The Football ATG General Arguing/Discussing Thread

[GIMH]

Anyway. My arbitrary XI from my lifetime:

Kahn 2002

Irwin 1994
Vidic 2008
Godin 2014
Zanetti 1998

Keane 2000
Xavi 2011
Zidane 2000

Messi 2011
Ronaldo 1998
C Ronaldo 2011

What a side.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Maybe Almunia just seemed like the reincarnation Lev Yashin in training each day or something, but just could not translate it into actual games.

It was a weird situation in any case, as Arsenal repeatedly seemed to be on the brink of signing a journeyman replacement, like Schwarzer or someone, only for it to fail because of a slightly raised asking price or wage demand or something.

He never really made "mistakes" per se. He was just so below the standard required that he allowed goals that most competent keepers would have saved in their sleep. Not many real memorable howlers tbh, he was just crap.

Yeah, I think, ironically, Seaman and Lehmann probably both dropped bigger bollocks but were infinitely better keepers generally.

There's a case to be made that Arsene inexplicably preferring Almunia to mad Jens as his #1 was the beginning of the end.

 

[Furball]

Anyway. My arbitrary XI from my lifetime:

Kahn 2002

Irwin 1994
Vidic 2008
Godin 2014
Zanetti 1998

Keane 2000
Xavi 2011
Zidane 2000

Messi 2011
Ronaldo 1998
C Ronaldo 2011

A great side but I'd want to find room for 1994 Roberto Baggio.

 

[Furball]

Premier League team of the decade?

Defence is a tough one because a lot of stalwarts like Cole, Terry, Vidic, Ferdinand etc all retired midway through the decade.

De Gea

Zabaleta
Kompany
Terry
Robertson

Sterling
Silva
Yaya Toure
Hazard

Agüero
Kane

On reflection, I didn't realise how long ago Robertson had joined Hull or how long Terry was still going at Chelsea.

 

[Cabinet96]

I forgot Robertson at Hull. That makes justifying his inclusion that much easier. My XI would be the same except I'd put Kante in for Sterling and go 4-3-3.

 

[sledger]

Yeah, I think, ironically, Seaman and Lehmann probably both dropped bigger bollocks but were infinitely better keepers generally.

There's a case to be made that Arsene inexplicably preferring Almunia to mad Jens as his #1 was the beginning of the end.

Tbf Almunia's real awfulness didn't become apparent until 2-3 years after that call was made. His apparent drop off from being mediocre to very bad was quite drastic.

Wenger's record with keepers one of the most overlooked dubious aspects of his managership though imo. Was lucky to inherit a world class GK in Slim his prime in Seaman, and made an important and good signing in Lehmann, but other than that, most of his signings were disastrous (Rami Schaaban anyone?).

Fabianski and Chesney also significantly improved after leaving Arsenal, one might argue.

 

[Furball]

I forgot Robertson at Hull. That makes justifying his inclusion that much easier. My XI would be the same except I'd put Kante in for Sterling and go 4-3-3.

Yeah in my head he had 1 good season at Hull then joined Liverpool. Hadn't realised he was there for 3 seasons.

 

[Uppercut]

Tbf Almunia's real awfulness didn't become apparent until 2-3 years after that call was made. His apparent drop off from being mediocre to very bad was quite drastic.

Wenger's record with keepers one of the most overlooked dubious aspects of his managership though imo. Was lucky to inherit a world class GK in Slim his prime in Seaman, and made an important and good signing in Lehmann, but other than that, most of his signings were disastrous (Rami Schaaban anyone?).

Fabianski and Chesney also significantly improved after leaving Arsenal, one might argue.

There are some amazing stories about how bad Arsenal's goalkeeping coach was in this era. Peyton I think was his name.

 

[sledger]

Just running through all the Wenger keepers, and there are far more that were comically bad, or just bad, than there were that were good.

Seaman - Absolutely fantastic for most of his tenure. Powers began to wane noticeably towards the end, but still decent at the time he left.

Lukic - Maybe not really fair to include, as he barely played, and was well passed his best by the time Wenger arrived.

Manninger - Lots of initial promise. Went badly downhill and was sold. Had a decent/solid career post-Arsenal.

Taylor - Only ever a reserve option. Looked ok when called upon though.

Wright - A lolbad disaster. The pre-Almunia.

Schaaban - Very iffy.

Lehmann - Absolute hero, but total nutter.

Warmuz - Never played a game.

Poom - Barely played.

Almunia - As above.

Fabianski - Absolutely horrible for most of his Arsenal career. Left on free transfer as soon as he began to look decent. Has since kicked on and established himself as a really solid prem level keeper.

Mannone - Not without redemption, but on the whole very underwhelming.

Chesney - A cult hero, started fantastically but then seemed to stall and then regress pretty badly. Since leaving has established himself as a regular starter for one of the best teams in Europe.

Ospina - Probably better than some of the others mentioned, but was ultimately pants.

Cech - His regression was already well underway before he signed for Arsenal, but was solid enough for most of his time at the club. Nothing to get excited about though.

Martinez - Has never been very convincing. Perhaps reflected in the fact that he is now 26 or so, and has still not managed to really break into the side.

 

[Uppercut]

Cech was terrible for Arsenal. Constantly got into bad positions for shot-stopping - too far out to react to the shot, but not far enough out to narrow the angle. At first viewing it always looked like it was an easy chance and he didn't have much chance, but then on the replay you realised how difficult it would be against a keeper that was in the right place.

Ospina was also an absolute shocker, the next worst after Almunia imo.

I'd have said Fabianksi has been quite a lot better than solid-prem-level tbh. Bunch of West Ham fans reckon he's their best player.

Did Leno only arrive as Wenger left? He's been very good.

 

[sledger]

Was the first Emery era signing iirc.

 

[Furball]

In the spirit of the teams of the decade, this is a great article:

https://theathletic.com/1358658/201...tive-ballon-dor-winners?source=shared-article

 

[harsh.ag]

A 90s side with a magic square midfield (players chosen for their best decade only)

GK Schmeichel

RB Thuram
CB Hierro
CB Stam
LB Maldini

DM Keane
MF Matthaus
MF Laudrup
CAM Baggio

CF Ronaldo
CF Romario

Cafu had his best years in the 2000s imo, and the same goes for Nesta, Zidane, Scholes. Baresi in the 80s. Matthaus I am not sure about if he was better in the 80s or not. If not him, then Redondo.

 

[DriveClub]

Premier League team of the decade?

Defence is a tough one because a lot of stalwarts like Cole, Terry, Vidic, Ferdinand etc all retired midway through the decade.

De Gea

Zabaleta
Kompany
Terry
Robertson

Sterling
Silva
Yaya Toure
Hazard

Agüero
Kane

On reflection, I didn't realise how long ago Robertson had joined Hull or how long Terry was still going at Chelsea.

I'd never have sterling in any team. What about fabregas? Maybe henderson for the Champions league

 

[Magrat Garlick]

A 90s side with a magic square midfield (players chosen for their best decade only)

GK Schmeichel

RB Thuram
CB Hierro
CB Stam
LB Maldini

DM Keane
MF Matthaus
MF Laudrup
CAM Baggio

CF Ronaldo
CF Romario

Cafu had his best years in the 2000s imo, and the same goes for Nesta, Zidane, Scholes. Baresi in the 80s. Matthaus I am not sure about if he was better in the 80s or not. If not him, then Redondo.

Roberto Carlos

Also playing Matthäus as a midfielder, well, let's just say it encompasses the spirit of 90s football

 

[harsh.ag]

I like Carlos, and he certainly provides an excellent attacking option, but Maldini is maybe the greatest LB of all time. And he didn't play as CB in the 90s.

Matthaus was a box to box midfielder. Strange to have an issue with him playing in the midfield.

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

Roberto Carlos over Maldini?

 

[sledger]

Hierro over Nesta and Baresi also itstl.

Probably wouldn't even have Hierro ahead of Koeman and Tony Adams tbh.

 

[harsh.ag]

Hierro over Nesta and Baresi also itstl.

Probably wouldn't even have Hierro ahead of Koeman and Tony Adams tbh.

As I wrote in that post, Nesta's best years were in the 2000s. Baresi's in the 80s. Same goes for Koeman. Adams vs Hierro is debatable. Desailly and Blanc also in the mix.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

Roberto Carlos over Maldini?

why not both