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*Official* English Football Season 2016-17

Uppercut

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I started following club football regularly around 2004. His first Chelsea team was nearly unbeatable - impenetrable defense/goalie, powerful midfielders like Essien, Makelele, a bit of flair in the likes of Robben, Cole and obviously Drogba and Lampard to score the goals. They used Abramovich's money to create an incredibly strong first XI as well as an equally strong bench. This was something other top English clubs simply couldn't afford back then. At times, they seemed to sign players just so that they couldn't join their rivals. I remember the hype for the Barcelona-Chelsea CL tie in 2006, it was pretty clear that these were the two strongest club teams in the world, with AC Milan close behind. So what does Mourinho do? Does he attack Barcelona at home and try to put them under pressure? No, he puts out an absolute potato-patch of a pitch to ruin their passing game, tries to kick them off the park, still gets destroyed by Ronaldinho/Messi/Eto'o, and then proceeds to blame Messi for getting maimed by Del Horno. Ever since then, I've hated the guy.

He is the poster-boy for reactive football. He openly scoffs at the idea of instilling an identifiable style of play, or developing attacking patterns that get the most of creative technical players. When he faces technically gifted teams with comparable resources, his entire gameplan has always revolved around sucking them into errors, or overcommitting while attacking, and then hitting them on the counter-attack. He tries to ruin the flow of games against good teams by niggling fouls, diving, playing for set-pieces etc. Since he's always had huge resources everywhere, you can get away with this "tactical genius" approach against the few top teams you play every year, and smash mediocre opposition with Ronaldo, Drogba, Hazard etc. Obviously it's worked in the past against naive managers like Wenger and Pellegrini. Not so much against Guardiola, Klopp etc. Being found out big-time now. More managers have wised up over the years, and he simply hasn't adapted. And he doesn't have the fall-back of having a clear, identifiable "Plan A" style that he can coach.

But my dislike of him is not even so much the ugly tactics. He's an absolute arsehole of a human. Everyone knows about the numerous clashes he's had with various referees, managers, players, owners, medical staff, mostly provoked by his own ego, where he's belittled, mocked and abused others without provocation, made up conspiracy theories, intimidated people, you name it. He's kicked so, so many people on the way up. They will enjoy kicking him twice as hard on the way down. He deserves every bit of it. I hope he fails hard and gets sacked by Christmas like he did at Chelsea last year.
I pretty much agree on the "Mourinho's an irredeemable arsehole" front. You're understating his achievements as a manager though. In terms of resources neither Inter nor Porto had any right at all to be winning Champions Leagues, and it's laughable to suggest that he couldn't coach an effective attack- his RM 2011/12 side scored more than any other in La Liga history.

I'm reasonably open to the idea that the game has moved on, his tactics have been superseded by the Tuchel/Klopp/Guardiola generation, his man management techniques don't work in an era when players have much more power and are more sensitive to criticism, and he's not one of the absolute top managers anymore. It's too early to say for sure, but I think it's a fair opinion. But I don't have any time for the idea that he was never one of the world's best managers. He just was.
 

vcs

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I pretty much agree on the "Mourinho's an irredeemable arsehole" front. You're understating his achievements as a manager though. In terms of resources neither Inter nor Porto had any right at all to be winning Champions Leagues, and it's laughable to suggest that he couldn't coach an effective attack- his RM 2011/12 side scored more than any other in La Liga history.

I'm reasonably open to the idea that the game has moved on, his tactics have been superseded by the Tuchel/Klopp/Guardiola generation, his man management techniques don't work in an era when players have much more power and are more sensitive to criticism, and he's not one of the absolute top managers anymore. It's too early to say for sure, but I think it's a fair opinion. But I don't have any time for the idea that he was never one of the world's best managers. He just was.
I'll concede that. I accept that my opinion of him will always be blinded by my dislike for him though. His Madrid team did well that year, but he inherited a decent side from Pellegrini and theyd spent about half a billion on Ronaldo, Benzema, Alonso, Kaka (lol) and co. Funny how Pellegrini never gets any credit for getting 96 points or something and pushing Barcelona to the end that year. They were bound to dip at some point and Madrid's attack really clicked that season. Also he took over Inter when they barely had any domestic competition, and won the CL with his usual style of play. No one will remember that side in 10 years.
 

grecian

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Think it's obviously wishful-thinking from decent human-beings hoping for Mourinho's quick fall at Man U, but there are definite signs of him carrying on with the same attitude as he had at the end of the Chelsea reign.
 

Uppercut

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I'll concede that. I accept that my opinion of him will always be blinded by my dislike for him though. His Madrid team did well that year, but he inherited a decent side from Pellegrini and theyd spent about half a billion on Ronaldo, Benzema, Alonso, Kaka (lol) and co. Funny how Pellegrini never gets any credit for getting 96 points or something and pushing Barcelona to the end that year. They were bound to dip at some point and Madrid's attack really clicked that season. Also he took over Inter when they barely had any domestic competition, and won the CL with his usual style of play. No one will remember that side in 10 years.
His Inter side were quite attacking. Sneijder that year was a joke. They're most famous for the job they did at the Nou Camp in the semis, but they only earned the right to play that way by ripping them apart in the first leg.

I'm not sure anything you say can really qualify the achievement of winning the CL with Inter and Porto. Would you say the same things about Simeone? Two CL finals and a title with Atletico but he's not one of the world's best coaches because his teams are reactive and cynical?
 

vcs

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Simeone has the excuse of being hugely dwarfed by the resources of two clubs in the same country. Mourinho did well with Porto and Inter, who may not have the biggest resources compared to the rest of Europe (though I remember Inter spending a fair amount in that period), but were dominant in their own country. Don't think it's a fair comparison. Simeone will have to show a bit more attacking enterprise if he joins a top Italian or English club IMO. Anyway, as I've stressed before, with Mourinho it's the sum total, his cynical tactics, abrasive personality, narcissism, refusal to accept blame... I think I've covered this. :)
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah with Uppercut here. As much as I hate the man, no doubt Mourinho was in the top 3 coaches in the world from early 2000s to 2010 (maybe 2012 or so) if not the best (thinking Fergie, Mourinho and Guardiola as the top 3). Football has changed so much since the early to mid 2000s though. I don't think it can really be overstated how much it has, and how hard it must be for people who were successful back then to still be successful to the same extent now. Stumbled across a piece on Sunday that Miguel Delaney wrote last December about it. Has game-changer Pep Guardiola ended Jose Mourinho?s run at the top of the game? - Football - Eurosport UK

People say it all the time about how they'll never be another Fergie etc but I think there's a lot of truth in the idea that it's hard to build such a long stay at the top these days, even if it's at different clubs. We're soon approaching 10 years since Pep started, will be interesting to see if he's still a cut above the rest in 5-10 years time.
 

cpr

International Coach
I pretty much agree on the "Mourinho's an irredeemable arsehole" front. You're understating his achievements as a manager though. In terms of resources neither Inter nor Porto had any right at all to be winning Champions Leagues, and it's laughable to suggest that he couldn't coach an effective attack- his RM 2011/12 side scored more than any other in La Liga history.
.

First Chelsea team was rather free scoring too, outscored Utd in most if not all seasons
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Beat a League 2 side 3-1
Whinge about the ref

Good work Jose, you bell end

Edit - don't get me wrong - it should have been a red.
 
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