***Official*** New Zealand in the West Indies 2014

[ohnoitsyou]

Blockys watching a different games to the rest of us once again. The game was lost when we conceded such a big total and baz slapped the ball straight to the fielder.

If I was a WI fan I would be insulted, their bowlers bowled beautifully in that part of the game but oh wait we lost the game bwcause we had two people trying to see out Narine.

 

[Blocky]

Yes and my question was blockhead what planet do you live on where 2 for 28 is a bad performance, it's par or under.

Considering the conditions the match was played in and the batsman he got to bowl to? Only Anderson and Sodhi went at more than he did. He didn't bowl particularly well, got Simmons cheap and got a late wicket. If you watched him bowl, he didn't bowl great.

 

[Blocky]

Blockys watching a different games to the rest of us once again. The game was lost when we conceded such a big total and baz slapped the ball straight to the fielder.

If I was a WI fan I would be insulted, their bowlers bowled beautifully in that part of the game but oh wait we lost the game bwcause we had two people trying to see out Narine.

"See out Narine" - Taylor got out to Narine, having faced 8 balls of his for 7 runs. Scoring 1 from 5 from Badree and 5 from 6 from Sammy - at a time where the team was chasing 8s. "We lost because we let them set a big total" - oh, but apparently we bowled well?

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Considering the conditions the match was played in and the batsman he got to bowl to? Only Anderson and Sodhi went at more than he did. He didn't bowl particularly well, got Simmons cheap and got a late wicket. If you watched him bowl, he didn't bowl great.

He bowled better than any bowler not named southee. But wait, wagner would of done better right?

 

[Blocky]

He bowled better than any bowler not named southee. But wait, wagner would of done better right?

So Neesham didn't outbowl him?

Wagner wouldn't do it better, he'd be a horrible choice for T20 - as is Boult at the moment when compared to other options we have.

 

[GGG]

Not sold on McClenaghan myself for 20/20's, pretty similar record to Boults and to me Boult looks like he is getting better and better

 

[SteveNZ]

Let's just all try and get along, gentlemen.

Anyone got an opinion on the Boult catch? Spectacular no doubt but I can't for the life of me see how that's out.

 

[Zinzan]

This game was lost by two players trying to be the anchor in Williamson and Taylor. That's the issue if you play them both in the same side - Taylor has lost whatever ability he used to have to hit out.

For me, the big factor in Taylor's T20 deterioration in the last 2-3 years is he appears to batting with the fear of getting out. A mentality one cannot afford in this form of the game. He was 7 off 12 at one stage. It's unacceptable to ever be 7 off 12, unless you're chasing a ridiculously small total.

 

[Zinzan]

Let's just all try and get along, gentlemen.

Anyone got an opinion on the Boult catch? Spectacular no doubt but I can't for the life of me see how that's out.

I've only seen it on the looping link Blocky posted above which doesn't show a replay. Looked out on that, what did I miss?

 

[Blocky]

Let's just all try and get along, gentlemen.

Anyone got an opinion on the Boult catch? Spectacular no doubt but I can't for the life of me see how that's out.

According to the laws of cricket, as long as no part of your body is grounded outside of the boundary line, then the ball is considered to be in play - even though he took the catch (in my view) diving across the ropes. Superb athleticism - it makes it three spectacular catches in the space of six months.

 

[Blocky]

For me, the big factor in Taylor's T20 deterioration in the last 2-3 years is he appears to batting with the fear of getting out. A mentality one cannot afford in this form of the game. He was 7 off 12 at one stage. It's unacceptable to ever be 7 off 12, unless you're chasing a ridiculously small total.

I'd agree with that - my gut feel is that he's confused on what his role should be in the T20 side. He's become brilliant in one day cricket because he understands his role is to bat for twenty overs a match. In T20, I think he's caught between wanting to play the anchor role and not wanting to be dismissed with the slog sweep.

I maintain that he's not in our top T20 line up at the moment due to this, and also because we're starting to generate a number of multi dimensional hitters.

 

[hendrix]

NZ is just not very good in this format and the Windies are excellent.

Narine and Badree are the best T20 bowlers in the world. There's weakness in their batting lineup but as soon as they post a decent total it was always going to be difficult.

This is very much a hotch potch team too. Latham shouldn't be in the team if he's not playing as a top or middle order batsman. Ditto Watling. Sodhi bowled well for the most part but he's not our top limited overs spinner.

Neesham and Anderson also aren't really 3rd and 4th bowlers. We should have another bowler there instead of Latham or Watling.

 

[Blocky]

NZ is just not very good in this format and the Windies are excellent.

Narine and Badree are the best T20 bowlers in the world. There's weakness in their batting lineup but as soon as they post a decent total it was always going to be difficult.

This is very much a hotch potch team too. Latham shouldn't be in the team if he's not playing as a top or middle order batsman. Ditto Watling. Sodhi bowled well for the most part but he's not our top limited overs spinner.

Neesham and Anderson also aren't really 3rd and 4th bowlers. We should have another bowler there instead of Latham or Watling.

I think we're just fine in this format, when we have our proper line up. We played with five guys who probably don't make our starting XI when all players are considered. I think the Windies are strong on the back of Narine and Badree as bowlers, with Gayle and Dwayne Bravo being world class at T20 too.

If we select our strongest line up, I think we're Top 5 in the world, alongside the Windies, South Africa, Australia and India and I think any of those teams are interchangeable at the moment too. What we're lacking is a second spinner who can do the same sort of role as McCullum - if Vettori came back in then I think we've got the batting unit, one of the best T20 pace bowlers around in Southee and the spinners to really compete anywhere in the world. It's important we get Ryder back into the mix and I'd argue for Guptill's inclusion too - on the conditon that he just swing for the fences and not worry about the long game.

My line up if we get Vettori back involved would be

1. Ryder
2. Guptill
3. McCullum
4. Anderson
5. Williamson
6. Neesham
7. Ronchi
8. Vettori
9. NcCullum
10. Southee
11. McCleneghan / Henry / Boult - in that order of preference.

Windies are pretty lethal at this format when fully fit too, I do question why someone like Holder isn't in the side based on his control and ability - also his batting, but my Windies line up (fully fit)

1. Gayle
2. Smith
3. Fletcher
4. Bravo
5. Bravo
6. Pollard
7. Ramdin
8. Sammy
9. Holder
10. Badree
11. Narine

Asking for overs from Gayle, Dwayne Bravo and Pollard.

I think those two teams would be a pretty decent contest in all conditions.

 

[SteveNZ]

According to the laws of cricket, as long as no part of your body is grounded outside of the boundary line, then the ball is considered to be in play - even though he took the catch (in my view) diving across the ropes. Superb athleticism - it makes it three spectacular catches in the space of six months.

No doubt, it's a magnificent effort and as a member of the bowler's brigade I'm totally impressed by the likes of Boult, Southee, Jimmy Anderson etc showing we're not all draught horses.

But my eyes don't fail me do they, his last foot step before diving for the catch was outside the ropes? Even though you're telling me the rule is that if you catch it with nothing grounded behind the rope it's out, that strikes me as wrong. That in turn basically means I can take a running leap forward from outside and as long as I land inside, on your bike.

 

[hendrix]

Mostly agree with that team, but id swap Williamson and Anderson around.

Also, no Vettori. He hasn't played cricket and is a liability in the field. I watched him play in the MCC vs ROW match and he was bowling utter piss. More pies than Sodhi. Id bring another fast bowler in.

 

[Blocky]

No doubt, it's a magnificent effort and as a member of the bowler's brigade I'm totally impressed by the likes of Boult, Southee, Jimmy Anderson etc showing we're not all draught horses.

But my eyes don't fail me do they, his last foot step before diving for the catch was outside the ropes? Even though you're telling me the rule is that if you catch it with nothing grounded behind the rope it's out, that strikes me as wrong. That in turn basically means I can take a running leap forward from outside and as long as I land inside, on your bike.

Don't know about you mate, but the last thing I was doing as an opening bowler was throwing myself around that nimbly in the field... guess I came up in the old school of practice where I was expected to bowl my four to six overs, take a couple of catches, have a hit in the nets and go home. These guys put as much time into fielding as they do their other skills.

Boult definitely leapt from outside the boundary rope back into play. Usually you see guys make a conscious effort to ground themselves before taking the catch. Knowing cricket, the letter of the law will be much too vague and open to subjectiveness on this type of thing.

 

[Blocky]

Mostly agree with that team, but id swap Williamson and Anderson around.

Also, no Vettori. He hasn't played cricket and is a liability in the field. I watched him play in the MCC vs ROW match and he was bowling utter piss. More pies than Sodhi. Id bring another fast bowler in.

I think you float Williamson personally. The reason I put Anderson at four is because my school of thought is that you hit out from ball one and don't worry about the long game until you're four or so down. You've got to figure one out of that Top 5 is going to go on and make a knock in most conditions so having all of them swing for the fences from Ball 1 will stop us getting into situations like we were today, where were in a holding pattern with a lot of wickets remaining, about 7.5 RPO needed - then we let that drift to 10, lost wickets and it was much too hard for the guys coming in.

As for Vettori - that's the caveat on "a fit Vettori" - basically if you look at the world rankings in T20 for bowlers, pretty much 8 out of the 10 are spin bowlers. If Vettori isn't our guy, then we should be looking for someone else to come in and fulfil the role. I actually think two to three years from now, someone like Mitchell Santner will be a great fit - livewire in the field, good with the bat and should be able to develop his bowling to be more than useful in T20 with his ability to dart.

 

[hendrix]

Santner looked great in the couple of matches I saw of him.

 

[GGG]

Stuff.co.nz have posted the catch for those that haven't seen it. New Zealand, world, sport, business & entertainment news on Stuff.co.nz

 

[Blocky]

I'd love to see his quicker ball on speed radar, I wouldn't be surprised if it broke 120kmh. He also has a bouncer that he can bowl from a spinners run up but he's worried about bowling it most of the time. But for me, he's much more consistent even now than Sodhi will be in five years. Sodhi has bigger weapons in terms of turn at this point in their careers, but when three balls an over are hittable for boundaries, that doesn't matter so much.