StephenZA
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Rightly so. Pity he did not get his 200. Is Bavuma back in time for the Aus series? Because if not de Bruyn really should be playing.
-
Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.
You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
***Official*** South African Domestic Season 2017/18
- Thread starter SeamUp
- Start date
SeamUp
International Coach
I think Bavuma is back.
We needed to find out more about de Bruyn. Yes, that pitch more than likely would have seen him fail but it was more than just runs we needed to see. I just wanted to see his demeanour and technical ability more than anything.
I admire Otis and Faf for being aggressive but if it over-takes common sense they can go sit back down.
SeamUp
International Coach
Something that has been bugging me.
There seems to be a real lack of coastal batsman being produced and generally the past has shown they've been more adaptable on tired wickets or against spin.
Nothing against up country batsman. I mean Elgar, de Kock, AB, Faf are awesome. But it just seems to be up country batsman scoring the big runs domestically too at this stage. You got ask , is it just generational talent, is it the wickets suiting more run scoring up there or what ? I find it interesting actually.
There seems to be a real lack of coastal batsman being produced and generally the past has shown they've been more adaptable on tired wickets or against spin.
Nothing against up country batsman. I mean Elgar, de Kock, AB, Faf are awesome. But it just seems to be up country batsman scoring the big runs domestically too at this stage. You got ask , is it just generational talent, is it the wickets suiting more run scoring up there or what ? I find it interesting actually.
Last edited:
SeamUp
International Coach
Dupavillon back. Accuracy with speed. Couple of edges through the slips contribute to his 11 2-19 : NAM 123/6 (40.1 ov, D van Schoor 1*, CW Coombe 15*, P Subrayen 1/20) - Live | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo
Dolphins currently 40-3 and without a strike quick bowling option : DOLPH 40/3 (11.0 ov, S Muthusamy 15*, BS Makhanya 1*, D Olivier 1/24) - Lunch | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo They will have to find a better balance from round 7 I feel. Possibly involving leaving Frylinck out.
Lions still struggling : LIONS 164/8 (64.0 ov, Z Pongolo 11*, BE Hendricks 0*, A Gqamane 1/15) - Lunch | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo
Dolphins currently 40-3 and without a strike quick bowling option : DOLPH 40/3 (11.0 ov, S Muthusamy 15*, BS Makhanya 1*, D Olivier 1/24) - Lunch | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo They will have to find a better balance from round 7 I feel. Possibly involving leaving Frylinck out.
Lions still struggling : LIONS 164/8 (64.0 ov, Z Pongolo 11*, BE Hendricks 0*, A Gqamane 1/15) - Lunch | Match Summary | ESPNCricinfo
Last edited:
Gnske
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Is Malan another one of those cases of beefed up three day stats covering for actual mediocrity?
SeamUp
International Coach
Pretty much.
His franchise career started 3 times before his current one. Basically failures and tough to break into a Titans unit.
Moved to CT and got a Cobras contract. Lost his contract and piled runs for WP. Now he has his Cobras contract and is scoring 100s and been their best batsman this season.
Basically a 10 year journey.
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
de Bruyn has been mucked around this season. Not a huge fan and he is a very poor player of spin but having him around the test setup for weeks when there was no chance of him playing wasn’t ideal. He needs to be playing.
On spin, shows you how bad the situation is when Phangiso at the age of 34 takes a five wicket haul for the first time in franchise cricket and Smuts is taking wickets and bowling first change. You have to question the quality.
On spin, shows you how bad the situation is when Phangiso at the age of 34 takes a five wicket haul for the first time in franchise cricket and Smuts is taking wickets and bowling first change. You have to question the quality.
SeamUp
International Coach
KZN seam-bowling attack better than the Dolphins.
Wonder if Dupavillon comes in next game for Dolphins or will need another. Suppose there is a 50-over tomorrow too.
11 2-19
Dupavillon to du Preez, OUT,
MD du Preez c †Oakes b Dupavillon 9 (41m 23b 1x4 0x6) SR: 39.13
Dupavillon to Loftie-Eaton, OUT, Yorker gets through. Beautiful delivery .
N Loftie-Eaton b Dupavillon 8 (16m 16b 1x4 0x6) SR: 50.00
11.3 4-15
Dupavillon to Birkenstock, OUT, goes on the front foot to fend and misses
K Birkenstock b Dupavillon 2 (11m 11b 0x4 0x6) SR: 18.18
Dupavillon to Snyman, OUT, pulling a short delivery and edging to gulley
G Snyman c Savage b Dupavillon 41 (147m 94b 5x4 0x6) SR: 43.61
Dupavillon to Coetzee, OUT, drives off the front foot at a full length delivery and misses. Leg stumps is spilt in two.
F Coetzee b Dupavillon 0 (3m 1b 0x4 0x6) SR: 0.00
Dupavillon to Ngupita, OUT, YORKER and leg stump is up-rooted.
M Ngupita b Dupavillon 0 (5m 5b 0x4 0x6) SR: 0.00
Wonder if Dupavillon comes in next game for Dolphins or will need another. Suppose there is a 50-over tomorrow too.
11 2-19
Dupavillon to du Preez, OUT,
MD du Preez c †Oakes b Dupavillon 9 (41m 23b 1x4 0x6) SR: 39.13
Dupavillon to Loftie-Eaton, OUT, Yorker gets through. Beautiful delivery .
N Loftie-Eaton b Dupavillon 8 (16m 16b 1x4 0x6) SR: 50.00
11.3 4-15
Dupavillon to Birkenstock, OUT, goes on the front foot to fend and misses
K Birkenstock b Dupavillon 2 (11m 11b 0x4 0x6) SR: 18.18
Dupavillon to Snyman, OUT, pulling a short delivery and edging to gulley
G Snyman c Savage b Dupavillon 41 (147m 94b 5x4 0x6) SR: 43.61
Dupavillon to Coetzee, OUT, drives off the front foot at a full length delivery and misses. Leg stumps is spilt in two.
F Coetzee b Dupavillon 0 (3m 1b 0x4 0x6) SR: 0.00
Dupavillon to Ngupita, OUT, YORKER and leg stump is up-rooted.
M Ngupita b Dupavillon 0 (5m 5b 0x4 0x6) SR: 0.00
SeamUp
International Coach
The funny thing is Fortuin should be playing over Phangiso.
P.Malan, D.Hendricks, Agathangelou, van der Dussen are scoring runs. That is not even getting to the Ramela/Zondo types whose average have gone up.
Numbers certainly aren't what you should be picking future SA players on more than ever now but SA 'A' results in the last few years have been worse than ever and that is an indicator even with the Kolpak defectors taken into account.
Pup Clarke
Cricketer Of The Year
Mulder's going to come into some serious contention if he can play a substantial and match-winning knock here. Will highlight if he's potentially a good clutch player
SeamUp
International Coach
Didn't do it but scored some clutch runs earlier in the season but really in an ideal world he needed 2/3 seasons in a strong domestic circuit like we used to have.
So will now be fast tracked to SA A and possibly SA to learn on the job as clearly identified from SA U19 and academy.
GRAB
First Class Debutant
Funny thing is, the two most experienced veterans (who aren't that old that their eye should be going) are struggling: Cook averaging 23, Puttick 16 (dropped after 3 games)...
Malan's two younger brothers also piling runs in the 3 day competition...
Before this season, Pieter Malan had 24 matches and 44 innings in 9(?) seasons and averaged 24,5 with 7 50's and 1 hundred.
Only worse active specialist batsmen at that point were Grant Mokoena 23,6; Kelly Smuts 22,5 - assuming he is picked as a batsmen not a medium-slow bowler, though I'm not 100% sure why he has ever been picked; Sincuba 22,4; G Abrahams 21,8; Conway 21,3 (another 2nd team wunderkind - he's now playing for Wellington in NZ, I see); Seyibokwe 20,2; Mnyanda 16,1; Khomari 14,9; Sesele 12,8.
Francois Le Clus was still in my database, but he retired in 2014 from what I can gather so I removed him...
Malan's two younger brothers also piling runs in the 3 day competition...
Before this season, Pieter Malan had 24 matches and 44 innings in 9(?) seasons and averaged 24,5 with 7 50's and 1 hundred.
Only worse active specialist batsmen at that point were Grant Mokoena 23,6; Kelly Smuts 22,5 - assuming he is picked as a batsmen not a medium-slow bowler, though I'm not 100% sure why he has ever been picked; Sincuba 22,4; G Abrahams 21,8; Conway 21,3 (another 2nd team wunderkind - he's now playing for Wellington in NZ, I see); Seyibokwe 20,2; Mnyanda 16,1; Khomari 14,9; Sesele 12,8.
Francois Le Clus was still in my database, but he retired in 2014 from what I can gather so I removed him...
SeamUp
International Coach
Puttick probably wouldn't have been dropped if there were no quota players like Khomari for example. Would be fantastic for guys like Hamza, Smith, Verreynne, Williams, Cohen etc to share a changing room with someone so dedicated and hard-working with over 10 000 FC runs. Looks like Putters has faded into the distance. Pity because he has been awesome player for the region.
Same with Cook but I am not sure where the Lions are as a group. Probably lacking quality all round though. He is captain still so I wonder if he will got for one more season. At the moment it looks more questionable than at the start because he is just blocking future SA players competing for spots with the limited numbers.
GRAB
First Class Debutant
Aganthangelou played his 3rd franchise game, with a break of approximately 9 years from the first two...
So is it lack of quality, or dead pitches that is causing the high scoring... Even consistent franchise bowlers like Duanne Olivier, Marchant de Lange (got a 5 in this round), Dwayne Pretorius, Frylinck and Paterson haven't had consistent penetration.
So is it lack of quality, or dead pitches that is causing the high scoring... Even consistent franchise bowlers like Duanne Olivier, Marchant de Lange (got a 5 in this round), Dwayne Pretorius, Frylinck and Paterson haven't had consistent penetration.
SeamUp
International Coach
Just looking at each union now and where the talent depth is right now. Having a look at provincial games this week and stats over the season and what I saw at franchise level.
COBRAS
Western Province : Once again they got comfortably dealt with in the recent rounds. . Galiem been really disappointing. His bowling is basically struggling to be stock and he can't take wickets. I've always believed he is a batting all-rounder (Justin Kemp mould) but he still has no hundreds at provincial level. Saying that the batting 'all-rounder' they've backed is Jason Smith who even was called up to SA 'A' but he has had an awful season so the Cobras obviously feel he has more talent and a higher ceiling especially with the bat than Galiem to stick with him like they have. Cohen had done really well considering SA Academy and franchise cricket debut with a 5-for happened so quickly. Seems to be used as a change bowler to make things happen like Wagner but would hope he tries to be more adaptable with skill levels he has spoken of to hopefully swing the ball into RHB as a left-armer. Linde really improved his batting output in limited overs comps this season stepping up for the Cobras and got a decent amount of wickets too to confirm as the unions #1 limited overs spinner. Hamza and Verreynne are seen as definites in the Cobras 4-day side at the moment after putting in a good season with the bat. They also got their first taste of limited overs cricket with limited success but decent starts.
Boland : Vasconcelos hasn't knocked the door down enough but being a keeper and better suited to longer version cricket he will be struggling to get past Verreynne. His only other option is as an opener but one of those spots is currently used to fill up Black African quota. David Bedingham is back. Same vintage as Jason Smith and Zubayr Hamza and was seen as the most talented but the least hard-working and struggled to put innings together. He is just back after missing a year in cricket due to a car accident and I see he has put some really good numbers together. One to keep an eye on. The spinner Kyle Simmonds probably hasn't had the season he had hoped after going on CSA spin camp with Linde and is behind Piedt and Linde currently. Lizaad Williams at his age probably frustrated he is only getting red ball cricket for the Cobras. I was thinking he may have to move to the Knights but he is doing ok with the red ball for the Cobras and I am not sure they will want to lose him.
WARRIORS
Eastern Province : Edward Moore in between the Warriors and EP. Has backed up a decent season last in 4-day cricket with this. Still don't think he has a high ceiling as he is very loose (technique wise) in his batting movements with the way his rigid arms/hands play away from the body. Be interesting to see what happens with Breetzke now with Moore getting injured do they involve him quickly after the WC after debuting in 4-day & 1-day cricket before the WC. Breetzke joining up with the SA Academy will also be good for him as it will be his first tour to Asia (will be looking out for batting position). Tladi Bokako looks to have made good progression into the Warriors 4-day set-up as a stock bounce bowler having been through the SA Academy and playing in CSA invitational games. They will probably work a bit with Breetzke's mate Lutho Sipamla who has debuted for the Warriors this season and is a steady seamer. A real breakthrough season for Anrich Nortje. Playing a decent amount of games and tries to make something happen when things are quiet.
DOLPHINS
KZN : Savage and Subrayen are at a stage where they far too good for provincial so need to be getting into the franchise team more regularly. Same for Dupavillon but obviously he has had an injury. Sen Muthusamy had a steady first full season with the Dolphins. More so with the ball but will need to produce regularly and consistently with the bat to take it to the next level. Marques Ackerman and Grant Roelofsen have moved down from Gauteng so more or less the future to van Wyk, van Jaarsveld and Vilas. Sibz Makhanya has really struggled to make the franchise grade. Then it is to the younger seamers. Lwandiswa Zuma and Okhule Cele been injured but part of the SA Academy and Eathan Bosch is with the SA Academy this winter. Options are around.
KNIGHTS
Free State : Andries Gous scored runs in the 50-over comp but difficult to break-in with Second as a wk. Leus du Plooy hasn't really kicked on at all. SA u19 captain Raynard van Tonder needs to prove he is better than these 2 and experienced Pite van Biljon to get a Knights chance. I'm sure he will do it.
Northern Cape : So much was expected of Patrick Kruger opening in the T20s but he just kept failing. As the 50-over season went on they batted him in the middle order where he hot his maiden List A 100 and contributed with a few other scores.
LIONS
Gauteng : Ryan Rickelton has had another dominant season for Gauteng. Got his chance for the Lions but felt it was unfair how they used him from 3 to 7 and he kept wicket to win he really is an opener. Whereas Janneman Malan got a go for the last few 50-over Lions games as an opener. With Cook, vd Bergh, Pretorius all under pressure in franchise cricket these 2 should get opportunities. Surely only a matter of time till Hardus Viljoen will be needed less and they won't have to go to other strike bowlers bar Nandre Burger (a big left-arm option) who is attending the SA Academy this winter. Wiaan Mulder has basically cemented his spot in the Lions XI and already has 2 Sunfoil Series centuries at 19 and his bowling is coming along everytime you see him. More speed and good skiddy accuracy. Two further options I will watch with interest is Muhammed Mayet and Wandile Makwetu as young batsman. A union of this stature shouldn't really be messing about with some of the senior batsman they currently are with.
North West : Janneman Malan (see above) did well in his few games for the Lions and will definitely be an option in limited overs cricket for next season especially.
TITANS
Northerns : The Titans have had to pull from the union and Tuks massively as part of a well oiled process. Markram , Klaasen, Ngidi as recent examples. This season we've seen more of De Zorzi, Moonsamy, Pretorius and C.Bosch and even some older campaigners like Hawken and Agathangelou who Boucher strongly believes in. Think de Zorzi, Moonsamy, Pretorius, Bosch have had decent starts to their franchise careers without anything special but it is a good base for them. They seem to be thinking they have found a role for De Zorzi at the top of the order where he scored runs in 50-over cricket. Moonsamy was batting 3 in 50-overs cricket and was relatively consistent and has just made his 4-day debut as a keeper replacing Klaasen for the Titans and got a nice 70-odd. Pretorius played in the first batch of 4-day games and was impressive in helping Ngidi bowl the Titans to a win at the Wanderers. Whereas Bosch been used more successfully in limited overs cricket and was getting it through at 140 (got better the more he played) . Hawken back from another injury has been preferred to Pretorius and Bosch in the latest round of fixtures and done fairly nicely on a flat track. Otherwise excited to see Jiveshan Pillay's continued development especially with Henry Davids' career near the end and Vandiar slowly drifting away.
COBRAS
Western Province : Once again they got comfortably dealt with in the recent rounds. . Galiem been really disappointing. His bowling is basically struggling to be stock and he can't take wickets. I've always believed he is a batting all-rounder (Justin Kemp mould) but he still has no hundreds at provincial level. Saying that the batting 'all-rounder' they've backed is Jason Smith who even was called up to SA 'A' but he has had an awful season so the Cobras obviously feel he has more talent and a higher ceiling especially with the bat than Galiem to stick with him like they have. Cohen had done really well considering SA Academy and franchise cricket debut with a 5-for happened so quickly. Seems to be used as a change bowler to make things happen like Wagner but would hope he tries to be more adaptable with skill levels he has spoken of to hopefully swing the ball into RHB as a left-armer. Linde really improved his batting output in limited overs comps this season stepping up for the Cobras and got a decent amount of wickets too to confirm as the unions #1 limited overs spinner. Hamza and Verreynne are seen as definites in the Cobras 4-day side at the moment after putting in a good season with the bat. They also got their first taste of limited overs cricket with limited success but decent starts.
Boland : Vasconcelos hasn't knocked the door down enough but being a keeper and better suited to longer version cricket he will be struggling to get past Verreynne. His only other option is as an opener but one of those spots is currently used to fill up Black African quota. David Bedingham is back. Same vintage as Jason Smith and Zubayr Hamza and was seen as the most talented but the least hard-working and struggled to put innings together. He is just back after missing a year in cricket due to a car accident and I see he has put some really good numbers together. One to keep an eye on. The spinner Kyle Simmonds probably hasn't had the season he had hoped after going on CSA spin camp with Linde and is behind Piedt and Linde currently. Lizaad Williams at his age probably frustrated he is only getting red ball cricket for the Cobras. I was thinking he may have to move to the Knights but he is doing ok with the red ball for the Cobras and I am not sure they will want to lose him.
WARRIORS
Eastern Province : Edward Moore in between the Warriors and EP. Has backed up a decent season last in 4-day cricket with this. Still don't think he has a high ceiling as he is very loose (technique wise) in his batting movements with the way his rigid arms/hands play away from the body. Be interesting to see what happens with Breetzke now with Moore getting injured do they involve him quickly after the WC after debuting in 4-day & 1-day cricket before the WC. Breetzke joining up with the SA Academy will also be good for him as it will be his first tour to Asia (will be looking out for batting position). Tladi Bokako looks to have made good progression into the Warriors 4-day set-up as a stock bounce bowler having been through the SA Academy and playing in CSA invitational games. They will probably work a bit with Breetzke's mate Lutho Sipamla who has debuted for the Warriors this season and is a steady seamer. A real breakthrough season for Anrich Nortje. Playing a decent amount of games and tries to make something happen when things are quiet.
DOLPHINS
KZN : Savage and Subrayen are at a stage where they far too good for provincial so need to be getting into the franchise team more regularly. Same for Dupavillon but obviously he has had an injury. Sen Muthusamy had a steady first full season with the Dolphins. More so with the ball but will need to produce regularly and consistently with the bat to take it to the next level. Marques Ackerman and Grant Roelofsen have moved down from Gauteng so more or less the future to van Wyk, van Jaarsveld and Vilas. Sibz Makhanya has really struggled to make the franchise grade. Then it is to the younger seamers. Lwandiswa Zuma and Okhule Cele been injured but part of the SA Academy and Eathan Bosch is with the SA Academy this winter. Options are around.
KNIGHTS
Free State : Andries Gous scored runs in the 50-over comp but difficult to break-in with Second as a wk. Leus du Plooy hasn't really kicked on at all. SA u19 captain Raynard van Tonder needs to prove he is better than these 2 and experienced Pite van Biljon to get a Knights chance. I'm sure he will do it.
Northern Cape : So much was expected of Patrick Kruger opening in the T20s but he just kept failing. As the 50-over season went on they batted him in the middle order where he hot his maiden List A 100 and contributed with a few other scores.
LIONS
Gauteng : Ryan Rickelton has had another dominant season for Gauteng. Got his chance for the Lions but felt it was unfair how they used him from 3 to 7 and he kept wicket to win he really is an opener. Whereas Janneman Malan got a go for the last few 50-over Lions games as an opener. With Cook, vd Bergh, Pretorius all under pressure in franchise cricket these 2 should get opportunities. Surely only a matter of time till Hardus Viljoen will be needed less and they won't have to go to other strike bowlers bar Nandre Burger (a big left-arm option) who is attending the SA Academy this winter. Wiaan Mulder has basically cemented his spot in the Lions XI and already has 2 Sunfoil Series centuries at 19 and his bowling is coming along everytime you see him. More speed and good skiddy accuracy. Two further options I will watch with interest is Muhammed Mayet and Wandile Makwetu as young batsman. A union of this stature shouldn't really be messing about with some of the senior batsman they currently are with.
North West : Janneman Malan (see above) did well in his few games for the Lions and will definitely be an option in limited overs cricket for next season especially.
TITANS
Northerns : The Titans have had to pull from the union and Tuks massively as part of a well oiled process. Markram , Klaasen, Ngidi as recent examples. This season we've seen more of De Zorzi, Moonsamy, Pretorius and C.Bosch and even some older campaigners like Hawken and Agathangelou who Boucher strongly believes in. Think de Zorzi, Moonsamy, Pretorius, Bosch have had decent starts to their franchise careers without anything special but it is a good base for them. They seem to be thinking they have found a role for De Zorzi at the top of the order where he scored runs in 50-over cricket. Moonsamy was batting 3 in 50-overs cricket and was relatively consistent and has just made his 4-day debut as a keeper replacing Klaasen for the Titans and got a nice 70-odd. Pretorius played in the first batch of 4-day games and was impressive in helping Ngidi bowl the Titans to a win at the Wanderers. Whereas Bosch been used more successfully in limited overs cricket and was getting it through at 140 (got better the more he played) . Hawken back from another injury has been preferred to Pretorius and Bosch in the latest round of fixtures and done fairly nicely on a flat track. Otherwise excited to see Jiveshan Pillay's continued development especially with Henry Davids' career near the end and Vandiar slowly drifting away.
Last edited: