The Kane Williamson Average Watch thread

[Burgey]

The crap show Roots then?

Weeds > Roots imho.

 

[Burgey]

"considering I've been doing it a decade" doesn't relate to Smith - has reading in Australia really gotten this bad? Seems you're awfully good at using statistically insignificant samples to denote your players as champions, but comprehension seems to be down a few logs.

I tend to just gloss over what you write, then try to pick out something which I think will grind your gears the most.

 

[Blocky]

That doesn't surprise me, it's the same way you find reason to rate Smith so highly - glossing over what actually matters in order to focus on what doesn't.

 

[honestbharani]

I don't rate Smith, I also don't rate Taylor, I also don't rate Ashwin.

All of them have series and statistics you can use to counter that point, but all of them have more failings than successes when conditions got tough. If you like downhill skiing, then feel free to like those players. I prefer the guys that constantly average more than their team mates across all series because they're that much better, and show in tough conditions that they can find a way to succeed.

Smith hasn't done that yet, Williamson hasn't done it consistently enough, Root most definitely has more than the others have, Kohli is starting to show signs but none of them have the lineage of an Amla, or De Villiers or Sangakkara.

And my contention isn't that Smith is bad, my contention is that Smith is a guy whose talent means he should average 45, not 55, and without a bumper season against some of the worst bowling at test level you'll ever see from India and the Windies - that's exactly where he'd be.

The argument itself seems fair enough but it just seems like you are doing a SehWAG flowchart to define what are "tough" conditions. Any place or match the guys you dont rate perform seems to become the kinda tough conditions that others perform in. Root has been pretty poor away from home compared to how well he does in English conditions. Kohli has been awesome mostly but has that tailender like record in England he needs to correct. KW has looked like the best batsman of the 4 but seems to be in bad nick at the moment. And honestly, averaging 45 in today's test cricket can still be the marker for a "Great" player.

 

[Blocky]

It's pretty easy to define tough conditions - when sides aren't scoring 400+ runs in their first innings and bowlers are coming out of the series with averages that are close to their usual statistics, you know conditions have been fair.

You've seen it in this series, by accident almost, they gave the South Africans some juicy conditions to bowl within and the Australian's have all looked average, careers have been ended and three debutants are playing for the first time in forever (somewhat due to injury, but mostly poor performance)

 

[CM Punk]

Kane is grossly overrated.

Kohli > Root > Smith > Kane.

 

[Athlai]

Yeah agree with the above, except I'd have it

Kane > Smith > Root > Kohli

 

[CM Punk]

Yeah agree with the above, except I'd have it

Kane > Smith > Root > Kohli

Kane is the next Ian Bell.

Looks good and has his technique constantly praised by pundits, only to rarely perform against good sides on decent tracks.

Seen the guy fail time and time again for us when we needed him, he's only good for bullying mediocre bowling attacks or scoring runs on roads.

If I had it my way, the big 4 would be Kohli, Root, Smith and Rahane.

Rahane is far more accomplished than Kane and is only a few big series away from kicking Kane out of the big 4.

 

[Athlai]

Kane is the next Ian Bell.

Looks good and has his technique constantly praised by pundits, only to rarely perform against good sides on decent tracks.

Seen the guy fail time and time again for us when we needed him, he's only good for bullying mediocre bowling attacks or scoring runs on roads.

If I had it my way, the big 4 would be Kohli, Root, Smith and Rahane.

Rahane is far more accomplished than Kane and is only a few big series away from kicking Kane out of the big 4.

Yeah Kane's just like Ian Bell, except much better.

 

[CM Punk]

Yeah Kane's just like Ian Bell, except much better.

Definitely an improvement, still not good enough to be mentioned with the games best batsmen IMO.

His record is mediocre in countries you usually look at to gauge a players ability, for a supposed top class batsmen .

 

[straw man]

Since Williamson's coming-of-age*, with his grinding but also luck-filled century against SA in New Zealand, he's scored runs against pretty much every tough opposition he's played against. That doesn't mean he absolutely blitzed every opposition, but even a poor series like the recent tour of India he averaged 30-something and scored an 80 - not a failure. He also simply looks a really good batsman. In other words I don't know where the hell CM Punk is coming from.


* not the bit where they lop the end off your wang, though I think Steyn tried

 

[Athlai]

Definitely an improvement, still not good enough to be mentioned with the games best batsmen IMO.

I absolutely agree, except Root, Kohli and Smith who he is on par with.

 

[CM Punk]

I absolutely agree, except Root, Kohli and Smith who he is on par with.

I reckon Kohli and Root will finish ATG's, Smith and Kane will both fall short.

 

[NZTailender]

We just need jonbrooks for the trifecta

 

[straw man]

We just need jonbrooks for the trifecta

how could you forget skyliner?

 

[CM Punk]

We just need jonbrooks for the trifecta

You disagree? How about you look at Kane's record...

Better yet, watch his innings from today again.

Our commies were embarrassingly talking up Kane like a batting genius in his 13 run innings where he was dismissed twice.

 

[Blocky]

Kane needs to focus on playing late, especially on defense.

Most of his dismissals recently have come from him seeing the ball and playing the original line it's on and hanging the bat there, rather than letting it come onto him like he usually does.

 

[NZTailender]

how could you forget skyliner?

Polo23 too

 

[CM Punk]

Kane needs to focus on playing late, especially on defense.

Most of his dismissals recently have come from him seeing the ball and playing the original line it's on and hanging the bat there, rather than letting it come onto him like he usually does.

Batsmen with worse techniques manage to score a lot more meaningful runs than Kane.

There's more to cricket than just technique, in terms of talent and judgement, he is behind Kohli, Root and Smith (Kane's more talented IMO).

 

[Blocky]

Batsmen with worse techniques manage to score a lot more meaningful runs than Kane.

There's more to cricket than just technique, in terms of talent and judgement, he is behind Kohli, Root and Smith (Kane's more talented IMO).

That's because batsmen outside NZ are taught to bat time and don't gift their wicket away.