outplayed us for the most part. I was heartened that we took the last 8 wickets for, what, 70 odd runs? Before the tour I was more worried about the bowling than batting, considering we couldn't take 20 poles last time (technically we didn't here, but just as well as as did). Considering we lost a bowler early on, the never say die attitude of NZ bowlers was admirable - but then, Aus lost a bowler even earlier and smoked us. What we needed was an epic bowling performance on day one, the kind that Boult produces. Southee bowled exceedingly well - shaved a good 10 runs of his average vs Aus. Wagner did his thing. A ***y Boult spell of a few wickets would've made for a closer test, but so would have some ****ing runs from the openers. You can blame the toss, but even if we had somehow knocked them out in two sessions we still would've crumbled under lights. The only hope we had was to get them out early day two and bat ourselves in before lights, but oh well.

Re: Raval. Dude looks shot. This is easily his toughest challenge, and he hasn't exactly feasted on the weaker teams leading up to this. But who repalces him? I would only want a like for like replacement. Floating the idea of opening with Santner is ****ing stupid considering he couldn't contend with a relatively old ball, how is he going to go against a new nut? Ridiculous. Ditto Astle. Blundell isn't the worst idea but honestly I don't see him getting past 50. Flying Seifert over is really the only option if you were to replace Raval. Sticking with Raval, I hope someone just gives him a decent talking to in an encouraging way, just let him be boring, face some quicker balls in the nets. It probably is his last tour if he doesn't shake whatever it is that's dogging him.

The rest of the batting line up just needs to get their **** together. The bowling attack worked as a team but the batsmen all seemed like individuals in their own private war. There didn't seem to be any plan to the bowlers, just take it as it comes and not realise there were fairly obvious traps set up. That said, Australian bowlers were just class. If, and I stress if, Starc has turned a corner with his bowling after 'tweaking' his action, this attack will be a very scary prospect in the next few years. Cummins deserved more wickets, and Lyon bowled exceptionally well. Australia's fielding was in another dimension compared to our very average effort. Occasionally our players will pull off stunners which seem to gloss over the very straight forward stuff we shell, and we hardly ever look like running anyone out - even basic throws seem to be fairly off.

Overall, apart from obviously replacing Fergsuon, I wouldn't change the side for the next test. Santner needs to get his **** together the most, even more so than Raval, because he needs to both contain at one end, exploit any turn that appears, and hang around with the likes of Watling and CdG. I'm still a strong advocate for Patel/Somers but MCG is less likely to afford areas of turn like the Perth pitch did.

One thing that does give me some positive feeling for the next test as we've done this many times - lose a first test of a series overseas quite badly, only to come back and win in the second. I'd be happy with a 2-1 series loss to some extent. 2-1 our way seems extremely unlikely but would be ****ing incredible. Anyway, expecting a much better contest at Melbourne. Our poor batting display aside, I thought this match was a cracker on many levels. Great contest between NZ bowlers and Aus batsmen (who knew they'd end up with a third decent bat?) and I can't begrudge seeing quality fast bowling, even if Starc is a monumental dickhead.
 

Grasshopper

State Vice-Captain
Nah, leave KW where he is. He's NZ's best ever no. 3 bat. Don't want to mess with that.
Under normal circumstances I'd fully agree, but with Raval not scoring and the lack of an alternative opener in the squad we need to do something.

Raval has averaged 7 in his last 9 innings and has gotten past single figures just twice. He's hit a grand total of 6 boundaries over those 9 innings. It's not as if he's even helping to take the shine off the ball. And his fielding is decidedly average. There's nowhere left to hide. He simply has to go imo.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
I think the thing about Australia is that it doesn't reward half measures. Playing dibbly dobbly all rounders in Australia isn't going to get you anywhere - you need real pace or turn and batsmen who can deal with it. Which is part of why I think NZ find it hard to tour here, since their team balance is usually to play three guys who can both bowl a bit and bat a bit. It's part of the reason Moeen Ali was so awful here as well.
How dare you speak ill of CdG. Took the first wicket of the match and bowled as much as he did because Ferg went down. Still managed two wickets and went at under 2s in the first dig and under 3s in the second. He did his job as 5th bowlers, an stepped up some. The fact Australia never really truly got on top of him shows how valuable he is, not just with his movements, but also at holding up an end and building pressure. He did a better job of it than Santner.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Yeah I'm a big Starc fan and think very little of Raval but it was an extremely **** thing to say.
Falls into the ever growing group of Aussie cricketers who are magnificent athletes with immense talent but absolute **** human beings.
 

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Scary maybe but not much of a shock. Think the Santner selection went along expected lines.
Pretty much outbowled by Jerry Raval too. Dude needs a serious kick in the pants, at the moment he is feeling very much like a passenger who has theoretical talent but never shows up when needed. Almost becoming the spin bowling Jimmy Neesham circa 2014/15. That England test was a great effort but he needs to do that more than once a series.
 

Flem274*

123/5
yea the bits and pieces thing doesn't really apply here. we have two allrounders and cdg is genuinely good with bat and ball, especially since he's the 5th bowler.

santa is a bits and pieces player at test level no question. white ball gun, but doesn't belong here.

the batsmen need to sort themselves out. the end.
 

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
Ferguson flying home. Replacement will be sent over. Will it be an opener?
Until Fergusson's debut this match. The NZ selectors haven't gone outside the foursome of Southee, Boult, Wagner, and their backup of Henry for like 4 or 5 years. (Edit: Doug Brawewell in August 2016)

So, a seamer call up for Ferguson will definitely just be a passenger who sits on the bench (and bowls in the nets).

Sensible, but 'bad-visual', thing to do would be call up an opener. Or Sommerville or Patel.

Sommerville or Patel won't happen as they have 2 spinners already selected. Sometimes a good thrashing is useful to expose selectorial folly.

I think we can get ready to welcome Jamieson to an Aussie net-bowling holiday.

Edit: Actually, they do probably need a seamer call-up to enable them to rest Wagner and Southee for the warm-down match this weekend.
 
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morgieb

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Yeah, but what about that time before?
That was when Misbah and Younis were still playing :p

But on a more serious note, there was a pretty lengthy time where Australia would dominate in favourable conditions but **** the bed in less than favourable ones. I think this has evolved somewhat, though the gap is still noticeable as hell.
 

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
Pretty much outbowled by Jerry Raval too. Dude needs a serious kick in the pants, at the moment he is feeling very much like a passenger who has theoretical talent but never shows up when needed. Almost becoming the spin bowling Jimmy Neesham circa 2014/15. That England test was a great effort but he needs to do that more than once a series.
I didn't watch much, but what I saw I thought Santner actually bowled quite well. I saw lots of beating the bat on a day 1 and 2 pitch. But then I saw 5 minutes of Head on a day 4 pitch ..... and that looked better.

His century v England while a vindictation of shrugging off the near misses and keep focusing on the next ball and gutsing it out until time to party, was also a display of batting that would never last more than 10 minutes in Perth and Brisbane and Johannesberg etc conditions.
 
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Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Pretty much outbowled by Jerry Raval too. Dude needs a serious kick in the pants, at the moment he is feeling very much like a passenger who has theoretical talent but never shows up when needed. Almost becoming the spin bowling Jimmy Neesham circa 2014/15. That England test was a great effort but he needs to do that more than once a series.
I know I'm massively down on Santner, but I really don't think his bowling in the England win was impressive at all. He was gifted 3 wickets (one of which wasn't even out) by an English side that were totally enfeebled by exhaustion. He then got the chance to bowl on a day 5 pitch that was actually offering some pretty extravagant turn, and - as usual - looked totally innocuous. A bowler like Lyon would've grabbed a bag in those conditions (as would most competent test spinners).

Really the Santner situation reminds me of something that was said about Henry during the England series. The selectors opted for a defensive selection on the assumption that none of our actual spin bowlers are likely to be effective in NZ conditions, and were subsequently backed into a corner by said selection surprising on the upside.
 

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