***Official*** Australia in New Zealand 2016

[Hurricane]

According to cricinfo Lyon now has 192 wickets.

Due to the combination of his degree of turn AND accuracy I place him ahead of:

The Vettori we saw in the second half of his career
Swann
Harbi
Bracewell
Emburey

Those are some big names

Players who I rate as being a whole other level better than him
Underwood
Bedi
Lock

Lyon needs to lose his attitude and start to realise than when his team calls him GOAT they may not be 100% just messing around. If he starts to take his craft more seriously and gets more miles under his belt he could start to turn heads. He has been impressing me anyway.

 

[Zinzan]

Smith is extraordinarily difficult to tie down in this regard though. Anything even vaguely near the stumps or underpitched, and you get picked off on the onside all day long.




Henry I actually feel was more guilty of being too short, but that really seems his natural length. Looked far less comfortable trying to bowl that nick-off length.

Ironically when he did hit the right length, he looked the most likely to get the edge.

 

[Zinzan]

According to cricinfo Lyon now has 192 wickets.

Due to the combination of his degree of turn AND accuracy I place him ahead of:

The Vettori we saw in the second half of his career
Swann
Harbi
Bracewell
Emburey

Those are some big names

Players who I rate as being a whole other level better than him
Underwood
Bedi
Lock

Lyon needs to lose his attitude and start to realise than when his team calls him GOAT they may not be 100% just messing around. If he starts to take his craft more seriously and gets more miles under his belt he could start to turn heads. He has been impressing me anyway.

Not dissing it, but would be interested in your rationale for rating Bedi on another planet to Lyon. I know there's been lots written about his beautiful flight in particular, but any other reason for voting him that much better? I mean he did get to play in subcontinent conditions more often than not, something Lyon hasn't had the luxury of.

 

[Prince EWS]

Ironically when he did hit the right length, he looked the most likely to get the edge.

Yeah Henry's a bit different to other 'naturally short' bowlers like Morkel and Sharma in that he doesn't seem to lose his movement and momentum when he pitches it up; he just doesn't do it as often as he should.

 

[Bahnz]

Wouldn't rate Lyon ahead of Swann. Swann turned the ball more than Lyon and was no less accurate. Swann also played a huge part in a series win in India which Lyon has yet to do.

 

[Prince EWS]

Yeah Swann at his peak was definitely better than Lyon is now for mine. Lyon was Test standard at a younger age than Swann though and there's something to be said for that advantage that brings even if he doesn't reach the same heights. It'll be a very interesting comparison when Lyon's career ends IMO, especially if he gets better from this point (which I suspect he will).

 

[hendrix]

I rate them both pretty equally.

Think Swann generally had a more helpful ball and conditions.

 

[Flem274*]

Very well batted from Burns and Smith. Smith has even been converting the NZ public by taking all those body blows today and tonning up (I've been listening to two sessions on the radio and the talking afterwards today).

Very deflating from the NZ bowlers tbh. Southee and Boult just don't have the same zip or ability to bowl tight lines on flat decks like they used to. It was all a bit 2010 starring boult as chris martin, matt henry as iain o'brien and tim southee as himself. at least corey j has a lot more going for him than jimmy franklin did. it's not fun to watch 130kph bowlers with average accuracy and zip and we've been getting it ever since england.

i heard a metaphor that the batting in this series was from sides is like watching the wallabies versus the all black forward pack - one side is obsessed with being exciting and glamorous and the other just ruthlessly destroys you however it needs to.

wagner has pulled the game back a bit. NZ really need to shoot out australia tomorrow now the door is ajar but i don't see it happening. i found henry taking the new ball over southee and boult being pulled quickly very interesting. maybe mccullum is fed up?

catching up on this thread will make for interesting reading haha

 

[Hurricane]

Not dissing it, but would be interested in your rationale for rating Bedi on another planet to Lyon. I know there's been lots written about his beautiful flight in particular, but any other reason for voting him that much better? I mean he did get to play in subcontinent conditions more often than not, something Lyon hasn't had the luxury of.

It's all about the turban


Basically because he was on a whole other level from Lyon and all bowlers going around today. If you take away Warne/Murali (and maybe Kumble) Bedi is one of the next names mentioned.

For a start I have read stories about him giving up free boundaries to batsman just to get them to loosen up against him and stop being so vigilant about leaving him. Then after letting you smack him about a bit, he bowls you a top drawer nut that you would be well served to leave, but the batsman wouldn't leave it because the adrenaline is going and would edge to slip. Just one of many tactics he had.

 

[Hurricane]

Swann had this crazy purple patch where if he went to the corner store to buy a $1 mix bag of candy he would return back home with 4-fer next to his name despite the fact that there was no test match being played that day. I am not sure if that analogy works or not. Basically I think Swann was the right guy in the right place at the right time for a number of series in a row.

 

[BackFootPunch]

Swann had this crazy purple patch where if he went to the corner store to buy a $1 mix bag of candy he would return back home with 4-fer next to his name despite the fact that there was no test match being played that day. I am not sure if that analogy works or not. Basically I think Swann was the right guy in the right place at the right time for a number of series in a row.

Reckon you're being a bit harsh there. Swann had some talents with the ball that a lot of offies would kill for. I haven't seen many guys turn it as much as he did with the same level of consistency and accuracy. Lyon's getting there but Swann is still ahead imo.

 

[Flem274*]

oh yeah btw jeremy coney mentioned ashley mallett is really keen to get his hands on mark craig. reckons he's got the goods.

 

[Bahnz]

It's all about the turban


Basically because he was on a whole other level from Lyon and all bowlers going around today. If you take away Warne/Murali (and maybe Kumble) Bedi is one of the next names mentioned.

For a start I have read stories about him giving up free boundaries to batsman just to get them to loosen up against him and stop being so vigilant about leaving him. Then after letting you smack him about a bit, he bowls you a top drawer nut that you would be well served to leave, but the batsman wouldn't leave it because the adrenaline is going and would edge to slip. Just one of many tactics he had.

It's a pretty common tactic amongst international bowlers actually. Pretty sure we saw an example of it today with Wagner bowling a waist high long-hop followed up by a quicker head high bouncer. Cairns' biography said that he would deliberately bowl a few half volleys to get the batsmen driving before going for their wickets.

 

[Bahnz]

oh yeah btw jeremy coney mentioned ashley mallett is really keen to get his hands on mark craig. reckons he's got the goods.

Mallet said the same thing about Jeets once upon a time. Good luck working out now whether you think he's a moron or a genius.

 

[hendrix]

oh yeah btw jeremy coney mentioned ashley mallett is really keen to get his hands on mark craig. reckons he's got the goods.

Mallet said the same thing about Jeets once upon a time. Good luck working out now whether you think he's a moron or a genius.

Check.

Mate.

 

[indiaholic]

It's a pretty common tactic amongst international bowlers actually. Pretty sure we saw an example of it today with Wagner bowling a waist high long-hop followed up by a quicker head high bouncer. Cairns' biography said that he would deliberately bowl a few half volleys to get the batsmen driving before going for their wickets.

McGrath had the wide half tracker you would be tempted to smash but would bounce enough to take your edge.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Lyon is still overrated in my book. He's a working-class spinner, does alright but I still wouldn't say he's anything special.

 

[NZTailender]

He's not abundantly talented in the turn department nor 'exciting' but he's incredibly competent and hard working. He's like a spin version of Stuart Clark, or ODI Nathan Bracken. Will just quietly do a job without really dominating but is vital to the make-up of the attack and team.

 

[Prince EWS]

Mallet said the same thing about Jeets once upon a time. Good luck working out now whether you think he's a moron or a genius.

Craig and Jeets both had/have the raw ability to be Test offies. I don't disagree with Mallett at all here as Jeets's issues were mainly non-skill-related. Admittedly Phlegm hates Jeets and would probably be conflicted, though.

 

[NZTailender]

I wish I got in with the Burns and Smithers remark. I didn't, so here's a terrible shoop at least