*Official* South Africa Tour of Sri Lanka 2018

[kingkallis]

While I think Brathwaite is king of the ring, mma styles, , Pat would eat Ben Stokes in a street fight for ny money.

Thats true though. Most of the Wessels/Cronje era Afrikans were that strong and well built.

 

[91Jmay]

SA worst players of spin in the world? Make England look ok.

 

[trundler]

England are historically worse, as are Australia but Australia are probably the worst at it right now. They can't handle mediocre spin on a flat deck.

 

[wpdavid]

England are historically worse, as are Australia but Australia are probably the worst at it right now. They can't handle mediocre spin on a flat deck.

You'd think that their current Smithless lineup would be pretty horrible. England maybe slightly better.

 

[Migara]

33. Pat was a good ODI bowler but didnt offer anything at test level.

He bowled some very good spells in 93-94 series against SL, holding the SL batsmen, who were much better against spinners than current lot. That 93-94 team would eat likes of Maharaj, Jadeja, Shakib etc alive on Lankan tracks. The issue I think was he did not have much experience as an attacking spin option. But his mid 30s it's too late to learn the craft of bowling spin on dust bowls. From what I can remember he had every ingridient to be a good spinner. However, SAF fans may have a better idiea of what he is than me.

 

[Migara]

While I think Brathwaite is king of the ring, mma styles, , Pat would eat Ben Stokes in a street fight for ny money.

Then think of someone going against Brian McMillian.

 

[Maximas]

Karunaratne has a 150 in NZ.

Apart from that Mathews, Chandimal are OK batsmen in these conditions.

Mendis did fine in West Indies.

DDS, Roshen Silva are pretty much hacks in these conditions, and have very little experience in overseas games.

All in all, I can say Wagner, Southee and Boult will be having time of their lives.

There was a time when Matthews was probably just about the best player of pace from the SC (about 2014 probably), but yeah the trio of him, Dimuth and Chandimal is about all we can rely on really, Mendis and DDS are suspect, Roshen lacks the ability to play quality pace and Dickwella seems much the same, Gunathilaka has technical flaws that openers can't afford in those sorts of conditions. If NZ are smart they won't prepare greentracks that bring our seamers into the game and even up the contest/make the toss really crucial

 

[Migara]

Gunathilaka has some flaws against pace, but I think makes up for it being able to dominate pacers. We can expect a good innings here and there from him. DdS is possibly the most correct player we have, and it was his temperament that is an issue at the moment.

 

[R!TTER]

There was a time when Matthews was probably just about the best player of pace from the SC (about 2014 probably), but yeah the trio of him, Dimuth and Chandimal is about all we can rely on really, Mendis and DDS are suspect, Roshen lacks the ability to play quality pace and Dickwella seems much the same, Gunathilaka has technical flaws that openers can't afford in those sorts of conditions. If NZ are smart they won't prepare greentracks that bring our seamers into the game and even up the contest/make the toss really crucial

NZ with their A/R have enough quality to beat SL virtually anywhere & every time in NZ. The key would be to negate SL spin attack, if they can produce tracks that don't do anything for the spinners then expect NZ to whitewash the tourists easily.
SL without a potent spinner is like 1.5 worth of a quality 4 man bowling attack.

 

[Jack1]

The team South Africa has picked leaves a lot of questions. Why is a national team not picking the best possible team to win a test match? It is a test match international side or a club side? I can only conclude they are scared to "offend" some of the pace bowlers. If a pace bowlers gets offended by being left out for a spinner due to the conditions then that is their problem, it means they aren't a team player.

South Africa have picked a bad team in this game . I also feel Philander could have possibly been more useful on this pitch than the other seamers. Philander's seems a more laid back personality than the other seamers and seems to get left out more often for unknown reasons. He is also injury/sick prone which isn't ideal, but he can also bat and can maybe add some useful runs. Philander averages 32 with the ball in Asia and has been criminally under bowled by South Africa's captains in sub-contentinal conditions. This appears to be a culture problem within the team, and captaincy problem, to under bowl Philander so much in the sub-continent when he actually averages 32 with the ball in Asia..despite this SA have picked post-injury Steyn, Rabada and Ngidi. Why are they picking 3 seamers in these conditions anyway? Some teams seem to think it's illegal to select under 3 seamers, it's almost pathetic. They need to wake up to the reality of life. It's test cricket, pick the best team for a given surface. Sides should treat test (and international cricket) as a squad game. The best team should play on a given surface against a given opposition. If a certain batsman plays spin better than he should play in Asia. Too many teams seem to rock up with the same team regardless of the conditions and the opponent. Cricket is treated (and the team is selected) too much as if it's about the individuals and not the team, I don't like it. It's like a club side mentality and I honestly think it's pathetic. Cricket is miles behind reality in terms of team selection. So many teams don't have selection panels that understand cricket or have any balls to make proper decisions. Not enough teams adjust their batting line up either for the conditions and opponent they are playing.

When South Africa are getting bowled out for 124 they cannot at all call this a dead surface either. If they think it's dead for the seamers then who's fault is that? Stop picking so many of them! Also, Du Plessis made 48 off 51 balls and Maharaj has conceded 90 runs off 17 overs in the second innings so the team total of 124 is a very bad score. They have also conceded 489 runs on the same pitch and taken 13 wickets. Maharaj 11 wickets, a run out and one wicket for Rabada. The whole performance, including the team selection, I find to be unacceptable for a test side. Apart from Maharaj of course. Especially disappointing for a team like South Africa. I am disappointed in them and for them to be honest.

 

[Dendarii]

I also feel Philander could have possibly been more useful on this pitch than the other seamers. Philander's seems a more laid back personality than the other seamers and seems to get left out more often for unknown reasons. Philander averages 32 with the ball in Asia and has been criminally under bowled by South Africa's captains in sub-contentinal conditions. This appears to be a culture problem within the team, and captaincy problem, to under bowl Philander so much in the sub-continent when he actually averages 32 with the ball in Asia..despite this SA have picked Steyn, Rabada and Ngidi.

I don't understand your point about Philander's average as he has a worse average in Asia than both Steyn (23.91) and Rabada (28.20). And while it may seem on the face of it that he's been under-bowled, could that be because it was felt he wasn't being effective in the first match (and also why he was left out for this one)?

If a certain batsman plays spin better than he should play in Asia.

So who are the South African batsmen who should have been picked because they're better players of spin? I don't know if you can say with any certainty that there are any as this is probably the best batting line-up that South Africa could picked. Maybe there's a case to be made for Klaasen to have played instead of De Kock, or possibly even De Bruyn, but it's not as though not picking Klaasen was a glaring oversight.

The reality is that there aren't too many obvious candidates outside of the current squad. There are some promising youngsters, but South Africa were never going to take a chance and select any of them.

 

[Jack1]

I don't understand your point about Philander's average as he has a worse average in Asia than both Steyn (23.91) and Rabada (28.20). And while it may seem on the face of it that he's been under-bowled, could that be because it was felt he wasn't being effective in the first match (and also why he was left out for this one)?



So who are the South African batsmen who should have been picked because they're better players of spin? I don't know if you can say with any certainty that there are any as this is probably the best batting line-up that South Africa could picked. Maybe there's a case to be made for Klaasen to have played instead of De Kock, or possibly even De Bruyn, but it's not as though not picking Klaasen was a glaring oversight.

The reality is that there aren't too many obvious candidates outside of the current squad. There are some promising youngsters, but South Africa were never going to take a chance and select any of them.

Steyn took 1-89 last game and has taken 0-70 this game. He made 10 runs with the bat in three innings. He's had injury problems and has zero test form. Philander got given 11 overs in an entire test mach for 1-38. This game Steyn has been given 21 wicketless overs. That's garbage captaincy. It shows inconsistencies in captaincy and favouritism based on no substance. Steyn has added 10 runs in 3 innings with the bat. Philander got out once last game for 40 runs.

You are ignoring the point about picking bowlers to suit the pitch and team balance. In my view Philander's pace, trajectory, skidiness and accuracy is arguably more suited to the pitch than any seam bowler picked. Philander's style on all surfaces is building pressure with patience and accuracy, plus a little movement. By not giving him a chance to create this pressure it isn't helpful for him or the team. I think it's criminal he only got bowled 11 overs in an entire test match, how's he meant to get a rhythm at all or create pressure for the batsman? I do not agree with Steyn getting so many overs for a return of 1-159 over 2 games. This is garbage captaincy and selection. Philander creates more team balance too as he can bat.

There is plenty of debate in terms of averages vs seam and spin if you crunch all the first class and test averages. I'm not going to do it for all your available first class batsmen that's for sure. You should have a team statistician for that. Your whole team is struggling badly against spin and surely has to re-think it's selection over the whole side. My point is an observation and also a criticism of South Africa's effort to pick their side. I think you are in a state of denial at the moment. This team selection isn't acceptable. On this surface I'd have picked 3 spinners** and Rabada pre-match, the Philander debate was a discussion of poor captaincy and muddled thinking in the team. Don't pick a bowler and not give him a chance to shine. His confidence and rhythm must be ruined, hence I wouldn't have picked him (or Steyn) anyway after the **** show captaincy of him in the first test. We are both entitled to our opinions, I just think SA need a massive re-think after how they've handled captaincy and team selection in this game. Field placings can also be debated and bowling plans. Everything can be improved. I like all teams to be competitive, I hate seeing a side lose heavily..that's why I'm annoyed. Don't take offence lol

 

[Flametree]

On the story of Sri Lankan batting options for overseas tests - what's happening with Guneratne?

 

[Starfighter]

Just watched the highlights. Nice to see that South Africa have adopted a crease-bound push at the ball strategy clearly modelled on the Australian players over the past five or so years.

 

[Bahseph]

Just watched the highlights. Nice to see that South Africa have adopted a crease-bound push at the ball strategy clearly modelled on the Australian players over the past five or so years.

Amla was so good playing off the back foot to spinners just a few years ago. Reflexes aren't the same anymore so he is being found out more. Elgar not getting stuck in has hurt us more than people realize imo. Even in that 2015 Indian tour he showed more application than anyone not named AB de Villiers.

 

[Bahseph]

If I was SL I wouldn't be too happy playing Gunathilaka in Tests. Maybe I'll be proven wrong but if the ball is moving around a little for the pacers I can't see him lasting long. And he seems to lose his patience against the spinners as well. Mathews is definitely on the wane for some reason. Hope he pulls it together. But Mendis and de Silva are huge for the team in the next five years. They have to build around them.

 

[Slifer]

This series kinda puts in perspective the shellacking Australia took a few years ago.

 

[TheJediBrah]

A part of me feels like Steyn should have retired and all this is doing is tarnishing his legacy and stats. He's doing a Ponting

 

[OverratedSanity]

Lmao Steyn's had a couple of quiet tests on flat decks. Let's wait a bit before comparing him to Ponting ffs.

 

[TheJediBrah]

heh true but I do wonder if he has it in him to still be a force at Test level post-injury