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***Official*** Australia in South Africa 2018

Dendarii

International Debutant
I`m interested to see how the PE crowd treat Warner.... we are not normally that unruly, but you wonder if the band might come up with a few new songs?
The band is instrumental though - it's not like the Barmy Army who would have wasted no time in coming up with a set of lyrics, and I don't know if there's any well known song that would work as something to direct at Warner. Besides, it would mean that the band would then have three songs in their repertoire, and how would they cope with so many to choose from?
 
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Bolo

State Captain
No set of data in this sort of discussion is going to be perfect, I selected the closest possible. For example, comparing him to the other opening bowlers rather than the change bowlers, and selecting 4-7 because it seemed more relevant to the actual discussion. 3-7 would have worked too but considering how often early wickets fall and no.3 comes out against the new ball I considered it best to be left out. And not including no.7, as was done in the initial analysis, is a clear error in sampling IMO. Unless a team plays 5 genuine bowlers then no.7 is always a decent bat.

I just don't think there's any evidence that Starc is worse against the middle-order than his contemporaries. I understand all the reasoning you've put forward to why you think so, but I'm just not sure it's actually based in fact. I don't completely disagree though. He's a swing bowler, he uses swing (regular and reverse) more than a Cummins-type bowler. This is just common sense. If you're just trying to say that he's less effective when the ball isn't swinging, that's great, so are most bowlers.

As I said before as well, a better stat would be his averages against each position (ie. runs scored divided by wickets taken) rather than pure percentage of wickets. I think that would show better his utility against the tail compared to other bowlers, which was the initial point of the discussion.

edit: and if we're going to continue this discussion we should try keep responses shorter. I'm not going to lie, I didn't read your whole post. It was massive.
I can see from your first line that you didn't read the whole post. No point continuing the conversation in that case.
 

Bahseph

International Debutant
Had to literally Google what Warner meant. I suppose by wanting to physically hurt QDK he was proving he wasn't a crybaby/whiner/complainer. It's all so trivial. Back to the cricket please.
 

quincywagstaff

International Debutant
David Warner has broken his silence and is defiant about the incident, saying QDK - you guessed it - crossed a line with his comments.

Re: his excessive celebration after the ABDV runout, Warner said this:
The way we celebrate or other people celebrate should never be questioned, I don’t think.
Somehow Warner forgot about this in a 2013 T20 v Sri Lanka when - after Thisara Perera gave Maxwell a send-off after winning a tight match - confronted Perera while the sides were shaking hands and a nasty confrontation broke out.

I think this is the biggest problem with how Australian sides view sledging - when it's done on their terms and their 'moral boundaries' apparently everything is fair game and opponents who complain are soft and weak. But when any other side doesn't play by their rules they turn into the moral preening and self-righteousness Warner displays where he's acting like he's the sworn protector of women's nobility.
 

quincywagstaff

International Debutant
As for South Africa, it was as foolish of them to appeal QDK's sanction; just take it on the chin and let it go.

Reminds me of how they reacted to Faf Du Plessis' sancation for ball tampering on their last Oz tour. Sure, that's a blight you don't want against any player (let alone your captain) but the way they reacted with a siege mentality and this ridiculous behaviour with the media afterwards made a mountain out of a molehill (and that was a incident that the Oz cricketers/media seemed to have a fair of sympathy with Faf over).
 

Gnske

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
David Warner has broken his silence and is defiant about the incident, saying QDK - you guessed it - crossed a line with his comments.

Re: his excessive celebration after the ABDV runout, Warner said this:


Somehow Warner forgot about this in a 2013 T20 v Sri Lanka when - after Thisara Perera gave Maxwell a send-off after winning a tight match - confronted Perera while the sides were shaking hands and a nasty confrontation broke out.

I think this is the biggest problem with how Australian sides view sledging - when it's done on their terms and their 'moral boundaries' apparently everything is fair game and opponents who complain are soft and weak. But when any other side doesn't play by their rules they turn into the moral preening and self-righteousness Warner displays where he's acting like he's the sworn protector of women's nobility.
Oh wow, David Warner is such a victim. Anti-racist and a proponent for women's rights.
 

stephen

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Honestly I think Warner is mostly misunderstood. His combative demeanor generally gets him in trouble when he's genuinely not trying to do anything dickish. Like that time he got flack for asking someone to speak English. I mean if probably ask someone the same if they were talking to me on the pitch in a foreign language as well.

This incident looked worse on camera than it was in real life. I've seen much worse on the cricket pitch.
 

Crazy Sam

International 12th Man
Between this and the Matt Lodge thing in NRL, I can't think of a week of more boring sports journalism and general media coverage in sport. Storm in last week's teacup.
 

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Between this and the Matt Lodge thing in NRL, I can't think of a week of more boring sports journalism and general media coverage in sport. Storm in last week's teacup.
The fact that scummy ****er Lodge has signed for your club is obviously blinding you. He has no place in the NRL. And your hypocritical coach will be totally fine with it until Lodge loses form, then Bennett will drop him like a hot pie.

I'm actually over it now as well. Warner is such a thick ****, it's pointless thinking he'll ever wake up and realise he consistently makes a ****wit of himself every time he ventures onto a cricket field. It'll be a fine day when he rides off into retirement and we don't have to hear about him.
 

quincywagstaff

International Debutant
If I didn't see constantly headlines about it on the Foxsports website, I wouldn't even know this Matt Lodge controversy existed. It's amazing the difference in sporting interests between places like NSW & Victoria for something like that, Melbourne Storm's success notwithstanding.
 

Crazy Sam

International 12th Man
Genuinely don't see how you could think the Matt Lodge issue is not a big deal.
My lack of interest is less to do with the specific incident, and significantly more to do with the 24 hour self-feeding media cycle that exists in sport now due to multitudes of sport-specific channels and sport panel shows. Journos and former players make comments on their shows, often without many of the facts, and those comments are then blown up into their own new stories. You look at the Warner incident - each media outlet has their own former player/s making comments on it, and they are then making new articles reporting on what the other outlets' former players said about it. It is no better than all the online news articles whose reports consist entirely of random twitter reactions to something.

Regarding Lodge, I hate that the Broncos have signed him - unfortunately clubs and teams we support don't always make decisions we agree with - and it's a sad indictment on the quality and depth of their squad this year, but the guy's been there for 12 months and the media is only bringing it up now because they haven't had any major off-field incidents this off season to fill their boots with. If the NRL weren't going to permanently ban Russell Packer or Robert Lui, I'm not sure why anyone would expect they would do so with Lodge.
 
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Adders

Cricketer Of The Year
Honestly I think Warner is mostly misunderstood. His combative demeanor generally gets him in trouble when he's genuinely not trying to do anything dickish. Like that time he got flack for asking someone to speak English. I mean if probably ask someone the same if they were talking to me on the pitch in a foreign language as well.
.
The fact you can't see the problem here is really disturbing.
 

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