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England Ashes Squad

theegyptian

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
LegionOfBrad said:
Posted in other thread but the times are saying James Vince is being recalled.

Not joking.
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Sums up the lack of options really.

Bring back the guy who wasn't good when he played tests and afaik hasn't done much to change his game since he's gone back to county cricket.- and doesn't have the results.

There are going to be at least 2 or 3 batsmen in the squad who are going to cause lots of consternation.

You've got a whole list of guys who've failed Lyth, Robson, Duckett, Hales, Buttler, Malan, Westley, Vince, Jennings, Compton etc, and haven't done a whole lot since they've been dropped to be recalled.

Or uncapped guys like Northeast, Hildreth, Burns, Borthwick, DBD, Joe Clarke, Browne, Livingstone, Madsen, Lawrence etc who presumably were lesser rated (by the selectors) than all the guys they've tried and don't exactly have stellar records for them to be obvious selections (or still very young).

You have basically gotta pick 2 (or 3) batsman out of those names above. None of whom I'd really want to pick.

It's why I'd still be picking Ballance and batting him 5. Least he went back to county cricket and scored a load of runs. He might not have changed his game much but he still scored the runs in div 1 which is more than most of these guys.

* And also why when I see Vince's name I just shrug my shoulders. He hasn't done anything to warrant re-selection but really I don't see anyone else who warrants selection either. There's no point the selectors taking Northeast (or whoever) because he hasn't failed yet, if they don't think he's anywhere near good enough.
 
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Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
theegyptian said:
Sums up the lack of options really.

Bring back the guy who wasn't good when he played tests and afaik hasn't done much to change his game since he's gone back to county cricket.- and doesn't have the results.

There are going to be at least 2 or 3 batsmen in the squad who are going to cause lots of consternation.

You've got a whole list of guys who've failed Lyth, Robson, Duckett, Hales, Buttler, Malan, Westley, Vince, Jennings, Compton etc, and haven't done a whole lot since they've been dropped to be recalled.

Or uncapped guys like Northeast, Hildreth, Burns, Borthwick, DBD, Joe Clarke, Browne, Livingstone, Madsen, Lawrence etc who presumably were lesser rated (by the selectors) than all the guys they've tried and don't exactly have stellar records for them to be obvious selections (or still very young).

You have basically gotta pick 2 (or 3) batsman out of those names above. None of whom I'd really want to pick.

It's why I'd still be picking Ballance and batting him 5. Least he went back to county cricket and scored a load of runs. He might not have changed his game much but he still scored the runs in div 1 which is more than most of these guys.

* And also why when I see Vince's name I just shrug my shoulders. He hasn't done anything to warrant re-selection but really I don't see anyone else who warrants selection either. There's no point the selectors taking Northeast (or whoever) because he hasn't failed yet, if they don't think he's anywhere near good enough.
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I agree with much of that and I think that's the reason we will continue with Westley and Malan, there has been no-one banging down the door to displace them and while they haven't nailed down their spots by any means, they have showed glimpses of the reasons why they were selected in the first place.

The two other names that are in contention for me are Sam Robson (who I think by all accounts has improved since his last appearance for the three lions and is obviously aware of what is required in Australian conditions) and Alex Hales who may be a better inclusion this time round due to fitting into the middle order rather than up top.

Ballance I do think they will take with the likes of Hameed and Robson going into the safety net that is the Lions squad. He has got County runs behind him but there will be a huge question mark with his technique and how he'll cope with the barrage from the Aussie pace attack.
 
SeamUp

SeamUp

International Coach
My only problem with Ballance is his limitations are so much more greater than most. I don't think you can got to Australia and think you can survive and have limited scoring shots. Probably better to have players who are confident and back themselves. I'm not for one minute advocating them 100% but right now those sorts of characters are Stoneman, Lawrence, Vince, Gubbins, Duckett, Clarke. Those are the guys to work with but more mentally than anything. Hales could fall into that category & I'm starting to think he is the guy for #5 because of what he has done international level but I do have concerns about his technique whether he opens or bats in the midde-order.
 
theegyptian

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
I'm trying to put together my squad and honestly apart from Cook, Stoneman and Root I don't want to select any of the other batsmen.

Even Ballance who I just talked up I worry that even if he does allright against the pace being protected batting at 5 (which is a big if), Lyon will enjoy bowling at the high % of england left handers in the top order. Probably hard to pick Malan and Ballance in the same squad for that reason plus they both are going for only the number 5 spot and really shouldn't bat any higher.


my squad -Cook, Stoneman, Root, Stokes, Bairstow, Foakes, Ali, Woakes, Anderson, Broad, Ball, Jack Leach, C Overton, Ballance (or Malan), Westley, Vince/(Hales/Denly)

It's Ballance or Malan imo. I'd go Ballance although it's harsh on Malan giving his slight improvement and looking better than Westley in last couple of tests.
Foakes confident and in form. Hard to find many English players at the moment with confidence so take the one you have. As reserve keeper he's basically the drinks carrier anyway.
Leach is the best of the spinners. SLightly alarming last week that SOmerset barely bowled him because Sanagakkara was batting. Warner etc will attack him also. But still better than Crane who can't get in Hampshire side.
Last couple of batting spots I didn't know but went for right handers (because of left handed bias of top order) and mainly top order options as that is where they need options.
I may have lost my mind but I'd consider Denly. That bit older/experienced. Confident from good season in all formats. Technically decent. Quick onto short ball (at least in eng conditions). Did decently in grade cricket in aus last winter. Probably lose out to Hales/Vince but .

If the batting was that bit more secure I'd probably take Joe Clarke for experience and hope for similar results to Stokes in 13/14 ashes. Stokes' batting technique wasn't quite there at that point and he'd struggled in the previous english summer but working day in day out on his batting in the nets drilled a lot of the problems out of his game. Don't think they can afford to do that this time. They need every option ready to go as there is so much uncertainty.
 
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G

Groundking

International Debutant
theegyptian said:
I'm trying to put together my squad and honestly apart from Cook, Stoneman and Root I don't want to select any of the other batsmen.

Even Ballance who I just talked up I worry that even if he does allright against the pace being protected batting at 5 (which is a big if), Lyon will enjoy bowling at the high % of england left handers in the top order. Probably hard to pick Malan and Ballance in the same squad for that reason plus they both are going for only the number 5 spot and really shouldn't bat any higher.


my squad -Cook, Stoneman, Root, Stokes, Bairstow, Foakes, Ali, Woakes, Anderson, Broad, Ball, Jack Leach, C Overton, Ballance (or Malan), Westley, Vince/(Hales/Denly)

It's Ballance or Malan imo. I'd go Ballance although it's harsh on Malan giving his slight improvement and looking better than Westley in last couple of tests.
Foakes confident and in form. Hard to find many English players at the moment with confidence so take the one you have. As reserve keeper he's basically the drinks carrier anyway.
Leach is the best of the spinners. SLightly alarming last week that SOmerset barely bowled him because Sanagakkara was batting. Warner etc will attack him also. But still better than Crane who can't get in Hampshire side.
Last couple of batting spots I didn't know but went for right handers (because of left handed bias of top order) and mainly top order options as that is where they need options.
I may have lost my mind but I'd consider Denly. That bit older/experienced. Confident from good season in all formats. Technically decent. Quick onto short ball (at least in eng conditions). Did decently in grade cricket in aus last winter. Probably lose out to Hales/Vince but .

If the batting was that bit more secure I'd probably take Joe Clarke for experience and hope for similar results to Stokes in 13/14 ashes. Stokes' batting technique wasn't quite there at that point and he'd struggled in the previous english summer but working day in day out on his batting in the nets drilled a lot of the problems out of his game. Don't think they can afford to do that this time. They need every option ready to go as there is so much uncertainty.
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What are your thoughts on Livingstone? Would rather take him than Ballance, who has had his chances and will just simply fail again.

I'd go for:

Cook
Stoneman
Westley
Root
Malan
Stokes
Bairstow
Ali
Woakes
Broad
Anderson

Foakes
Robson
Livingston
Ball
C Overton
Leach

Robson as back up opener should Stoneman get eaten alive, Livingstone and Foakes as middle order bats with Foakes back up keeper, and I think the bowlers pick themselves. I'd put Clarke in the Lions squad allongside Hales to call into the team when inevitably one (or more) of Stoneman, Westley or Malan fail.
 
theegyptian

theegyptian

International Vice-Captain
Livingstone would be a strong candidate if they were touring asia. Plays spin well. From what I've seen against pace he can be pretty loose with his big drives- Bottom hand comes off bat on occasion, bowled through gate, caught covers. And a few teams bomb him with the short stuff so possibly a vulnerability there - happy hooker?. Kinda froze on debut in the t20s too. But they all have issues so wouldn't complain if selected.
 
S.Kennedy

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
Overton is a good pick - a much better one than Finn. Am I allowed my weekly Sam Northeast endorsement?
 
wpdavid

wpdavid

Hall of Fame Member
S.Kennedy said:
Overton is a good pick - a much better one than Finn. Am I allowed my weekly Sam Northeast endorsement?
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We'd be disappointed if you didn't.

What's the deal with Overton btw? Does he actually have any stats to back up the claims of some folks?
 
Howe_zat

Howe_zat

Audio File
Ballance should obviously be going, scraping the ongoing lower levels when a bloke can average 100 is silly.

Think he has played far too many tests at #3 though.
 
S.Kennedy

S.Kennedy

International Vice-Captain
wpdavid said:
We'd be disappointed if you didn't.

What's the deal with Overton btw? Does he actually have any stats to back up the claims of some folks?
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Probably about the closest thing to a genuine English quick after Mark Wood. Bit expensive and learning his ropes but a good bowler.
 
grecian

grecian

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Jamie is the genuinely quick, and erratic one. Cove more an Angus Fraser type really, get's good bounce and movement off the seam. 44 wickets at about 23 this year, whilst playing on a pitch not really geared for pace. Decent stats, in a season he's finally stayed fit, unlike his brother.
 
fredfertang

fredfertang

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
grecian said:
Jamie is the genuinely quick, and erratic one. Cove more an Angus Fraser type really, get's good bounce and movement off the seam. 44 wickets at about 23 this year, whilst playing on a pitch not really geared for pace. Decent stats, in a season he's finally stayed fit, unlike his brother.
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Best take 'em both then
 
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