CricketWeb decides the Greatest Players Post World War I

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Isn't Hobbs ineligible for post world war I? He played some cricket post the war but still mainly a player of pre WWI era?

Similar to Sachin of 90s and 00s
Best in 90s , world class in 00s

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Reasons for putting Sobers only 6th?

It's the ODis ..I think.

300 matches , 333 wickets at 28
11111 runs , 45 AVG 85 Strike Rate

This would have been his stats , if he played in Sachin era ..though.

 

[MagicPoopShovel]

Don Bradman
Garfield Sobers
Malcolm Marshall
Viv Richards
Imran Khan
Muttiah Muralitharan
Shane Warne
Jack Hobbs
Curtly Ambrose
Wasim Akram
Richard Hadlee
Len Hutton
Fred Trueman
Sachin Tendulkar
Wally Hammond
Glenn McGrath
Dennis Lillee
Dale Steyn
Allan Border
Keith Miller
Adam Gilchrist
Graeme Pollock
Ricky Ponting
Bill O'Reilly
George Headley

 

[Bolo]

It's the ODis ..I think.

300 matches , 333 wickets at 28
11111 runs , 45 AVG 85 Strike Rate

This would have been his stats , if he played in Sachin era ..though.

Hes 38 bat and 21 bowling in list A. Both seem a bit low. List A only invented at the tail end of his career, which could have produced some oddities. And maybe he was playing in a bowler friendly country. Anyone know any details on his list A career?

Your numbers feel right, but those are big batting numbers. That's sachin only. A long way ahead of lara. It's a lot to expect.

 

[trundler]

Lots of people have Imran in the top 5. Deservedly SO IMO.

 

[Bolo]

1Bradman
2Imran
3Muralitharan
4Tendulkar
5Sobers
6Hadlee
7Kallis
8Shaun Pollock
9McGrath
10Warne
11Viv
12Gilchrist
13Wasim
14Hammond
15Hutton
16De Villiers
17Miller
18Gavaskar
19Worrell
20Trueman
21Lillee
22Garner
23Ambrose
24Kohli
25Dhoni

 

[weldone]

Reasons for putting Sobers only 6th?

I didn't want to keep a huge amount of difference between him and Kallis. I see in your ranking Kallis is 12 places below Sobers - why is that?

Although his batting is generally underrated outside CW, I think we in CW tend to overrate his batting ever so slightly.

 

[vcs]

It's the ODis ..I think.

300 matches , 333 wickets at 28
11111 runs , 45 AVG 85 Strike Rate

This would have been his stats , if he played in Sachin era ..though.

That's oddly specific.

 

[weldone]

That's oddly specific.

or specifically odd

 

[Bolo]

I didn't want to keep a huge amount of difference between him and Kallis. I see in your ranking Kallis is 12 places below Sobers - why is that?

Although his batting is generally underrated outside CW, I think we in CW tend to overrate his batting ever so slightly.

The fact that we are adding LOs and the fact that we are ranking the greatest players not the necessarily the best (although some people will pick them to mean the same thing) makes it tough to push sobers too far away from Kallis. I think he's better, and probably would have been better in LOs as well, but Sobers has 8k runs and kallis has 24k. Not meaningless considering comparable test records.

 

[MrPrez]

It's just too difficult to do an across-format ranking system for me to give it a go.

I do think that Kohli is being rated way too low in most people's teams though if its a 50/50 split.

 

[_00_deathscar]

It's just too difficult to do an across-format ranking system for me to give it a go.

I do think that Kohli is being rated way too low in most people's teams though if its a 50/50 split.

Yep - when it was announced that it includes all formats, that definitely pushes Kohli way up.

 

[Bolo]

Really difficult doing these rankings. Factoring in non quality factors like development of the game. Weighing contribution like weight of runs vs quality of player. And divorcing how we see greatness vs extent actually being contributed (see ambrose being universally accepted as a top tier test ATG vs pollocks dubious status). Plus odis vs test.

You only get into my list by being a great in multiple ways/really standing out. No steyn, no Marshall. Played both formats with one skill only, only great in one. Didn't break world records, stand out in their era, arguably advance fast bowling like lillee etc.

Didn't try to weight odis near 50%, but gave a lot of weight to the handful of truly stellar players. Almost all are multi format greats, so not such an issue. Garner can get in even if he's nowhere near getting in on tests alone, despite being atg. Kohli and Dhoni cause questions, but are justifiable.

Takes a bit of thought. Interesting exercise though.

My answers would likely be completely different if i did this in a different mood. I avoid voting on things when I can't convince myself I have a solid reason for my answer so as to avoid contributing idiocy, but this is worth an exception.

 

[Victor Ian]

Just summon the idiot and leave it up to others to dilute.

 

[Bolo]

Just summon the idiot and leave it up to others to dilute.

I do this frequently enough in conversation. Wisden set a low enough bar to lose the shame for this one though.

 

[trundler]

I haven't laid out any strict cross format rules. Do as you please to come up with whatever list.

 

[Bolo]

I haven't laid out any strict cross format rules. Do as you please to come up with whatever list.

As it should be. Way more interesting. Not easy picking though

 

[h_hurricane]

Considering all formats, I have decided to change my initial list based on the below criteria.

a) Weightage to test cricket - 80%, ODIs - 20%, T20s ignored.
b) Players who have not played ODIs are rated based on tests only. This will not unfairly affect them when compared to another player inferior to them in tests but a great/very good ODI player.
For instance, Hayden and G. Smith will still be behind Hutton inspite of pretty good ODI records.
c) Being a great test player is a necessary condition but not a sufficient one. Bevan, Dhoni etc fall short.

1. Garry Sobers
2. Donald Bradman
3. Viv Richards
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Muttiah Muralitharan
6. Glenn Mcgrath
7. Imran Khan
8. Richard Hadlee
9. Shane Warne
10.Adam Gilchrist
11.Wasim Akram
12.Malcolm Marshall
13.Jacques Kallis
14.Curtly Ambrose
15.Brian Lara
16.Virat Kohli
17.Kapil Dev
18.Shaun Pollock
19.Joel Garner
20.Keith Miller
21.Ian Botham
22.Jack Hobbs
23.Sunil Gavaskar
24.Walter Hammond
25.Len Hutton

Joel Garner comes in and Greg Chappell goes out from my initial list. Other 24 players remain the same with some changes in order.

 

[vcs]

Very tough to accommodate everyone who deserves a mention, but Ponting should probably be getting a few more nominations.

Sangakkara as well.

 

[Bolo]

Very tough to accommodate everyone who deserves a mention, but Ponting should probably be getting a few more nominations.

Sangakkara as well.

Ridiculous weight of runs to leave out. Felt wrong giving someone like garner a spot, especially when pushing murali and Tendulkar to the top, mostly on longevity.

But I cant find the room. They have little to recommend them as test bats. Very much atgs, but unremarkable. Even in their own era. So many are comparable.

I dont think that much of sanga in odis, so dont feel too bad, but ponting gets a bad deal. So close to the top of the tree in odis in addition to being a great test bat. I dont even regard Kohli as a legit test great yet (pretty sure he will be, but not enough time). So I'm shafting a legit 2 format atg for a 1 format guy, even though ponting is only one or two bats below him on the odi bat list. Oh well, its too big a drop to ignore. Room for the odi monsters only