***Official*** India in New Zealand 2013/14

[hendrix]

the freaking straw men and astonishing failure to concede any point even presented with overwhelming evidence…jesus christ.

The thing is, we're all NZ fans here so we're actually pretty happy to concede or even hope that a player might turn out to be better than what he's shown. If you've just said "I've seen Wagner perform better at domestic cricket and I think things may come right for him at the top level", and "Wow I wasn't aware that Boult had developed an away-swinger, that's great news" we'd actually be able to have a conversation without me feeling like I'm banging my head against a brick wall.

We even agree with you on some points. Not many of us think that Sodhi should be playing test cricket. Most of us don't rate Guptill at all. We ALL want Ryder in the test team and rate him as very good technically.

Just ****ing listen and be willing to concede and be content with saying "I think this" rather than "the evidence suggests this" when it clearly doesn't.

And it's bloody insulting when you say that we don't know the difference between seam and swing. This is a ****ing cricket forum ffs. We do know about cricket.

 

[Blocky]

"We" - i.e taking your opinion and migrating it to be the opinion of more than you, because you don't feel safe having your own singular opinion expressed.

You talk about a first class match I attended, without realising I was under Seddon Park with Wheeler and Milne running their bowling drills while a couple of ND A players batted and know exactly what Milne was and wasn't doing in that game. You talk about a guy I was mentoring as a 15 and 16 year old when he was attending Tauranga College, keep in touch with and have even practiced with in the last six months and try to tell me that he has consistency and control over a delivery he doesn't have. You also seem to indicate that there is a common consensus that Guptill isn't worth his place in the side, however the argument here seems to indicate people rate him much more highly than I do.

You then talk about listen and concession, You talk about Wagner as if he hasn't proven something already at test, despite his figures being highly comparable with pretty much every bowler not named Boult, Martin or Bond in their first few seasons and completely disregard the point of which wickets he's taken and when he's taken them. Which indicates to me you're not willing to "concede" and listen, which indicates to me you're not interested in discussion if it contrasts to your viewpoint.

I'm not going to make it personal, but you don't know the difference between swing and seam - not if you think Boult has an inswinger that he can control or if you think Milne has any idea if the ball is going to swing or not when he bowls it.

 

[Jono]

If you've got a five day pass, then may God have Mercy on us all.

 

[hendrix]

"We" - i.e taking your opinion and migrating it to be the opinion of more than you, because you don't feel safe having your own singular opinion expressed.

You talk about a first class match I attended, without realising I was under Seddon Park with Wheeler and Milne running their bowling drills while a couple of ND A players batted and know exactly what Milne was and wasn't doing in that game. You talk about a guy I was mentoring as a 15 and 16 year old when he was attending Tauranga College, keep in touch with and have even practiced with in the last six months and try to tell me that he has consistency and control over a delivery he doesn't have. You also seem to indicate that there is a common consensus that Guptill isn't worth his place in the side, however the argument here seems to indicate people rate him much more highly than I do.

I say "we" because you're the only one arguing with any one of this group of NZ cricket fans. Astonishingly, hardly any of us agree on everything. But we're happy to make concessions.
Most of us rate Guptill in ODI cricket based on nearly 80 ODI matches and exceptional stats.
Most of us don't rate Guptill at all in test match cricket, based on a 30 test career in which he was one of the worst batsmen to play for us during a period in which we had a lot of bad batsmen.

You then talk about listen and concession, You talk about Wagner as if he hasn't proven something already at test, despite his figures being highly comparable with pretty much every bowler not named Boult, Martin or Bond in their first few seasons and completely disregard the point of which wickets he's taken and when he's taken them. Which indicates to me you're not willing to "concede" and listen, which indicates to me you're not interested in discussion if it contrasts to your viewpoint.

What, exactly has he proven in test match cricket? 1 5 for against Bangladesh, which was a good performance no doubt but it's not enough to be a proven performer. In the most recent series he's been out bowled by an all rounder.

It's great that you think he might turn things around, and I really hope he does. That would be fantastic.

I'm not going to make it personal, but you don't know the difference between swing and seam - not if you think Boult has an inswinger that he can control or if you think Milne has any idea if the ball is going to swing or not when he bowls it.

I freely admitted that Boult's in swinger is inconsistent.

As for Milne, he's been holding the ball for out swingers in domestic cricket and in swingers in limited overs. Of course he doesn't "know" that it's going to swing. Even Steyn doesn't know that it's going to swing. He can set it up to give it every chance to swing though. His seam position will likely never be as good as Southee or Boult's but he's not a pure swing bowler anyway so it doesn't matter.

Well and truly sick of this, tbh.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Blocky - The informed dentist

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Jono - will you be painting your torso with Kohli's face for the duration of the Test match?

 

[Dan]

I'll change topic by letting everyone know, despite no one caring, that I just booked my accommodation for the Wellington test

I am looking at heading over for the game as well. Finding suitably cheap accommodation a sticking point at the moment.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

I am looking at heading over for the game as well. Finding suitably cheap accommodation a sticking point at the moment.

How long are you staying for? I might be able to provide you a bed for the night if it's just you heading over. Then it'd be free.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Awaiting Jono's reaction

 

[Jono]

wac etc etc.

I am looking at heading over for the game as well. Finding suitably cheap accommodation a sticking point at the moment.

Valentine's Day weekend is the reason for that. Managed to somehow convince my gf that we can do a trip to NZ for Valentine's Day, and she'll come up after the tests.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Awaiting Jono's reaction

I live in a nice house, not a doss house.

Though more seriously, I thought Jono had already lined up accommodation otherwise my post is pretty rude.

 

[Dan]

How long are you staying for? I might be able to provide you a bed for the night if it's just you heading over. Then it'd be free.

Looking at flying across on the 13th, heading back on the 16th.

If you're offering, I'd definitely consider it; at the moment I'm looking at renting a room via airbnb anyway.

 

[Hurricane]

Looking at flying across on the 13th, heading back on the 16th.

If you're offering, I'd definitely consider it; at the moment I'm looking at renting a room via airbnb anyway.

@Jono - as I indicated to Dan in the crabs subbie I will probably take a day off to join you and Dan at the test. I just need to find out if I can get the time off first and will message you both next week.

Thanks

Hurricane

 

[Prince EWS]

Weird thread so far, must be said. And what the **** is Sledger doing in here? GTFO.

I'll change topic by letting everyone know, despite no one caring, that I just booked my accommodation for the Wellington test

I care ftr.

 

[Prince EWS]

Blocky is like the anti-Cribb when it comes to Wagner. I don't think he's a swing bowler at all; he's a bit like Johnson in that he's at his best when he's not really worrying about swing and the odd one just randomly goes anyway. His seam presentation is often terrible and when he seems to be actively attempting to pitch it up and swing it, he more than often just loses it. I had this argument with a few of the guys who are now on the other side of the Wagner-swing-fence of the argument with Blocky, such polar opposite are our opinions on the guy.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Looking at flying across on the 13th, heading back on the 16th.

If you're offering, I'd definitely consider it; at the moment I'm looking at renting a room via airbnb anyway.

I'm unofficially offering. But if you're interested, I'd have to clear it with the missus first. She is a bit sceptical of "internet weirdos", seeing as she's met Smudge before.

 

[Prensel]

Bad loss to WI in the last ODI, I heard this guy Niel Wagner is pretty good, should get him in the ODI team.

 

[Howsie]

No clue what you're talking about.

Bloody dead ringer for him, he's a dip**** just like yourself.

 

[Dan]

he's a dip**** just like yourself.

No.

General warning to all - I don't care how frustrating you find arguing with someone to be, or how much you disagree with them, or how nonsensical you believe their posts to be; personal attacks are not acceptable under any circumstances. Play the post, not the poster.

[/mod]

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

No.

General warning to all - I don't care how frustrating you find arguing with someone to be, or how much you disagree with them, or how nonsensical you believe their posts to be; personal attacks are not acceptable under any circumstances. Play the post, not the poster.

[/mod]

Pull this **** at chez Heef and I'll have you in the garden on weeding duty.