**Official** New Zealand Domestic Season 2013/2014

[Blocky]

It's so amazing to me to see a bunch of guys averaging 50+ over the course of a season and bowlers being 30+ - really shows you how much the pitches have changed in the last decade, unfortunately I just get the feeling that players aren't being asked to score hard runs and that our pitches in NZ just don't deteriorate over four days.

You're also seeing when guys like Wagner, Boult and Southee return - they're such a class above the other contenders in terms of their performance that you start to see the major gulf between our mainline seam attack and the other options we have - if one of those three were to go down, it'd create a pretty big hole.

Frank the Tank continues to score domestic runs in abundant quantity year in, year out.... why they can't take a guy who has proven he can do this in England and New Zealand with frequency and turn him into a useful product for NZ is beyond me. It has to be purely mental because he even does it over in India in the IPL.

 

[SteveNZ]

Wellington coach Siddons faces tough decisions | Stuff.co.nz

Siddons says they'll get an outright win over Auckland, when their last four-day game starts on Eden Park's Outer Oval tomorrow, to end up finishing second.

If this is a correct paraphrase, giggle. Seems to me if Siddons has been there three years, hasn't won a 'brass razoo' and yet has all these ex-NZ players in career best form, he's really not much chop despite how big of a game he talks.

 

[jcas0167]

Take your points on those bowlers, but to be fair when Lord de G is fit and firing he's a level above that. He can hit 130, do it with a heavy ball and nip it either way - unfortunately his knees haven't always played ball. If he could offer the runs he needed to in order to play international cricket, he'd be quite handy with the ball too. Look at the nut that got Papps on a flat one.

He should definitely be on the A tour to England at least on the back of excellent all round results. We're pretty spoilt for big hitting all rounders at the moment. If Anderson or Neesham get injured I guess he'd be next in line?

Looking at those stats, I think Gillespie certainly should continue to be in the test frame. He's the same age as Ryan Harris for Australia and a couple of years older than Mitchell Johnson.

Good to see Greg Hay make a successful return averaging 60, coming in for the second half of the PS.

Hopefully the Ford Trophy will see some of the younger prospects breaking through (eg. Walsh, Young, Weerasundra, O'Donnell?).

 

[jcas0167]

If this is a correct paraphrase, giggle. Seems to me if Siddons has been there three years, hasn't won a 'brass razoo' and yet has all these ex-NZ players in career best form, he's really not much chop despite how big of a game he talks.

That overlooks the amount of points lost through weather this PS season, beaten finalists in T20 last year, and a last over loss missing out on finals this year.

He seems to be helping improve the performance of the batsmen, with old stager Papps being a prime example, and comments from others like Tamin Iqbal.

For Papps, that meant learning how to bat all over again.

"That first year was a little up and down," Papps said this week.

"It's not easy to change in-season so, not this offseason but the one before, was really important. I went away, worked on things till they got to a level where I was confident and that showed."

Papps made 810 runs, at 45, last summer and after two four-day games this season the former Black Cap is averaging over 75.

He was 32 when this process began, with a method that had been well honed.

"It's not easy to adopt new things when you get older. But I can definitely vouch for it working for me and I can see other guys getting benefit from it as well."

So could the rest of the coaching staff at Cricket Wellington (CW).

There had initially been scepticism about Siddons and his "way". But when an old bloke like Papps was suddenly hitting balls back over bowlers' heads, en route to scoring 609 runs at 76.12 in last season's 50-over competition, that changed.

Siddons' philosophy is now applied across the board in all of CW's programmes, right down to the 13-year-olds starting out in the Future Firebirds' scheme.

"To be totally honest, we've not been very good at producing batsmen," CW college cricket co-ordinator Rhys Morgan said.

"Take James Franklin out of the equation, whose batting's improved as his career's gone on, but before that you're looking at the likes of [Bruce] Edgar as the last guy we brought through the school ranks and turned into a pretty good international batsman.

"Things really had to change."

Which has meant unbundling the games of Year 9 and 10 players and giving them the tools to hit the ball hard and straight.

"I was very, very excited because I was seeing Jamie after a long time. He is easily the best coach we've ever had in Bangladesh," Tamim said, before flying home today after a six-game stint with the Firebirds.
...
"Me, Shakib [Al Hasan] and Mushfiqur [Rahim] the captain, we rate Jamie very, very highly and a lot of the boys do as well. He is the only one who changed our culture and changed the thinking of the batsmen," said Tamim.

"He got aggressiveness into us and his hard work - his 3 years of hard work - is just paying off now. We won the [one-day] series against the West Indies recently and all the hard work he put in is just paying off now. It's unfortunate he's not with us any more, because I personally think he's an incredible coach."

 

[Kippax]

Some senior players will be ''under the pump to hold their spots'' as the coach seeks to find places for Henry Walsh, Tom Blundell and Matt Taylor.

Yeah Raki is nowhere for now, according to the Dominion Post. Doesn't impress some of these Fairfax writers, with his claims of pretentious coffees with Mahela Jayawardene, successful white collar parents.

 

[straw man]

Take your points on those bowlers, but to be fair when Lord de G is fit and firing he's a level above that. He can hit 130, do it with a heavy ball and nip it either way - unfortunately his knees haven't always played ball. If he could offer the runs he needed to in order to play international cricket, he'd be quite handy with the ball too. Look at the nut that got Papps on a flat one.

I'm sure if he does that some days then he deserves success, though as you say he's not able to do that most of the time. Really my comment is not a criticism of CDG, KNB etc, but a reflection on some of the batting. I had a look through CDG's wickets and two main things stood out:
- A tremendous number of wickets from a straight-one or slight off-cutter honing in on the right hander's offstump. Either looking to score through the offside but then fall over to be lbw or bowled, or fail to defend effectively. Definitely credit to the bowler that he is effective with that variation, though perhaps also reflects batsmen's defensive frailties or frustration at being unable to score.
- Some very 'relaxed' batting and not just from tail enders either.

I have no doubt the Lord of the Grand Home and the other successful 115-130 medium pacers going round are smart bowlers with a bit of craft. A quick look at the season econ rates is quite fascinating because literally every one of that type of bowler is going at under 3 per over (CDG 2.6, Bates 2.6, Aldridge 2.9, Arnel 2.8, Ellis 2.6, KNB 2.9) while almost every faster bowler is going at more like 3.5. Conclusion is that accurately nagging away at sub-130 (and often considerably sub-130) and waiting for batsmen to get bored and frustrated and loose, is a more than viable tactic in NZ FC. Bowl enough balls, keep the runs down, and either the batsman will get themselves out or will demonstrate that they cannot reliably play a defensive stroke/leave. I guess that's the issue for me.

Should say as a caveat that this obviously doesn't apply to all domestic batsmen in a year where many of them flourished - I think bowlers of the above type dominate in particular against struggling borderline top 6 selections.

 

[SteveNZ]

That overlooks the amount of points lost through weather this PS season, beaten finalists in T20 last year, and a last over loss missing out on finals this year.

He seems to be helping improve the performance of the batsmen, with old stager Papps being a prime example, and comments from others like Tamin Iqbal.

Granted, but it doesn't just rain in Wellington.

I guess Siddons would point to the likes of Gillespie and Macca (bowling) and Papps/Franklin (bat) being up the top of the charts, but really those guys were doing that before his time (maybe Papps apart).

Josh Brodie is a classic example of someone who has taken major backward steps over the last 2-3 years, partly through injury but not completely attributable. Murdoch is also in reverse, and the Dad's Army bowling attack means there are nil opportunities for young blokes with the ball. You're either winning trophies and creating a great culture, or you're advancing young guys to higher honours. To me, he's done neither. Pollard is the one that disappoints me the most.

 

[straw man]

He should definitely be on the A tour to England at least on the back of excellent all round results. We're pretty spoilt for big hitting all rounders at the moment. If Anderson or Neesham get injured I guess he'd be next in line?

There might be space for more than one, but Kuggle should be selected first as 'promising big hitting all rounder' for the NZ A tour.

As for who plays that role for NZ in the event of injury, we just don't select an allrounder unless they are very close to being top-6 best batsmen/ top-4 best bowlers - instead go with specialists.

 

[jcas0167]

Granted, but it doesn't just rain in Wellington.

I guess Siddons would point to the likes of Gillespie and Macca (bowling) and Papps/Franklin (bat) being up the top of the charts, but really those guys were doing that before his time (maybe Papps apart).

Josh Brodie is a classic example of someone who has taken major backward steps over the last 2-3 years, partly through injury but not completely attributable. Murdoch is also in reverse, and the Dad's Army bowling attack means there are nil opportunities for young blokes with the ball. You're either winning trophies and creating a great culture, or you're advancing young guys to higher honours. To me, he's done neither. Pollard is the one that disappoints me the most.

I'm not sure what's happened with Brodie, but Pollard has had a great season. Average of 61, with 2 centuries and a fifty. He broke his thumb about a month ago and has been out of action since.

I'm hopeful that some of the younger batsmen, like Walsh & Colson, will get a go in the Ford Trophy as they've indicated above.

In terms of bowlers I guess they're in a difficult spot because those guys are performing. Kuggeleign did pretty well last season, but moved home to ND.

I remember in the 90's there were concerns about older players leaving the game too soon, but now looking at Wellington, and to an extent Auckland, the problem is guys hanging around too long.

 

[Binkley]

If you think that the Plunket Shield's primary role as a feeder to the national side and the developer of young talent, then the current Wellington team will probably make you weep big, fat, cold tears. If you see it as a competition worth winning for its own right, and are a Wellington supporter, then the current Wellington team will probably just make you a little bit sad. So many wise old heads/ has-beens clinging on to their place in the team with wizened claws. And such absolute neglect for the next generation. If this year was underwhelming, just wait until McKay, Arnel, Elliott, Franklin, Patel, Gillespie, Ronchi and Papps retire. As a Wellingtonian I can see some pretty tough years ahead.

 

[straw man]

If you think that the Plunket Shield's primary role as a feeder to the national side and the developer of young talent, then the current Wellington team will probably make you weep big, fat, cold tears. If you see it as a competition worth winning for its own right, and are a Wellington supporter, then the current Wellington team will probably just make you a little bit sad. So many wise old heads/ has-beens clinging on to their place in the team with wizened claws. And such absolute neglect for the next generation. If this year was underwhelming, just wait until McKay, Arnel, Elliott, Franklin, Patel, Gillespie, Ronchi and Papps retire. As a Wellingtonian I can see some pretty tough years ahead.

The most bizarre thing about this is that they went to the trouble of deliberately importing two of these this season in Papps and Arnel.

 

[SteveNZ]

If you think that the Plunket Shield's primary role as a feeder to the national side and the developer of young talent, then the current Wellington team will probably make you weep big, fat, cold tears. If you see it as a competition worth winning for its own right, and are a Wellington supporter, then the current Wellington team will probably just make you a little bit sad. So many wise old heads/ has-beens clinging on to their place in the team with wizened claws. And such absolute neglect for the next generation. If this year was underwhelming, just wait until McKay, Arnel, Elliott, Franklin, Patel, Gillespie, Ronchi and Papps retire. As a Wellingtonian I can see some pretty tough years ahead.

Exactly what I was getting at. They're achieving neither. This side should either have trophies to show for the amount of ex/current NZ reps holding up the youth, and created a winning culture, or it should slowly move those guys away and bring through the next wave.

But they shipped in a 35-year-old seamer, who from all reports is a very savvy bowling coach but some of that is negated by the fact he's kept someone out of a spot.

Post World Cup, a hell of a lot of those names above will be gone. Welcome to 2015-2020 Wellington: the Rebuilding Years. Actually they'll probably just offer a bunch of contracts to guys on the fringes from around the country, and try to rely on the few young talents that have been given a go over the past 2-3 seasons.

As for Pollard, yes his 2013-14 PS numbers are good but his T20 record in particular is horrendous for a player of his hitting ability.

 

[Immenso]

Astle's 6-fer is much better on the eye than his more attritional 8-fer.

It does look like he is bowling quicker and flatter. If that's a reaction to lessons learnt in e.g Colombo then good on him.

Permission to revert back to being an Astle fanboy?

 

[Binkley]

Exactly what I was getting at. They're achieving neither. This side should either have trophies to show for the amount of ex/current NZ reps holding up the youth, and created a winning culture, or it should slowly move those guys away and bring through the next wave.

But they shipped in a 35-year-old seamer, who from all reports is a very savvy bowling coach but some of that is negated by the fact he's kept someone out of a spot.

Post World Cup, a hell of a lot of those names above will be gone. Welcome to 2015-2020 Wellington: the Rebuilding Years. Actually they'll probably just offer a bunch of contracts to guys on the fringes from around the country, and try to rely on the few young talents that have been given a go over the past 2-3 seasons.

As for Pollard, yes his 2013-14 PS numbers are good but his T20 record in particular is horrendous for a player of his hitting ability.

Siddons was moaning in the paper a while ago about how much Wellington had invested in Scott Kuggeleijn, only for the traitorous little sod to do a runner for ND. But when someone like Arnel is bought in to complement an attack that already includes McKay, Franklin and Gillespie you can't really blame the wee fella.

 

[SteveNZ]

Siddons was moaning in the paper a while ago about how much Wellington had invested in Scott Kuggeleijn, only for the traitorous little sod to do a runner for ND. But when someone like Arnel is bought in to complement an attack that already includes McKay, Franklin and Gillespie you can't really blame the wee fella.

"His batting will definitely suffer not having me around but bowling wise he should get a fair bit more [overs]."

Quote gold from J.Siddons. We should be so lucky to have him on the scene (stats don't really bear him out at all, incidentally)

I didn't find the investment quote you speak of, but if he did Kuggs is an ND boy, so that's bollocks.

Talks a lot of hot air, this bloke. Which country is he from again?

 

[GingerBreadMan]

Anyone see How's dismissal? He gave that bat a fair nudge

 

[Binkley]

Here we go. My mistake though. It was Robbie Kerr who said it, not Jamie Siddons. Money quote:

"When you look at developing players, the two we got into our side and invested some time in were [Scott] Kuggeleijn and [Craig] Cachopa. They're both guys that could play international cricket and it was a real shame to not have them play their whole careers for Wellington," Kerr said.

 

[Bahnz]

Astle's 6-fer is much better on the eye than his more attritional 8-fer.

It does look like he is bowling quicker and flatter. If that's a reaction to lessons learnt in e.g Colombo then good on him.

Permission to revert back to being an Astle fanboy?

Eh... it's frustrating that he's bowling from the wrong end, as it's a little hard to judge how good some of those dismissals were. Still, good to see him getting a few wickets out nicked to slip as any half decent leggy generally should.

Oh and permision denied on resumption of Tastle fanboyism. At this point the Tastle love ban can only be lifted by passable performances in test cricket.

 

[Bahnz]

Anyone see How's dismissal? He gave that bat a fair nudge

Haha, he should've got one of his teammates to punt him instead. Right up there for the "Most village bit of cricket 2013/14" award

 

[SteveNZ]

Haha, wonderful. Invested one season in both, with their only incentive being increased opportunities.

In other news, if Kippax was truly the king he'd make a 2013-14 domestic version of Fail Blog. Jamie How's right-foot punt could make a nice start