Ben Stokes - All the facts

[harsh.ag]

Part of the dressing room were you?

Needed a Yoda meme, this.

 

[TestMatch]

It's just classic human tribalism. That England team had a clique of similar jock personalities (Broad, Prior etc), some quiet nice guys like Cook, and then KP, a kind of dandyish pretty boy make-up wearing superstar which England hadn't had in a while. So the big group bullies the outsider, whilst Cook - Cook and KP always speak fondly of one another - gets dragged into pushing KP out for the "betterment of the majority".

 

[burr]

If dropping KP made little sense, I don't see why we should expect the ECB's stance on Stokes to make sense.

I personally don't buy the idea that KP was some "disruptive influence" on the dressing room. I met him once, and the impression I immediately got was that he was a extremely vain pretty boy who lacked self-awareness - and so didn't realize how funny his behavior is - but who was extremely kind, giving and caring (especially to young cricketers). That kind of personality clashes with the "alpha", "laddish" personality of Broad and company, who I can see relentlessly bullying and teasing it.

Yes, I think this. The culture in that England team was not good. Broad, Anderson, Swann were the 'lads' and Pietersen paid the price because he didn't fit in.

I hope Stokes does play again but always good to see a new poster bring fresh thoughts.

 

[weeman27bob]

Good thread, I've never really seen any discussion on here about Pietersen's axing from the England cricket team.

 

[Hennybogan]

KP exclusion was in some ways similar to Dean Jones exclusion back in the day. I remember a few cabbies back then saying it was a personal vendetta by Bib Simpson.

 

[TestMatch]

Yeah. And the ECB has been a poor for a long time, they just got away with the KP fiasco because they had a generation of excellent players all coming through together. Dropping KP is no big deal when you unearth a Joe Root soon after.

It's a bit like how the West Indies Cricket Board assuages its poor handling of its IPL prima donnas by burying them beneath a crop of (supposedly talented) youngsters.

 

[fredfertang]

I'll be interested to hear Sir Beefy's views - has he pontificated yet?

 

[flibbertyjibber]

I'll be interested to hear Sir Beefy's views - has he pontificated yet?

Has a piece in Daily Mirror today. No idea if it a regular column he does..

 

[TheJediBrah]

This for me is all about consistency. They completely scapegoated Pietersen and to this day I believe his axing was nonsense considering all the facts. If they axed Pietersen (ECB and Strauss) then picking Stokes ever again would be extremely contradictory and inconsistent.

No it wouldn't. Their situations are barely even similar at all. The only similarity is that they are both controversial.

If dropping KP made little sense, I don't see why we should expect the ECB's stance on Stokes to make sense.

I personally don't buy the idea that KP was some "disruptive influence" on the dressing room. I met him once, and the impression I immediately got was that he was a extremely vain pretty boy who lacked self-awareness - and so didn't realize how funny his behavior is - but who was extremely kind, giving and caring (especially to young cricketers). That kind of personality clashes with the "alpha", "laddish" personality of Broad and company, who I can see relentlessly bullying and teasing it.

1000% this. So true.

Yeah. And the ECB has been a poor for a long time, they just got away with the KP fiasco because they had a generation of excellent players all coming through together. Dropping KP is no big deal when you unearth a Joe Root soon after.

What happened to them all?

 

[Starfighter]

Other players were more disruptive than Pietersen that's for sure.

Evidence?

 

[sledger]

There is a difference. Pietersen was a dick inside dressing room and Stokes is a dick outside dressing room

Pietersen also a dick outside of the dressing room tbh

 

[Adders]

Evidence?

 

[sledger]

We'll need better evidence than toilet paper I'm afraid.

 

[Adders]

Pretty sure that's where eempyrean is getting his "facts"

 

[Shady Slim]

key indicator of a quality statistical analysis that isn't blatantly pushing an agenda: the title of the thread spouting itself as "the facts"

View attachment 23668

that was a good ****in book

 

[Burgey]

Hard to argue with the OP here. The only thing I’d take issue with is labelling swearing at Kohli as a negative.

 

[Adders]

that was a good ****in book

I'm with sledger.....cept I wouldn't wipe my arse with it.

 

[TNT]

Hard to argue with the OP here. The only thing I’d take issue with is labelling swearing at Kohli as a negative.

It is very easy to argue with the OP, have you looked at how many posts he has made. The culture here is to attack anyone that has a low post count. Moderators do support this culture so its embedded.

 

[sledger]

God almighty somebody end this

 

[Burgey]

It is very easy to argue with the OP, have you looked at how many posts he has made. The culture here is to attack anyone that has a low post count. Moderators do support this culture so its embedded.

Ok.