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*Official* English Football Season 2016-17

Tangles

International Vice-Captain
The team selection did look like he was assuming goals or completely expected no threat from Watford. The front 6 was very aggressive with no defensive shield. I think he assumed the back 5 would be enough but Smalling/Shaw was a big liability. I wonder if he was trying to appease fans with goals? Or it was just arrogance.
 

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The players are briefing really hard against him already. None of this stuff leaked under LVG or Moyes until they'd left. I wonder where's it's coming from.
 

Niall

International Coach
The players are briefing really hard against him already. None of this stuff leaked under LVG or Moyes until they'd left. I wonder where's it's coming from.
Plenty of stuff came out when they were in charge, I always assumed it was common knowledge it was Rooney or and Carrick.

Ducker who wrote that article I assume you are referring to is one of Rooneys boys.

Rooney has a lot of journos in his pocket, this is a real test of Jose now.
 

Tangles

International Vice-Captain
Are there some local articles I've missed? I didn't know Rooney was one of the Moyes/LVG leaks. What a guy.
 

Niall

International Coach

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Plenty of stuff came out when they were in charge, I always assumed it was common knowledge it was Rooney or and Carrick.

Ducker who wrote that article I assume you are referring to is one of Rooneys boys.

Rooney has a lot of journos in his pocket, this is a real test of Jose now.
I thought of Rooney and Carrick but he's not been dropped yet, or even criticised by Mourinho. Did anything this critical come out during LVG or Moyes's tenure?
 

Furball

Evil Scotsman
I reckon a survey of Mourinho players would be fascinating. His Chelsea old guard and Inter players all seem to love him, I doubt many of his Real Madrid side or his 2nd Chelsea team would feel the same way, and by the sounds of it, that's carried on at United.

I still say that Liverpool are the club in England that's the best fit for Mourinho.
 

anil1405

International Captain
I reckon a survey of Mourinho players would be fascinating. His Chelsea old guard and Inter players all seem to love him, I doubt many of his Real Madrid side or his 2nd Chelsea team would feel the same way, and by the sounds of it, that's carried on at United.

I still say that Liverpool are the club in England that's the best fit for Mourinho.
He's the last person fans want to see in the Anfield technical area (apart from when he is the visiting manager on the losing end).

Beside's Mourinho appears to be on a decline and its tough to say if he would replicate the same success he did in the first half of his managerial career.
 

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Right so he's lost two difficult league games and a Europa League tie nobody cared about. They're a point behind Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea and we're five games in. This is knee-jerk even by football's standards.
 

anil1405

International Captain
Well am obviously discussing Mourinho here, not Manchester United. His time at Chelsea has had a devastating effect on him and as Furball has pointed out, he probably isn't in the best of terms with players off-late. Under these circumstances and with the kind of attitude, where he tends to blame everyone for the defeat, I find it tough to see how he would sort things out in the near future and replicate his managerial brilliance of past.
 

anil1405

International Captain
He's always blamed others for his defeats though. This isn't really a new thing.
True. But whats new is the kind of slump he is going through in his managerial career. His record in last 33 games is 13 wins, 5 draws and lost 15 games.

Would be interesting to see how he would bounce back (if at all he does) and not sure if blaming others for defeats would help his cause.
 

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He's always blamed others for his defeats though. This isn't really a new thing.
I think he used to blame referees rather than players. That's the narrative that's being pushed anyway. It's kind of hard to compare because in his early days he just almost never lost.

There's a big disparity between what he says and the coverage of his comments. "Our left-back was 25 yards too far up the pitch for that goal" becomes "Mourinho SLAMS Shaw". I don't mean this as a defence of Mourinho, he knows that there's a taboo against publicly naming players who make mistakes, and does it anyway. But it's odd for Shaw to be as upset as the reports suggest over what was actually said. Either Shaw's a total weakling or the leak is playing up how upset he is to undermine Mourinho.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
I think he used to blame referees rather than players. That's the narrative that's being pushed anyway. It's kind of hard to compare because in his early days he just almost never lost.

There's a big disparity between what he says and the coverage of his comments. "Our left-back was 25 yards too far up the pitch for that goal" becomes "Mourinho SLAMS Shaw". I don't mean this as a defence of Mourinho, he knows that there's a taboo against publicly naming players who make mistakes, and does it anyway. But it's odd for Shaw to be as upset as the reports suggest over what was actually said. Either Shaw's a total weakling or the leak is playing up how upset he is to undermine Mourinho.
Yeah, sorry, should have been more specific. I was using the term "others" quite loosely.

I certainly don't remember many occasions on which he previously explicitly blamed specific players for any failings. Siege mentality seemed to be his get go most of the time.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Right so he's lost two difficult league games and a Europa League tie nobody cared about. They're a point behind Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea and we're five games in. This is knee-jerk even by football's standards.
Watford away is hardly the most difficult of games to be fair.
 

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Watford away is hardly the most difficult of games to be fair.
Yeah, it's the type of game that's tough some of the time. We got them after a Thursday night game, when they'd just got a huge comeback win at West Ham, and they played very well. Always gonna lose a few of those.

Although that's not to say we weren't shite.
 

vcs

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I reckon a survey of Mourinho players would be fascinating. His Chelsea old guard and Inter players all seem to love him, I doubt many of his Real Madrid side or his 2nd Chelsea team would feel the same way, and by the sounds of it, that's carried on at United.

I still say that Liverpool are the club in England that's the best fit for Mourinho.
Hell will freeze over before that happens. They detest him and he hates them back. Same for Arsenal, Barcelona etc. Remarkable how many clubs he's completely burned bridges with. I don't think Bayern will ever consider hiring him either. PSG and Juve are probably the only realistic options left for him in Europe (among major clubs, his ego will never allow him to take on a relative underdog like Napoli or Tottenham where it's hard to compete for trophies and big signings every year). Personally, I hope he ****s off to MLS or somewhere when it goes pear-shaped for him here. :)
 

vcs

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I started following club football regularly around 2004. His first Chelsea team was nearly unbeatable - impenetrable defense/goalie, powerful midfielders like Essien, Makelele, a bit of flair in the likes of Robben, Cole and obviously Drogba and Lampard to score the goals. They used Abramovich's money to create an incredibly strong first XI as well as an equally strong bench. This was something other top English clubs simply couldn't afford back then. At times, they seemed to sign players just so that they couldn't join their rivals. I remember the hype for the Barcelona-Chelsea CL tie in 2006, it was pretty clear that these were the two strongest club teams in the world, with AC Milan close behind. So what does Mourinho do? Does he attack Barcelona at home and try to put them under pressure? No, he puts out an absolute potato-patch of a pitch to ruin their passing game, tries to kick them off the park, still gets destroyed by Ronaldinho/Messi/Eto'o, and then proceeds to blame Messi for getting maimed by Del Horno. Ever since then, I've hated the guy.

He is the poster-boy for reactive football. He openly scoffs at the idea of instilling an identifiable style of play, or developing attacking patterns that get the most of creative technical players. When he faces technically gifted teams with comparable resources, his entire gameplan has always revolved around sucking them into errors, or overcommitting while attacking, and then hitting them on the counter-attack. He tries to ruin the flow of games against good teams by niggling fouls, diving, playing for set-pieces etc. Since he's always had huge resources everywhere, you can get away with this "tactical genius" approach against the few top teams you play every year, and smash mediocre opposition with Ronaldo, Drogba, Hazard etc. Obviously it's worked in the past against naive managers like Wenger and Pellegrini. Not so much against Guardiola, Klopp etc. Being found out big-time now. More managers have wised up over the years, and he simply hasn't adapted. And he doesn't have the fall-back of having a clear, identifiable "Plan A" style that he can coach.

But my dislike of him is not even so much the ugly tactics. He's an absolute arsehole of a human. Everyone knows about the numerous clashes he's had with various referees, managers, players, owners, medical staff, mostly provoked by his own ego, where he's belittled, mocked and abused others without provocation, made up conspiracy theories, intimidated people, you name it. He's kicked so, so many people on the way up. They will enjoy kicking him twice as hard on the way down. He deserves every bit of it. I hope he fails hard and gets sacked by Christmas like he did at Chelsea last year.
 

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