***Official*** New Zealand in the West Indies 2014

[vandem]

Correct.

There are also some old school players.

Dowling and Sutcliffe (recalled for final NZ tour after a 6 year gap) played together on 1965 tour to Ind / Pak / Eng.

Dowling and Turner played together from 1969 to 1972, including 1969 tour to Eng / Ind / Pak and 1972 tour to WI.

 

[Hurricane]

Dowling and Sutcliffe (recalled for final NZ tour after a 6 year gap) played together on 1965 tour to Ind / Pak / Eng.

Dowling and Turner played together from 1969 to 1972, including 1969 tour to Eng / Ind / Pak and 1972 tour to WI.

Thank you - I knew we would have a fan who knew NZ cricket history.

 

[Hurricane]

Ok this is a long post and compares the ICC player rankings of good NZ teams. The 2014 team is ranked second based on this rough and ready comparison. The limitations of the study is that Hadlee at 900 points is worth far more than just 300 points more than a bowler whose score is 600. Also I had great difficulty finding the perfect game in the 1980s to pick our strongest team.

1986
				
JG Wright			561	
BA Edgar			508	
KR Rutherford			131	
MD Crowe			681	
JJ Crowe			491	
JV Coney*			699	
EJ Gray				206	
RJ Hadlee			902	
IDS Smith†			340	
JG Bracewell			527	
W Watson			22	
				5068

1987
PA Horne			0
JG Wright			591
AH Jones			399
MD Crowe			776
JJ Crowe*			457
DN Patel			270
JG Bracewell			521
RJ Hadlee			905
IDS Smith†			310
DK Morrison			130
EJ Chatfield			612
				4971

2001

MH Richardson		684
MD Bell			329
MS Sinclair		610
SP Fleming*		611
NJ Astle		602
CD McMillan		694
CL Cairns		686
AC Parore†		423
DJ Nash	*		0
DL Vettori		578
O'Connor         0
			5217

Dion is not  listed

2004

MH Richardson			711
SP Fleming*			630
NJ Astle			619
SB Styris			590
CD McMillan			633
JDP Oram			531
DR Tuffey			675
CL Cairns			606
BB McCullum†			282
DL Vettori			473
CS Martin			630
				6380

2014
TWM Latham		441	
HD Rutherford		348	
KS Williamson		654	
LRPL Taylor		818	
BB McCullum*		663	
JDS Neesham		419	
BJ Watling†		574	
TG Southee		775	
MD Craig		154	
N Wagner		494	
TA Boult		729	
			6069

 

[hendrix]

Not that I'm trying to discourage you guys from talking about it because you may find it interesting, but I really don't care whether this is the best NZ side or has the best players or where it stands historically. I'm interested in seeing them perform now and don't really give a crap at how they'll be looked back at historically.

 

[Flem274*]

I care about both. It's the same thing really. If you want these guys to perform and they do, that obviously makes you happy but in doing that they become remembered, especially if they do something good enough to be brought up as often as the 80s and 99/00s.

 

[Hurricane]

Not that I'm trying to discourage you guys from talking about it because you may find it interesting, but I really don't care whether this is the best NZ side or has the best players or where it stands historically. I'm interested in seeing them perform now and don't really give a crap at how they'll be looked back at historically.

unlike

 

[Fuller Pilch]

So declare overnight, OR bat for 30-60 minutes and tell Kane if he wants a double he's got a maximum of x overs of slogging?

 

[hendrix]

unlike

again I don't mind you guys talking about it and I'm glad you find it interesting, I just don't.

 

[hendrix]

So declare overnight, OR bat for 30-60 minutes and tell Kane if he wants a double he's got a maximum of x overs of slogging?

check back a few pages ago.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Not that I'm trying to discourage you guys from talking about it because you may find it interesting, but I really don't care whether this is the best NZ side or has the best players or where it stands historically. I'm interested in seeing them perform now and don't really give a crap at how they'll be looked back at historically.

Brilliant.

 

[Hurricane]

Its not brilliant. There was a word in the 70s for what hendrix is doing and was called being a killjoy. I don't think he is doing it intentionally however.

 

[NZTailender]

Tbf he has a point. It's a tour thread and comparisons to other teams or where it stands amongst ATG NZ teams is worthy of a different thread, but then again it's been given rise due to the relative excellence of this squad recently that it might naturally come up.

I think I find that when there's multiple discussions going on within a thread there's invariably one I don't care about reading or taking part in, except instead of commenting I just keep scrolling.

 

[Hurricane]

The voice of our most experienced NZ member. Thanks for that. Nodded my head at all of it.

 

[Beamer]

Late thoughts from me once I had finally escaped from my girlfriend for long enough to watch the cricket!

Superb stuff from Kane, I think this will be the knock that turns him from good promising batsman to a very good test batsman in all conditions. Kemar reckons he's a better batsman than Ross and in terms of technique and temperament I'd tend to agree with him.

Talking of Kemar, he's definitely back. 100 wickets in 26 tests is outstanding for a modern fast bowler and an average of 27 is highly impressive. JT looks a bit tired having bowled a lot of overs 9same as Southee really) but we've now got a very impressive new ball attack. Jason Holder looks like a promising third seamer too, much better than Gabriel as predicted. In more helpful conditions I think we'll have all bases covered (pace, swing, seam and bounce).

Benn and Shilly were extremely disappointing. Shilly is clearly struggling to adapt to life without a doosra even though he can still rip an offie and Benn was really darting them in. I really do think Narine will walk back in for the Bangladesh tests. I do also think Shilly has offered nothing in this match and I'm more than a little irritated that I was denied the opportunity to watch Blackwood again.

The rain is irritating as this has turned into a crackerjack of a test match. I really hope it stays away today so the series can end properly.

 

[Flametree]

Thank you - I knew we would have a fan who knew NZ cricket history.

You missed Sutcliffe and Donnelly.

Now, back to the discussion on whether to declare.

I just can't believe how bad Ramdin has been in this series. The Windies had a captain for two years who wasn't up to his primary role in the side. Now they seem to have another.

 

[Kippax]

Barbados Meteorological Services 400KM DBZ Animation

 

[Beamer]

Certainly players like Gayle & Bravo are dangerous for their stroke-play, not their ability to shut-shop to save a test.

Agree for the most part although Bravo saved a test for us against you just last year with an epic double century and is capable of batting well in pretty much any situation. Gayle needs to bat positively, he no longer has he technique to survive against Southee and Boult unless he puts the pressure back on them.

 

[Hurricane]

You missed Sutcliffe and Donnelly.

Now, back to the discussion on whether to declare.

I just can't believe how bad Ramdin has been in this series. The Windies had a captain for two years who wasn't up to his primary role in the side. Now they seem to have another.

Good catch.

We had to name ATG provincial sides once. And 3 different sides tried to claim Sutcliffe iirc.

Same story with Martin Crowe.

 

[Beamer]

You missed Sutcliffe and Donnelly.

Now, back to the discussion on whether to declare.

I just can't believe how bad Ramdin has been in this series. The Windies had a captain for two years who wasn't up to his primary role in the side. Now they seem to have another.

Too early to say tbh. He has scored runs at least and his captaincy hasn't been too disastrous (though he needs to work on his slip placement). He has kept brilliantly for about 2 years but has regressed badly this series. He needs to learn to concentrate well enough when combining captaincy with keeping, his footwork against the pacers has regressed.

 

[Beamer]

Does he have a say at the selection table beamer? As I give him a solid A minus for that. His read on the 2nd test wicket won the match.And it was brave but correct to drop Gabriel for this match.

You can argue they should have played 6 batsman and for that reason i don't give him full marks.

Yeah for the first time the captain and coach have been made selectors for this series onwards. I agree they messed up big time with the 5 bowler strategy in this test but hopefully they'll learn from that. It's also an utter certainty that Ramdin would have Narine in his team no matter what the pitch or circumstance as he keeps to Narine better than anyone else around and knows his game.

We're getting there and I'll judge him properly when we finally have the correct side on the field, hopefully against Bangladesh in August and September. To me it's an absolute brainer at the moment and should be clear 90% of the time:

Gayle
Braithwaite
Edwards
Bravo
Chanderpaul
Blackwood (Dwayne Bravo if you need the 5th bowling option).
Ramdin
Holder
Roach
Narine
Taylor

Now that's a side I could support without complaint tbh. That there is our current best possible xi and if that's picked consistently I reckon we'll be competitive against most for now.