ODI ATG XIs

[ankitj]

It would appear that everyone was a moderate upgrade over everyone else.

Genuinely loled at this.

 

[stephen]

I had a feeling this would turn into an argument over the definition of "moderate"



Warne would have been excellent but I doubt he'd have been much better than Hogg in ODIs, and I couldn't see them playing together with any sort of regularity.

Let's not forget that Warne had already announced his retirement after the 03 world cup before his drug ban. He was done with ODI cricket and fair enough. His main weapon - the flipper - was never as good as it was before he did his shoulder.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Let's not forget that Warne had already announced his retirement after the 03 world cup before his drug ban. He was done with ODI cricket and fair enough. His main weapon - the flipper - was never as good as it was before he did his shoulder.

I don't really see why not being able to bowl the flipper is relevant but fair enough

 

[stephen]

Warne's career (red and to an extent white ball):

91-93 Learning the game. Raw talent but somewhat unrefined.
93-98: the most talented spinner of all time.
98-02: taking wickets on reputation, ability severely hampered by injuries.
04-07: regained part of his 93-98 capabilities but took many of his wickets through out- thinking the batsmen.

Warne never truly regained the energy he was able to impart on the ball that he had before and was never able to bowl the flipper at all after the injury.

 

[stephen]

https://youtu.be/4oSxJsVk4GA

Pretty much half his wickets were flippers in that period. Was genuinely deceptive, quick and accurate. Losing that as a weapon was a huge blow.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Warne's career (red and to an extent white ball):

91-93 Learning the game. Raw talent but somewhat unrefined.
93-98: the most talented spinner of all time.
98-02: taking wickets on reputation, ability severely hampered by injuries.
04-07: regained part of his 93-98 capabilities but took many of his wickets through out- thinking the batsmen.

Warne never truly regained the energy he was able to impart on the ball that he had before and was never able to bowl the flipper at all after the injury.

More rotund the Warne is, more potent the flipper is...

 

[stephen]

I don't really see why not being able to bowl the flipper is relevant but fair enough

https://youtu.be/M8H6MFtMKbY

Another example of why the flipper was so important to Warne.

 

[stephen]

Also, WTF at Warne bowling the 49th over. What spinner bowls at the death?

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Also, WTF at Warne bowling the 49th over. What spinner bowls at the death?

Shakib, Mo Nabi

 

[TheJediBrah]

https://youtu.be/4oSxJsVk4GA

Pretty much half his wickets were flippers in that period. Was genuinely deceptive, quick and accurate. Losing that as a weapon was a huge blow.

yeah I know what a flipper is I just didn't get how it was relevant to him retiring from ODIs but still playing Tests

 

[Prince EWS]

yeah I know what a flipper is

Haha this is the JediBrahest possible reply to that post.

10/10, would CW again.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Haha this is the JediBrahest possible reply to that post.

10/10, would CW again.

I actually made it a lot less sarcastic and snarky than I generally would because i like stephen

 

[Victor Ian]

Sorry to take this back a few pages, but another problem with Tendulkar seems to be that he gets less good as his team improves around him. I fear in an ATG team he might only be an average player. I don't think his ego is big enough to succeed in team of seriously big ego's.

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

Sorry to take this back a few pages, but another problem with Tendulkar seems to be that he gets less good as his team improves around him. I fear in an ATG team he might only be an average player. I don't think his ego is big enough to succeed in team of seriously big ego's.

Similarly Gary Sobers declined before West Indies Supremacy

 

[harsh.ag]

Sorry to take this back a few pages, but another problem with Tendulkar seems to be that he gets less good as his team improves around him. I fear in an ATG team he might only be an average player. I don't think his ego is big enough to succeed in team of seriously big ego's.

You do remember Sachin circa 2008-11, don't you?

 

[trundler]

And Ponting got worse as his team got weaker.

Conclusion: 40 years olds who have played international cricket for two decades just aren't as good anymore, you numpties.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

If only Ponting would have ended his career with a goatie...

 

[Pap Finn Keighl]

As for Lara, there is very little to separate him and Waugh at ODI level.

Lara - 1991-94 - Regular Opener
AVG 48 plus .
Phenomenal - Tendulkaresque

 

[_00_deathscar]

Warne's career (red and to an extent white ball):

91-93 Learning the game. Raw talent but somewhat unrefined.
93-98: the most talented spinner of all time.
98-02: taking wickets on reputation, ability severely hampered by injuries.
04-07: regained part of his 93-98 capabilities but took many of his wickets through out- thinking the batsmen.

Warne never truly regained the energy he was able to impart on the ball that he had before and was never able to bowl the flipper at all after the injury.

With players who've had 15+ year careers, there will inevitably be points where you can break up the career to reflect potential, world class ability, a slump (or two), and (with the truly world class/ATG lot who find a way to reinvent themselves), a revival. Apart from Bradman seemingly.

You could do the exact same for Sachin..

 

[Victor Ian]

I wasn't necessarily dissing Tendulkar. I just felt he was superman until India developed a decent team, which just happened to coincide with his prime years and lesser output. My recollection is, in ODI, Tendulkar had no peer until about 2000 when many became his peer. I just wanted to put that doubt to bed. He's still in my team.