*Official* India Tour of England 2018

[Prince EWS]

Even if he's carrying an injury, the reason he bowled like crap is because he lacks patience and his brain is way smaller than anyone thought. You don't try three variations an over just because you aren't 100% fit, you do that if you're a dumb bowler. He has no excuse and should be ashamed he was out bowled comprehensively by a guy who averages 40 with the ball.

I don't think he's a dumb bowler so much as he just over-rates his own intelligence and ignores conventional wisdom too often. He has dumb plans sometimes but I don't think that's quite the same thing. See also: Kohli's selection policy.

Semantics though really.

 

[Prince EWS]

the usual underrating moeen going on here.

now yes, he is borderline cannon fodder away from england. but the bloke now has 91 @ 31 in england. this indian lineup isn't the first team he's made mincemeat of in his home country.

If he bowled as he did in this Test every time he'd be a lot more effective away from home too. It was basically an entire category ahead of any other entire Test of bowling he's produced IMO, and he's produced some good ones.

 

[OverratedSanity]

He bowled for a long time with session breaks in between. Why didn't Kohli, or at least Shastri (who used to be a spin bowler), ask him to cut out the nonsense?

Yes this is definitely a fair point. I thought there'd be some change in his approach after that terrible first session but it didn't seem like he got any real input from the coaches in the break. In all probability Shastri just said "Let's smash em boys".

I thought initially what put Ashwin off was that the rough was in a spot that he doesn't really like to bowl. It was a good few feet outside off to the right handers. Ashwin's usual line to the righties is a little straighter. Massively disappointing that he adjusted so poorly. That rough was ideal for the line Lyon bowls and he would've torn England a new one imo, atleast the right handers.

 

[OverratedSanity]

If he bowled as he did in this Test every time he'd be a lot more effective away from home too. It was basically an entire category ahead of any other entire Test of bowling he's produced IMO, and he's produced some good ones.

He bowled great against SA imo. But it's always difficult to properly judge how good any spinner was against them considering how atrocious they are against the spinners.

 

[Top_Cat]

From what Pujara said, the Indian team were convinced the deck slowed a lot more than than it really did. So Ashwin bowled more like the pace and style of home and was picked off (not withstanding meh lines too). When he bowled a flighted ball and it jagged, the comms were at him like he'd finally landed one but I believe the slower ones were actually part of the plan as the set-up or variation ball rather than the knock-out ball itself. Moeen bowled those flighted balls as more of a stock ball, got real bite and, well, we saw the results. Was dangerous all match.

So, personally, he had a plan and at that level, in a tight session where you're the man, can't just drop it. I just think it was wrong and they really missed a trick here. Shows even when conditions suit, you've still got to bowl quite well because man it's a fine difference between crap and match-winner. Knowledge of home conditions key here, one feels.

 

[Groundking]

That doesn't excuse sticking to the same **** plan that's not working for 37 overs, nor does it not excuse not figuring out what the line and length of the pitch actually is, or Kohli keeping him on forever and ever and ever.

This Indian team is a bit silly isn't it?

 

[the big bambino]

Moeen has a good record against India and SA which is amplified at home. The only critical observation you can make is that he's the best spin bowler England have but that's hardly his fault. As long as that's so England will always struggle away from home when a good spinner who can compete in the sub con or a niggardly one who can bowl dry elsewhere is needed. I don't know if poor form kept him out of the team but I've always liked him against India. Now that there is the contrast you can wonder why he wasn't picked ahead of Rashid at the start when, all things being equal, he should've been.

 

[Heboric]

I always like these kind of initiatives:

https://www.sport24.co.za/Cricket/rolling-stones-frontman-jaggers-generous-cricket-pledge-20180905

Rolling Stones lead singer Mick Jagger will donate £20,000 (around R400,000) to charity Chance to Shine, for each England or Indian century or five-wicket haul during the fifth and final Test at The Oval in London.

His pledge also includes £10,000 (R200,000) for every half-century or three-wicket haul.

I know Sunfoil does it/ did it in South Africa where they donated an amount for every 4, 6 and wicket

Although batting in this series hasnt been the greatest ...

 

[Groundking]

In response to Hicheal Michael's post that dissapeared where he was talking about how he can't remember Moeen bowling much at all in the 4th innings overseas where we were in a good position, Moeen has bowled 19 times in the 4th innings, 13 times at home taking 36 wickets at 18.91. Of the 6 times we've been away and he's bowled he's taken; 1-54 against the West Indies in a game where the West Indies chased down 198 to win courtsey of a Bravo 82 and Blackwood 47, 3-47 helping bowl South Africa out for 174 defending 416, trapping key wicket De Villiers lbw for 37, 2-60 bowling Bangledesh out for 263 defending 286, taking Shakib and Iqbal's wickets, 1-47 in a game drawn against India defending 310, having helped us post 537 scoring 117, 0-13 defending 103 against India and finally 0-23 defending 170 against Australia which the banned openers took 50 overs to get.

So yeah, not that many good opportunities at all.

 

[Bolo]

Putting together bad plans and sticking to them for a protracted period of time is just about the worst sin imaginable. Bad plans are fine for 10 overs, but not 2 innings. Especially when Ali was offering a clear presentation of a good plan.

I didn't think Ashwins performance was a big deal. Had a bad game, which happens. But planning to have a bad game isn't acceptable

 

[Borges]

Putting together bad plans and sticking to them for a protracted period of time is just about the worst sin imaginable. Bad plans are fine for 10 overs, but not 2 innings. Especially when Ali was offering a clear presentation of a good plan.

The captain and the coach are as culpable as the bowler for persisting with a bad plan, across sessions, when it was clear that it was not working; that it was not going to work.

 

[anaksr]

"If you look at the last three years, we won nine matches overseas and three series. I can't see any other Indian team in the last 15-20 years who had that kind of run in such a short period and you have some great players in those teams." Shastri said.

Seriously, is he high all time. He is actually including SL and WI series as overseas wins. Lol.Only path he will take this team is downwards.

I really would like India to lose badly in next test coz I just can't handle his shiite talk in case of win.

People seem to hate him even more than Greg Chappell.

 

[Bolo]

The captain and the coach are as culpable as the bowler for persisting with a bad plan, across sessions, when it was clear that it was not working; that it was not going to work.

Generally speaking, I would lay almost all of the responsibility on the spinner. In this game though, the thinktank definitely deserves to be called out. It doesn't absolve Ashwin of responsibility though. Changing a plan that isn't working should be his job.

 

[Daemon]

"If you look at the last three years, we won nine matches overseas and three series. I can't see any other Indian team in the last 15-20 years who had that kind of run in such a short period and you have some great players in those teams." Shastri said.

Totally didn't see that coming. Usually Shastri is very level headed and objective.

 

[TheJediBrah]

He's probably technically right tbh. West Indies and Sri Lanka were much stronger back in the day and India probably struggled to win over there as much as the current team is (cbf actually checking).

But yeah claiming that it shows they're doing a good job overseas is a joke. It would be like Australia claiming they are great overseas because they clean sweep New Zealand every time they go there.

 

[Slifer]

I saw what Shastri said and I have to agree that the general sentiment on this board. Beating SL is equivalent to Oz beating NZ and every team not named Bangladesh can win in the WI . India probably came closer than their predecessors to wins in RSA but almost doesn't count. India has won series in England b4 so no comment on that but they could've redeemed themselves from the shellacking they took last time but again they didnt. Now if they cant beat an Oz team minus Smith or Warner then that would be a serious set back.

 

[GotSpin]

This was such a weak English team that can still play decently in their own backyard. They won't win in Australia

 

[Arachnodouche]

"If you look at the last three years, we won nine matches overseas and three series. I can't see any other Indian team in the last 15-20 years who had that kind of run in such a short period and you have some great players in those teams." Shastri said.

Seriously, is he high all time. He is actually including SL and WI series as overseas wins. Lol.Only path he will take this team is downwards.

I really would like India to lose badly in next test coz I just can't handle his shiite talk in case of win.

People seem to hate him even more than Greg Chappell.

He's a bureaucrat saving his skin, what do you expect? Guy should be sent back into the 80s, would fit right in with the Babu Raj of the time.

 

[Adders]

This was such a weak English team that can still play decently in their own backyard. They won't win in Australia

Lol you think?

 

[CasMcG24]

I feel India should now be in a position to win the series than have already lost it. Never mind, this is a series to learn from but still the fact remains.