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***Official*** Pakistan in New Zealand 2016/17

Zinzan

Zinzan

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Calling it early, NZ will win this against all odds.

Number 1 side or not, this isn't 1993 with Wasim and Waqar, against Morrison and Willie Watson.
 
NZTailender

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
listento_me said:
Look, going on cricinfo and copy and pasting doesn't impress m.e

Ali has looked scratchy throughout the year and you take away his big scores and he really isn't doing that well. For an opener, that is way too many ducks and way too much up and down. Also, it's not me saying he should be dropped indefinitely but Sharjeel is a keen striker of pace bowling and with the bounce and pace on offer with some NZ and Aus bowlers, he might be a good fight.

That's not to say Ali can't bat well but he isn't batting well often enough.
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Scratchy doesn't mean he can't produce results, and the 'take out the big scores' argument is so daft it's barely worth arguing against (and isn't going to impress anyone either, and smacks of laziness so sorry for doing some research), but I'll do it anyway: take out his 302* and WIndies win by 250 runs, or whatever the margin ended up being (50 odd, right?).

Batsmen have a few low scores now and again. if he'd had 6 or 7 single digit scores in his last 4 or 5 Tests, as well as a bunch of <20 innings, then maybe you'd have a point, but he hasn't and you're having some bizarre kneejerk reaction to two ducks in two Tests.

He basically would have to score 3 ducks in a row (second innings of this Test, first Test vs NZ) before question marks should properly form.
 
Adders

Adders

Cricketer Of The Year
listento_me said:
Look, going on cricinfo and copy and pasting doesn't impress m.e

Ali has looked scratchy throughout the year and you take away his big scores and he really isn't doing that well. For an opener, that is way too many ducks and way too much up and down. Also, it's not me saying he should be dropped indefinitely but Sharjeel is a keen striker of pace bowling and with the bounce and pace on offer with some NZ and Aus bowlers, he might be a good fight.

That's not to say Ali can't bat well but he isn't batting well often enough.
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Look mate, you said the same thing about Jonny Bairstow a week or so ago which tells me straight away that you haven't watched as much cricket as you'd like us to believe over the last year.

And seriously, pipe down with the cricinfo stats watching crap you keep throwing around. Firstly I'm sure that NZTailender wasn't trying to impress you and second, you're new here and I can guarantee that the people you've been saying this shite to watch an awful lot of cricket and are very knowledgeable on the subject. You shouldn't be so quick to assume.
 
Daemon

Daemon

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No way should Bracewell or Guptill play again. I'd pick the same XI as Mike but Henry out for Southee because #hope
 
vcs

vcs

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Pakistan favourites here, but I can see the Kiwis coming hard at them and taking this. Southee/Boult to star.
 
S

SteveNZ

International Coach
'If you take away his big scores he isn't doing that well' could be the greatest thing I've ever read.

I look forward to using that on every cricketer I don't like/rate.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

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SteveNZ said:
'If you take away his big scores he isn't doing that well' could be the greatest thing I've ever read.

I look forward to using that on every cricketer I don't like/rate.
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If you took away his bat he'd be totally useless I reckon.
 
listento_me

listento_me

U19 Captain
Bahnz said:
Translation: "I've made up my mind, don't trouble me with facts."



Yeah. Some goes for Steve Smith, KW, Joe Root and Younis Khan. What a bunch of scrubs.

Seriously, take out his best score and his worst score from that list and he's still averaging nearly 43, so it's hardly like he's been coasting on the back of that 300. Dropping players on the back of one or two bad performances is a great way to sow instability in a side. We found that out to our cost with Neil Wagner.
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They are scoring big scores on a more consistent basis.

According to the stats that NZ posted, Ali only has 2 centuries, one of them a very big triple. That is great but it is not indicative of how he has batted for the majority of his time with the bat. This is why simply posting stats without watching the player in question or without providing context is wrong (and plain silly).

Of his 16 test innings in about a 12 month period, 13 of those have been a score of less than 50, 9 of which are a score of less than 30. That backs up my original claim that Ali isn't consistently getting good scores, let alone big ones. In a true statistical analysis (not just copying and pasting off cricinfo) the 302 he got would be regarded as an anomaly, not the norm.

Please fellas, watch more of the players you talk about.

Now, all of this sounds like a negative assessment of Ali, which it isn't, it's more of a say on how inconsistent he has been and if Pakistan can look good in their first test v NZ, there's no reason why they shouldn't try Sharjeel in the next test (provided Ali doesnt bat well again). This would allow Pak to have a look at a player who has often played pace bowling well in the ODIs and T20s. That would suit them well for an opening bat in Aus.
 
Niall

Niall

International Coach
Zinzan said:
And 2001 & 2004, but I think Pakistani coming as hot favourites will ironically work against them this time around. Just a gut feel, we'll soon see.

They're so predictable at being unpredictable.

Might put a few lazy dollars on NZ if they're paying good odds.
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For what its worth, looks like with the bookies, NZ will be strong favourites. They are 2.1 (11/10) to win the first test, with Pakistan 3.1,:ph34r:
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
no way should southee reclaim his spot so easily. henry took more wickets at a better average in that indian series than southee has since his 7fer

the fact you're all off to cricinfo to double check the above made up stat just shows how bad southee has been for so long
 
Grumpy

Grumpy

U19 Vice-Captain
listento_me said:
They are scoring big scores on a more consistent basis.

According to the stats that NZ posted, Ali only has 2 centuries, one of them a very big triple. That is great but it is not indicative of how he has batted for the majority of his time with the bat. This is why simply posting stats without watching the player in question or without providing context is wrong (and plain silly).

Of his 16 test innings in about a 12 month period, 13 of those have been a score of less than 50, 9 of which are a score of less than 30. That backs up my original claim that Ali isn't consistently getting good scores, let alone big ones. In a true statistical analysis (not just copying and pasting off cricinfo) the 302 he got would be regarded as an anomaly, not the norm.

Please fellas, watch more of the players you talk about.

Now, all of this sounds like a negative assessment of Ali, which it isn't, it's more of a say on how inconsistent he has been and if Pakistan can look good in their first test v NZ, there's no reason why they shouldn't try Sharjeel in the next test (provided Ali doesnt bat well again). This would allow Pak to have a look at a player who has often played pace bowling well in the ODIs and T20s. That would suit them well for an opening bat in Aus.
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weldone

weldone

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah if you take away the big scores from Donald Bradman, his stats will look like Harbhajan Singh's, lol.
 
Bahseph

Bahseph

International Debutant
Pakistan have a very settled line up. At least 9 of the first team pick themselves. The selection dilemma comes in with the third seamer and the extra batsman/Nawaz role.

I think Rahat Ali could get the nod for me. He has the ability to take wickets even during a bad spell. The number 6 issue is a bigger problem for me. With the seamers coming more into the game I'd go with the extra batsman. Especially since Misbah doesn't bowl Nawaz enough.
 
S

SteveNZ

International Coach
Geez, I wish we could consider dropping a top order player who has scored tons in six of his last seven series, and averaged over 40 in the one he didn't.

I hope Shane Watson reads this thread. He'd probably think '****, if I had no legs I'd have got out a lot less and would've averaged 50+. Then would I be a cancer!?!'
 
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