Placing our bets on "Test Cricket's Young Fab Four"

[centurymaker]

Give Williamson a chance to play on that Rajkot and Chennai pitch and then we can make valid comparisons.

Actually you have raised a very good point.

-Rajkot (road) 1st innings- tons up nicely

-Vizag 2nd innings- it's spinning and Ashwin squares him up on numerous occasions, quite unlucky not to dismiss him, although he did get him out in the first innings through deception in flight.

- Mohali 2nd innings- good fifty from Root in okay conditions with the odd ball spinning.

- Mumbai the only real turner and Root got a nice score in the 2nd innings. With England win out of the equation & series all but decided, he literally tried his hand at ultra aggressive shots against the spin & most of those shots paid off, while on several occasions he was lucky to survive, but then got out in an innocuous manner. He didn't seem to trust his defense enough and kept playing high risk shots. Not his fault as not many can play properly when conditions are like that, unless you are Kohli or Vijay or someone used to such conditions.

-Chennai super road, but a slow road so you can easily play on the back foot and Root scored 80+.

Overall, Root looked decent but his approach was always attack attack attack, perhaps not trusting his defense enough and simply tried to hit the spinners out or get off the strike with a quick single most of the time (and captain Kohli was generous with the fields). He hardly played maidens or even 4-5 dot balls and thus the spinners got much less of a chance to work him over. That was the main reason behind his relative success I believe, yet his attacking approach was his undoing at times but if he had not played this way, he may not have even got some of those 50s.

I reckon if Williamson had got some of these pitches, he would've made good use of them as well and a post a solid average overall.

As I said in an earlier post, it's always about the sort of pitches you get.. and literally cashing in on them..

Any decent player can perform anywhere given they get the right conditions.
I expect Smith to ton up if it's not spinning, and there will be at least some occasions if not more when it won't be spinning.

Indian spinners aren't flawless, they are also quite reliant on the right conditions to do well, and but can still pick up wickets here & there when it's flat.. sometimes the opposition Batsman is so rubbish that he makes the conditions seem much harder than they actually are.

 

[CM Punk]

Sorry. he coped much better clearly, & hence scored a lot more runs at a much better average. I'm not sure why you asked about the nature of the dismissals, because the answer of '2 bowled and 2 LBWs' are about as comprehensive as you get in terms of a bowler dominating a batsman.

Had KW been run out or out to some freakish catch close in or something, that might be different, but these were all a case of bowler being too good for batsman.

Anyway fellas, time to get ready,... happy new year all!

Kane had 2 lives before getting out for 70 IIRC.

Latham and Kane were both batting well until it started to turn on day 2 I think it was.

85.1 kph, he makes sure it needs a bit of magic to get him out, and Ashwin has produced it. You little beauty! He had to go back, because the length was a touch short. It was quite a distance outside off too, so he wouldn't have expected to be bowled. Williamson was shaping to pat it through cover, but Ashwin has given this so much rip and the pitch gives it a bit of love too. As good a dismissal as an offspinner can hope 170/4.

 

[Spark]

Actually you have raised a very good point.

-Rajkot (road) 1st innings- tons up nicely

-Vizag 2nd innings- it's spinning and Ashwin squares him up on numerous occasions, quite unlucky not to dismiss him, although he did get him out in the first innings through deception in flight.

- Mohali 2nd innings- good fifty from Root in okay conditions with the odd ball spinning.

- Mumbai the only real turner and Root got a nice score in the 2nd innings. With England win out of the equation & series all but decided, he literally tried his hand at ultra aggressive shots against the spin & most of those shots paid off, while on several occasions he was lucky to survive, but then got out in an innocuous manner. He didn't seem to trust his defense enough and kept playing high risk shots. Not his fault as not many can play properly when conditions are like that, unless you are Kohli or Vijay or someone used to such conditions.

-Chennai super road, but a slow road so you can easily play on the back foot and Root scored 80+.

Overall, Root looked decent but his approach was always attack attack attack, perhaps not trusting his defense enough and simply tried to hit the spinners out or get off the strike with a quick single most of the time (and captain Kohli was generous with the fields). He hardly played maidens or even 4-5 dot balls and thus the spinners got much less of a chance to work him over. That was the main reason behind his relative success I believe, yet his attacking approach was his undoing at times but if he had not played this way, he may not have even got some of those 50s.

I reckon if Williamson had got some of these pitches, he would've made good use of them as well and a post a solid average overall.

As I said in an earlier post, it's always about the sort of pitches you get.. and literally cashing in on them..

Any decent player can perform anywhere given they get the right conditions.
I expect Smith to ton up if it's not spinning, and there will be at least some occasions if not more when it won't be spinning.

Indian spinners aren't flawless, they are also quite reliant on the right conditions to do well, and but can still pick up wickets here & there when it's flat.. sometimes the opposition Batsman is so rubbish that he makes the conditions seem much harder than they actually are.

Not to belabour the comparison, but this paragraph here could be applied word for word to Clarke in his last tour of India before his injury.

 

[honestbharani]

But the difference we have seen Clarke's defence succeed in these conditions before. It's not the case with Root.

 

[Victor Ian]

How long do people think it will take before Root hardens up? He is only a young guy and it takes a while before they decide to buckle down and just become accumulators. Waugh took his average beyond 50 when he did this. If root starts beyond 50, where may he end up if he does it?

 

[Bijed]

How long do people think it will take before Root hardens up? He is only a young guy and it takes a while before they decide to buckle down and just become accumulators. Waugh took his average beyond 50 when he did this. If root starts beyond 50, where may he end up if he does it?

I'm crossing my fingers that the captaincy will help get his head in more the right place for him to fully realise his potential, which could be soon.

 

[Compton]

Can't wait for Blocky's reaction to Smith smashing Ashwin back over his head to bring up the ol' double ton.

"Flattest wickets India have ever produced"

 

[Slifer]

My personal opinion is that if Smith goes to India and fails ie averages less than 40, he'd still have nothing to be ashamed of. He hasn't averaged sub 40 in a series home or away since 2013.

All his other contemporaries and in particular the other '3' have all had their short comings recently: Root in Oz and Bangladesh, Kohli in the WI and England and KW take your pick.

Needless to say, if he goes good to great, his preeminence would only be more solidified IMO.

Ps Kohli is my favorite of the big 4

 

[ImpatientLime]

calling out root for his performances in australia is a bit tiresome.

at the same time into his test career, steve smith was a lower order no rounder.

 

[Slifer]

calling out root for his performances in australia is a bit tiresome.

at the same time into his test career, steve smith was a lower order no rounder.

If you'd read some of the earlier posts from 'others' you'd understand. Moving on...

 

[Adders]

If you'd read some of the earlier posts from 'others' you'd understand. Moving on...

Well I have read all the earlier posts and IL is 100% right........it is very tiresome.

And how can you in the same breath talk about how great Smith is since 2013 and then use a series in the same year to hold against Root?

 

[Slifer]

Well I have read all the earlier posts and IL is 100% right........it is very tiresome.

And how can you in the same breath talk about how great Smith is since 2013 and then use a series in the same year to hold against Root?

Bro, it's "tiresome" to see Smith labeled as a ftb/htb when clearly he's not. If pitches in Oz were so flat, think you can figure out the rest. ..

 

[Zinzan]

My personal opinion is that if Smith goes to India and fails ie averages less than 40, he'd still have nothing to be ashamed of. He hasn't averaged sub 40 in a series home or away since 2013.

We're not trying to excuse him in advance for a failed series in India I hope...

Smith's overseas record in challenging conditions keeps getting mentioned, so I can't see why any of his advocates wouldn't be extremely confident that in a 4 test series in the toughest place for non-SC sides to tour, he should be able to at least match Root's effort, no?

 

[Adders]

Bro, it's "tiresome" to see Smith labeled as a ftb/htb when clearly he's not. If pitches in Oz were so flat, think you can figure out the rest. ..

I've never thought the best way to respond to boneheaded comments is with another boneheaded comment.

Of course Smith is not a ftb.......apart from Blocky has anyone else said that? It is a ridiculous thing to say about a player who has been so good everywhere for 3 years. It is equally ridiculous to keep bringing up a series in Roots first year as a test batsmen, against the best fast bowling I've seen in probably 2 decades........a series he was dropped during and then returned as the beast we are discussing now.

 

[Slifer]

We're not trying to excuse him in advance for a failed series in India I hope...

Smith's overseas record in challenging conditions keeps getting mentioned, so I can't see why any of his advocates wouldn't be extremely confident that in a 4 test series in the toughest place for non-SC sides to tour, he should be able to at least match Root's effort, no?

Tbh, I'm not a Smith advocate, not in the least bit. I think he's a tool and his batting is ugly but I cant deny the man his due. Imo, i think Kohli has the most potential of the 4, and he's finally tapping into that potential (in tests).

So I'm not exactly hoping that Smith does well in India because to be frank, i dont care. I hope Ashwin and co grind Australia into the dust and Kohli continues to improve.

 

[Zinzan]

I'm not going to defend Blocky's views entirely since I personally consider Smith as Root's equal in tests as it stands leading into this Indian series, but I don't recall him implying Smith is nothing but an utterly useless FTB/HTB, just that he feels he's had a lot of conditions in his favour for run scoring in recent times, and that he considers 3-4 other batsmen better than he is as it stands. I don't happen to agree with that, but it's not as extreme a view as some seem to be making out.

Certainly no more extreme as TJB's categorical assertion that Smith is 'clearly & undisputedly' the worlds no. 1 & that anyone who disputes this must have rocks in their heads.

 

[Slifer]

I've never thought the best way to respond to boneheaded comments is with another boneheaded comment.

Of course Smith is not a ftb.......apart from Blocky has anyone else said that? It is a ridiculous thing to say about a player who has been so good everywhere for 3 years. It is equally ridiculous to keep bringing up a series in Roots first year as a test batsmen, against the best fast bowling I've seen in probably 2 decades........a series he was dropped during and then returned as the beast we are discussing now.

If you thought my comments were so bone headed then u could've done the mature thing and ignored them and moved on. Needless to say, you can take your two cents and keep them to yourself. Have a good day...

 

[Adders]

If you thought my comments were so bone headed then u could've done the mature thing and ignored them and moved on. Needless to say, you can take your two cents and keep them to yourself. Have a good day...

LOL WTF?? This is a discussion forum and we're here discussing a topic. There has been so much gash posted in this thread the last 2 days it is ridiculous......some of it needs to be called out. The dismissing outright of Smith by Blocky and rating him outside the top 4 is total gash......and I've called him on it. Posters looking to find holes in a players career and look at Root in Aus or Kohli in Eng to prove a point is gash.........and I have and will continue to call them out on it.

My responding to you is not immature, it's called discussion and that's what we do here. Your reaction however.........

 

[Zinzan]

If you thought my comments were so bone headed then u could've done the mature thing and ignored them and moved on. Needless to say, you can take your two cents and keep them to yourself. Have a good day...

Strange reaction tbh.

 

[ImpatientLime]

If you'd read some of the earlier posts from 'others' you'd understand. Moving on...

i trol coz u trol