Road to the 2015 Ashes in England

[Gob]

I have a feeling that Votes might be the scapegoat.

Who?

 

[BeeGee]

I'm not a Watto fan but if Harris isn't fit then his miserly accurate bowling is more useful than Marshes batting. To go in without Harris and then pick Marsh makes me nervous. If Starc and MJ don't start well you basically have to go straight to Lyon. Now sure maybe they both fire and it's not an issue but I would prefer Wattos bowling just in case.

I have a problem with picking your number 6 batsman based on his ability to bowl, not his ability to bat. Weakening your batting lineup to try to cover a possible weakness in your bowling attack doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Tangles]

The team really believes a 5th bowler helps so it's not really a 6th batsman discussion. Darsh would be an option if it was. So it's more about team balance. I think the difference in bowling is more benefitial than the difference in batting.

Not sure flogging some county attacks gets test runs either. It just suggests he will score more runs. FC average of 32 vs 42 btw.

 

[Spark]

MMarsh's FC average is not even a remotely good approximation of his batting ability.

 

[Tangles]

If Watson doesn't bowl well in this game I expect Boof to go with Marsh. I just don't think you get much from his bowling so MJ, Starc or Lyon will have to bowl more. Unless you can squeeze some overs out of Voges.

 

[Prince EWS]

MMarsh's FC average is not even a remotely good approximation of his batting ability.

Yeah it's mainly a product of him debuting before he was really ready as a batsman. He debuted just after his 18th birthday, failed early, then spent a couple of seasons batting at #8 and playing as a bowling allrounder. In his last 20 First Class games (which is almost half his entire career and includes four Test matches) he averages 51.

 

[weldone]

Who?

Voges

 

[adub]

There's no question that both Marsh's have caught the fc ton bug lately and that's great. There's no question that MMarsh would be one of the first picked if you were looking for someone to bludgeon an under strength attack on a road. Not sure that means he's going to produce when Jimmy is making it talk and we're 4/sfa. Tbf, Watson isn't exactly the first name that comes to mind for those occasions either, but he's shown he's in fair nick so it's still his spot to lose.

I think the argument about whose bowling is going to be most useful in the conditions really is the decider here, and Watto if fit still wins it. It's super close and if Marsh can produce when going gets tough as well as when it's easy then he's going to be a real asset for a lot of years.

 

[adub]

Oh and

NEV!

(y)


WAFG

 

[dfrinku]

What's Harris's status then? Is he ruled out of the first test yet?

 

[social]

If Watson doesn't bowl well in this game I expect Boof to go with Marsh. I just don't think you get much from his bowling so MJ, Starc or Lyon will have to bowl more. Unless you can squeeze some overs out of Voges.

Watto's bowling is relatively irrelevant these days and has been for a number of years

Bowling records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | ESPN Cricinfo

Fact is that he's little more than an ordinary batsman who bowls a bit and is 34

If you are ever going to pick a player then there is no better time than when he is in form so Marsh should be given a go on the strength of his batting alone

 

[Riggins]

There's no question that both Marsh's have caught the fc ton bug lately and that's great. There's no question that MMarsh would be one of the first picked if you were looking for someone to bludgeon an under strength attack on a road. Not sure that means he's going to produce when Jimmy is making it talk and we're 4/sfa. Tbf, Watson isn't exactly the first name that comes to mind for those occasions either, but he's shown he's in fair nick so it's still his spot to lose.

I think the argument about whose bowling is going to be most useful in the conditions really is the decider here, and Watto if fit still wins it. It's super close and if Marsh can produce when going gets tough as well as when it's easy then he's going to be a real asset for a lot of years.

This is my thoughts exactly.

 

[social]

There's no question that both Marsh's have caught the fc ton bug lately and that's great. There's no question that MMarsh would be one of the first picked if you were looking for someone to bludgeon an under strength attack on a road. Not sure that means he's going to produce when Jimmy is making it talk and we're 4/sfa. Tbf, Watson isn't exactly the first name that comes to mind for those occasions either, but he's shown he's in fair nick so it's still his spot to lose.

I think the argument about whose bowling is going to be most useful in the conditions really is the decider here, and Watto if fit still wins it. It's super close and if Marsh can produce when going gets tough as well as when it's easy then he's going to be a real asset for a lot of years.

Marsh stood up in the UAE in conditions far more foreign to him than the UK will be so I'm not to concerned about his temperament

On the other hand, it has literally been years since Watto has done the same

 

[adub]

Yep UAE wasn't a bad effort at all. But overcast mornings at Lords are a very different beast. I don't think there's a fag paper between them and if Watto can't bowl effectively or has a double failure he'd be for the chop f'sure. I just don't think we should get too excited about Marsh belting around an attack that had Jesse Ryder opening the bowling. All the bats have enjoyed a good centre hit out or two in these warm ups, they don't mean anything more than that. I just don't think Marsh is likely to do much for us with the ball. Watto even though he hasn't taken a bag full for a long time is going to tie down an end and works really well with Lyon by forcing the batsmen to take Nafe on if they want to keep the scoreboard ticking over. I feel in the same situation Marsh will go for 4rpo and allow the batsmen to play Lyon more easily. That's all I have to favour Watto at this stage. I'm certainly no fan of the ****. Just that with the squad we have and Rhino out his control and tightness are a little more valuable than what Marsh brings.

 

[Riggins]

Agreed again. Marsh is more likely to take a bag of wickets but he's also way more like to go for 0/100. Not what we need with our current bowling lineup.

 

[social]

Agreed again. Marsh is more likely to take a bag of wickets but he's also way more like to go for 0/100. Not what we need with our current bowling lineup.

If Marsh bowls enough to go for 0/100 then something must've gone seriously amiss with the rest of our attack

I think that you need to bear in mind that Watto has been bowling less than 14 overs per test for the last 3 years - we could get that output from Clarke, Voges and Smith if need be without having to resort to MMarsh

Watto is an all-rounder in name only these days

 

[adub]

Where Marsh goes with his bowling is going to be interesting. Watto started out really bowling 140kmh straight pies. It wasn't until he dropped the pace back and found swing that he became really handy. I don't think pulling back and swinging it is where Marsh is going to head. Perhaps he can find a few extra yards and really use his height. Bang it in and get them to jump off a length. If he can find that pace to push up near 150k he's going to be a handful in short bursts.

On his batting though, these two tons look to me for all the world like the sort of thing Nick Maddinson would have done had he been there. I hope they are just the start of a long run of strong performances in all conditions, but they strike me as more a young guy with a free swing and good eye roughing up nuffies only to be found out when it really matters.

 

[adub]

If Marsh bowls enough to go for 0/100 then something must've gone seriously amiss with the rest of our attack

I think that you need to bear in mind that Watto has been bowling less than 14 overs per test for the last 3 years - we could get that output from Clarke, Voges and Smith if need be without having to resort to MMarsh

Watto is an all-rounder in name only these days

I think we're on a very similar wavelength actually. It's only a question of if Marsh is ready now to bring more than Watto's meagre offerings, or if he's not quite there yet. I'm in the not quite camp, you're obviously not. I think we'll both be in the same camp sooner rather than later.

 

[social]

I think we're on a very similar wavelength actually. It's only a question of if Marsh is ready now to bring more than Watto's meagre offerings, or if he's not quite there yet. I'm in the not quite camp, you're obviously not. I think we'll both be in the same camp sooner rather than later.

I actually have one foot in the anyone but Watto camp as much as anything else as it is hard to name a player that has had so much misplaced trust thrust upon him in relatively recent Australian test history

The guy is 34 and has played 58 tests and some people are still basing his selection on potential ffs

What's more, the WI tour was supposed to be his last-chance saloon

Well he did **** all there and now it's the Ashes that might prove to be his swansong

Sorry but this is just wash, rinse, repeat for Watto over the last few years

In any event, I do rate MMarsh's ability with the bat (ball is a bonus IMO) and as I said previously, there's no better time to pick someone than on the back of a couple of hundreds

Plus, whilst his ceiling is way higher than Watto's appears to be, it's highly unlikely that his basement is much lower

 

[adub]

All good points mate. I've been half way through the anyone but Watto door for years. I certainly won't be blowing up if Marsh plays ahead of him like I did when Agar played in front of Lyon last time we were here.