***Official*** England in New Zealand series 2013

[Zinzan]

Lol @ everyone reactions to Scaly comments about Ronchi being in the Test side. Clearly it's just his latest hobby-horse to insinuate that just because an Australian FC player has moved to NZ, he must be an automatic selection, in spite of the fact he wouldn't have seen him play here. The reality is there is no place in the test side for Ronchi atm, even if our batting depth is paper-thin ( and nobody is disputing that). Unless people are suggesting he's a better option than Watling, I can't see where he would fit in.

Anyways, I've thought about it and while the following might appear a bit radical, this is the side I think would give us the best chance to compete against England.

1)Rutherford (we need a left hander and Guptill & Flynn need a rest)
2) McCullum ( yes opening, we have enough strength in the middle & its about the team)
3)Brownlie/Watling
4)Taylor
5)Ryder
6)Watling/Brownlie
7) Vettori
8) Southee
9) Gillespie
10) Boult
11) McClenaghan

12th man Bracewell/Milne

I know it's a big call to leave Bracewell out, but he really hasn't produced much since Hobart and Gillespie if fit is a genuine wicket-taker. It does lengthen our tail somewhat, but then again when was the last time Bracewell scored test runs?

McClenaghan has shown enough in the short-form to suggest he's worth trying. A solid lad who hits the wicket hard and gets swing and seam.

I genuinely believe that bowling attack is our best chance of taking 20 wickets. Vettori to restrict at one end and all out attack from attacking seamers at the other.

Milne is the other consideration, but happy to settle for the above for now.

 

[hendrix]

McClenaghan has shown enough in the short-form to suggest he's worth trying. A solid lad who hits the wicket hard and gets swing and seam.

It's a bigger call to leave Williamson (and Ryder) out, as well as to have Vettori bat 7.

 

[Flem274*]

Zinzan I see your crazy team and raise you

McCullum
Vettori
Williamson
Taylor
Ryder
Brownlie
Watling
4 quicks

#backto2011debates

 

[hendrix]

Ideal 11 for me:

1. McCullum
2. Watling
3. Ryder
4. Taylor
5. Brownlie
6. Williamson
7. Ronchi
8. Vettori
9. Bracewell
10. Southee
11. Boult

 

[Prensel]

Zinzan I see your crazy team and raise you

McCullum
Vettori
Williamson
Taylor
Ryder
Brownlie
Watling
4 quicks

#backto2011debates

I like this

 

[Zinzan]

It's a bigger call to leave Williamson (and Ryder) out, as well as to have Vettori bat 7.

Yeah, It wasn't easy leaving Williamson out, but who would bat him ahead of in slots 3-6 assuming you're not suggesting he opens?

What about Ryder? I did include him and what's wrong with Vettori at 7?

 

[Zinzan]

Zinzan I see your crazy team and raise you

McCullum
Vettori
Williamson
Taylor
Ryder
Brownlie
Watling
4 quicks

#backto2011debates

Lol, the more I laugh about you opening with Vettori, the more I think I actually like it

 

[Zinzan]

Ideal 11 for me:

1. McCullum
2. Watling
3. Ryder
4. Taylor
5. Brownlie
6. Williamson
7. Ronchi
8. Vettori
9. Bracewell
10. Southee
11. Boult

Way to screw with Watlings head ! Just when he's publicly stated he feels more comfortable & confidence about his batting as a keeper-batsman, let's strip him of the gloves and make him an specialist opener again.

 

[Zinzan]

^ Also, if people think Williamson was a bit too loose for 3, batting Jesse there worries me even more so.

 

[Flem274*]

Srsly though if Vettori comes in and bowls like he did last summer it's time for him to move up the order if he's to play. There's being a containing bowler and then there's being a Franklin with a lower/moderate rpo. Me suggesting him to open was a light hearted prod but I still think if anyone has the sheer determination to make the move to open it is him.

Of the realistic opening options I'd either just stick with Guptill and at least keep his world class fielding, or I'd tell Flynn to open for ND and hope he belts it then pick him, even though I think he won't be a crash hot opener.

I don't think the younger openers are ready, I don't think Watling can do it and I don't think Fulton will succeed either, though obvz I hope I'm wrong and I usually am so good signs!

Or we could take the piss and get someone up there to either block it or slog it, and provide something in another department. Tastle, NcCullum etc.

Or Ronchi could open I guess.

In the meantime we need to kidnap Turner, Wright and Rigor and start cloning.

 

[Zinzan]

Srsly though if Vettori comes in and bowls like he did last summer it's time for him to move up the order if he's to play. There's being a containing bowler and then there's being a Franklin with a lower/moderate rpo. .

But that's the whole point of having the luxury of a keeper who can bat in the top 6, we can afford to have Vettori at 7 and still have 4 genuine seamers. I know Vettori isn't much of striker, but his ability to keep things tight is valuable in tests and he still easily the best spinner in the country. I can't remember the last time he went north of 3.5 per over in a test match.

 

[Mike5181]

Vettori and Ronchi aren't openers, and nor will they be considered options. Let's be realistic here. Flynn was an option there, but he played himself out of the mix by playing even worse than Guptill. Hesson confirmed Watling's not going to be moving up the order, so he's out. That leaves Guptill, Fulton, Rutherford, and Raval as options. With those options, I'm sticking with Guptill. Has anyone actually heard any sort of update on Vettori? Last I heard he was reluctant to make the three-test England series his comeback target. That potentially throws Bruce Martin in the mix after Patel's dire performances over in South Africa.

 

[Zinzan]

Vettori and Ronchi aren't openers, and nor will they be considered options. Let's be realistic here. Flynn was an option there, but he played himself out of mix by playing even worse than Guptill. Hesson confirmed Watling's not going to be moving up the order, so he's out. That leaves Guptill, Fulton, Rutherford, and Raval as options. With those options, I'm sticking with Guptill. Has anyone actually heard any sort of update on Vettori? Last I heard he was reluctant to make the three-test England series his comeback target. That potentially throws Bruce Martin in the mix after Patel's dire performances over in South Africa.

I haven't heard anything about Vettori's health since the end of last last month. I do hope he's ready for England.

 

[wellAlbidarned]

Let's be realistic here. .

You've lost me there

 

[Bahnz]

On Adam Milne, it seems fairly likely that he won't play again this season as he's developed shin splints.

 

[Zinzan]

On Adam Milne, it seems fairly likely that he won't play again this season as he's developed shin splints.

Disappointing to hear that. I still can't get that brute of a delivery he dismissed Sangakkara with in SL out of my mind.

 

[Mike5181]

On Adam Milne, it seems fairly likely that he won't play again this season as he's developed shin splints.

Do you think CD will put up with this much longer? Having Milne, Wheeler, and Small constantly in/out of your squad isn't exactly ideal.

 

[Kippax]

Lol @ everyone reactions to Scaly comments about Ronchi being in the Test side. Clearly it's just his latest hobby-horse to insinuate that just because an Australian FC player has moved to NZ, he must be an automatic selection, in spite of the fact he wouldn't have seen him play here. The reality is there is no place in the test side for Ronchi atm, even if our batting depth is paper-thin ( and nobody is disputing that). Unless people are suggesting he's a better option than Watling, I can't see where he would fit in.

Everyone should spend 30 mins watching Rutherford in FC before the call for him tbh. Just such a cast, crude, far from test standard player. Not preferring the output of Watling/Ronchi over Rutherford/Watling will be a surefire taste one day.

BEWARE THE INJURED BATSMAN - Hamish Rutherford double hundred.wmv - YouTube

Hamish Rutherford, 99 vs. India A - YouTube

 

[Howsie]

Arghhhh, Watling isn't an opening batsmen ffs. He's terrible, always has been and always will be. I mean do you think it was a coincidence that when he filled in for Flynn during the Windies tour that he went back to looking like an absolute muppet, feet going nowhere and bat a mile away from the body. Leave him where he is, he's been one of New Zealand's best cricketers since taking up the gloves, why would you attempt to change him back into a below average opening batsmen again? Especially after we just went through the mess that was Hopkins, Young and Van Wyk.

You want to turn someone into a test match opener, go back to Flynn, at least he has the game for it.

 

[Kippax]

Flynn's got more of an ingrained ND short-termism to his play tbh, Reminds me of golfers I've known who're on the range 10 hours a day tweaking swing mechanics, because shaving shots off their score with better shot selection and course management is a bit pretentious and beyond their scope.

Don't underestimate just how tentative and boyish Watling's initial effort was. The fact he's actually won some plaudits from a tough crowd and the knowledge there's a stronger team to follow makes him at least a better option than Guptill and Rutherford, which is what I'm after.