Baggy Green ball tampering: Bancroft, Smith and the Aussie "Leadership Group"

[Borges]

Alas, this thread too, is surely going to go down the sewer now.

 

[SteveNZ]

People have very large blinkers on if they think the Australian team is any worse than India or South Africa

Behavioural wise? You're an incredible sycophant if you think Australia are the same as India or SA.

 

[ankitj]

anyone who was angry about that, or thinks it was bad behaviour in any way, should be sterilised IMO. The outrage at that was laughable.

Slow old guy was just dozing around in the middle of the stage, Martyn gives him a friendly touch on the back. Literally lays his hand gently on his back a couple of times to wake the guy up and remind him it's past his bed time. Nek minnit Damien Martyn is an evil person because he "shoved" the guy "off the stage"

edit: sterilised is a bit harsh. But it was pretty damn stupid

Somethings offender doesn't get to decide, the offended does.

 

[ankitj]

Although the slow old man is a corrupt leader (joke goes around that he is wealthiest in India if his unaccounted wealth is considered), so good on Martyn.

 

[Borges]

Stop feeding the troll. Please. Pretty please.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Somethings offender doesn't get to decide, the offended does.

The Western world has already gone down that road too far, don't encourage it

Behavioural wise? You're an incredible sycophant if you think Australia are the same as India or SA.

Ah there are those blinkers we were talking about

 

[flibbertyjibber]

People have very large blinkers on if they think the Australian team is any worse than India or South Africa

It isn't that though it is the sanctimonious way Australia have conducted themselves for many years and now the chickens are coming home to roost and it is wonderful.

 

[ankitj]

The Western world has already gone down that road too far, don't encourage it

Haha. Believe it or not I expected this response and had started thinking of my response to this response

 

[TheJediBrah]

Just wait, in a few years using terms like "Third man" in cricket is going to be ban-worthy because it offends a feminist who heard it said on the cricket on tv as she was passing by

 

[cnerd123]

Just wait, in a few years using terms like "Third man" in cricket is going to be ban-worthy because it offends a feminist who heard it said on the cricket on tv as she was passing by

I'm sure Fine Leg will go before that.

 

[StephenZA]

Just wait, in a few years using terms like "Third man" in cricket is going to be ban-worthy because it offends a feminist who heard it said on the cricket on tv as she was passing by

Not during a men's game....only during a woman's match.

 

[Top_Cat]

One thing I'm surprised about is how many cricketers/ex-cricketers are saying that they can't believe that Lehmann didn't know.

I just can't see any circumstances in which the plan is announced blatantly enough for the coach to know about it. How can that not be interpreted as the coaches of their international sides knowing what "dark arts" their players were up to, and what they were doing each day?

Gillespie definitely on the side of Lehmann knew nothing.

Maybe it's his rep for always siding with his boys over the heirarchy, makes it difficult to believe he wasn't in on it. Clashed with the SACA board regularly when he was skipper at the slightest hint of interference from them.

I dunno, we're all guessing.

 

[Furball]

I'm sure Fine Leg will go before that.

Cow Corner IMO.

 

[howardj]

Just as an aside, people keep implying Smith is being punished for 'ball tampering', that's not true, he has got into trouble with the ICC because he brought the game into disrepute by his actions, both of allowing it and initially covering it up. Bancroft got the pretty standard 3 demerit points and 75% match fee. Everything else is being done by the CA themselves and the Australian public, they should blame themselves for overreacting not the rest of the world; who are actually laughing at them more than getting upset with the players.

Two stupid things that have seen this careen out of control

1. Steve Smith going into detail about how the ball tampering was planned. In this defence, I guess he did this to not let Bancroft (a young player on the fringe) hang out to dry

2. The non-cricket media here in Australia getting hold of this and thinking that ball tampering is a high-level offence in cricket.

If Smith had have just said stonewalled at the presser, this would not have been such a big deal.

 

[cnerd123]

Cow Corner IMO.

Do you think they'll take offense to Silly Point as well?

 

[Starfighter]

Lehmann at heart of cultural contradiction - ESPNcricinfo

Almost get the feeling with what feels like a let off for Lehmann (maybe not forever, but probably behind closed doors); that Mickey Arthur did not do things 'the Australian way' but Lehmann does so therefore he is alright. Continuous contradictions from the CA.

I don't think anybody really thinks that Smith or Bancroft should be sanctioned more than what the ICC has done; Warner is more a last straw problem, internal to the Australian squad. But everybody seems to realize that Lehmann has created a toxic atmosphere not good for the team. Except of course the people getting punished by the CA are the ones getting hard done by, and the biggest issue is being ignored.

Just as an aside, people keep implying Smith is being punished for 'ball tampering', that's not true, he has got into trouble with the ICC because he brought the game into disrepute by his actions, both of allowing it and initially covering it up. Bancroft got the pretty standard 3 demerit points and 75% match fee. Everything else is being done by the CA themselves and the Australian public, they should blame themselves for overreacting not the rest of the world; who are actually laughing at them more than getting upset with the players.

If you mean on this forum, maybe..., but I think there are enough out there who think otherwise.

I've thought that Lehmann passed his use-by date at least a year, and maybe two, ago. And I think you're right that it's the perception of his ways that has kept him in the role over this. Smith's weak captaincy and poor team guidance hasn't helped. His leadership group is clearly just his NSW teammates and Lehmann's allowing these cliques to form has been quite damaging.

 

[OverratedSanity]

If Australia think handing Smith a one year ban means other fans have to expect their players to get similar bans if they get caught tampering, then nah, sorry. If I was Australian, I wouldn't be part of this over the top outrage mob baying for blood. And if one day Kohli gets caught redhanded ordering Pujara to rub his acne all over the ball, then I won't be calling for a ban. I also don't expect the BCCI to do it.

 

[stephen]

Two stupid things that have seen this careen out of control

1. Steve Smith going into detail about how the ball tampering was planned. In this defence, I guess he did this to not let Bancroft (a young player on the fringe) hang out to dry

2. The non-cricket media here in Australia getting hold of this and thinking that ball tampering is a high-level offence in cricket.

If Smith had have just said stonewalled at the presser, this would not have been such a big deal.

Thoroughly agree.

It was the sheer stupidity of the press conference that has blown this up so badly.

Part of it was that it sounded like smith trotting out the same old platitudes when the situation was completely different. Part of it was the ball tampering = cheating perception. Part of it was that Smith made it sound like a grand conspiracy where it was probably a three minute conversation between Warner and Bancroft.

 

[SteveNZ]

Ah there are those blinkers we were talking about

Doing the same thing James Sutherland has been doing for years, pretending there's no problem.

I'm a neutral. Yes, India are reasonably poorly behaved - their power-wielding Board ensures they can do it without recrimination - and SA have their moments, but none of them are as consistently ****witty as Australia. Only Australia could take something like us living by a no sledging edict, take offence to it and carry on like Haddin, Faulkner and co in the WC final. No other country values the childish name calling and verbal diarrhea as much, although India and SA do try hard for silver and bronze.

You only have to look at the reaction around the world to have this confirmed. If this was Kohli and Jadeja, or Faf and QDK, there wouldn't be as much outrage/public opinion/column inches. It's because the dirty old Aussies have finally been brought to task. And don't think for a second we on the outside don't love it.

Maybe we'll finally get the discussion of cricket back over this other ****. Like happens in most non-Australian X v Y threads.

 

[cnerd123]

If Australia think handing Smith a one year ban means other fans have to expect their players to get similar bans if they get caught tampering, then nah, sorry. If I was Australian, I wouldn't be part of this over the top outrage mob baying for blood. And if one day Kohli gets caught redhanded ordering Pujara to rub his acne all over the ball, then I won't be calling for a ban. I also don't expect the BCCI to do it.

What's worse is that Australia are going to use this heavy handed ban to continue to be sanctimonious and act as tho they are superior to rest of the world.

"Look we know where the line is and if one of our own crosses it we come down hard"

Can't win with these ****s